Technical Passing gear from neutral to first is becoming difficult

[Zardo]

At standstill, I sometimes have to "juggle" the gear lever between 1st, 2nd, and 1st again with the motor idling to get 1st gear engaged,while pressing the clutch all the way down, which doesn't help.

It's a hydraulic clutch.

The brake/clutch fluid is original since late 2010 and has never been touched.

Is it the fluid or could there be air in the system? Something else? Braking is fine.

 

[Zardo]

Update:

the problem seems to get worse. I had this car since 11 years and put 200 000 km on the clock. Stopped at a traffic light, putting it in 2nd (which is easy to do) and then going back to 1st gear does not always help. If the car is on a downward slope, letting it roll for half a turn of wheels and then engaging 1 st often helps, even if I had to stop again. I believe the problem progressively became worse during the last 6 months, which means during the last 10 000 km.

I read some posts on the forum, the discussion goes like: maybe a bearing issue (clutch bearing?), maybe a synchro issue. I am not sure what it is.

This car has a hydraulic clutch.

Before buying the Abarth in 2011, I did drive a Fiat Bravo S, from 1996 to 2011, that car had a mechanical clutch. With the mechanical clutch, it also became difficult to engage first gear when it had about 160 000 km on the clock. I found the clutch cable to have some slack and tightened the play several times over the years until the clutch failed completely at about 250 000 km. The pedal started pumping by itself, first only when pressed and later all the time, as something must have broken inside the clutch.

I find it rather annoying that the clutch of my APE now apparently starts dying on me, too, without reason.

 

[Zardo]

I've decided to

1. Bleed the clutch
2. Change the transmission fluid
3. Reassess the situation.
4. If the problem is still there, replace the clutch slave cylinder

However, three methods for bleeding the clutch exist and I wonder which one is best.

1. Classic bleeding by pushing and pulling the clutch pedal, like so (better put a collecting bottle and tube on the nipple):



2. Applying 1 Bar of pressure using a pressurized bleeder bottle connected to the brake fluid reservoir

3. Connecting a vaccum pump to the bleeder nipple of the clutch

However, I wonder:

1. With the first method, how to prevent the entry of air in the circuit when pulling the pedal back

2. Is there a risk a 14 year old brake fluid reservoir will simply burst?

3. Does the vaccum pump really work on the clutch circuit or will it cause vapour lock?

And yes, I'll also bleed the four brakes.

Is there a best way to do it, like bleeding the most distant points first (two rears brakes, two front brakes, clutch) or should the brake circuits be respected (rear left, front right, rear right, front left, clutch)?

Any suggestions ?

 

[rmjbn1]

Hi, sorry you haven't had any replies. Maybe the standard Grande Punto section might give you a better chance of responses, if the cars aren't too different?

Your proposal sounds sensible. If it's still the original clutch and brake fluid, it would be good to replace. Same goes for the gearbox oil.

1. With the first method, how to prevent the entry of air in the circuit when pulling the pedal back

I use this technique and find it quite easy. Syringe old fluid out of the reservoir, top up with new, open bleed nipple, push pedal down, it will stay down, close bleed nipple, lift pedal and it will suck new fluid into the pipes. Repeat 10 or 12 times, make sure there is always fluid in the reservoir.

2. Is there a risk a 14 year old brake fluid reservoir will simply burst?

No I don't think so.

3. Does the vaccum pump really work on the clutch circuit or will it cause vapour lock?

Some people prefer the vacuum method with good results, I've never tried it.

And yes, I'll also bleed the four brakes.

Is there a best way to do it, like bleeding the most distant points first (two rears brakes, two front brakes, clutch) or should the brake circuits be respected (rear left, front right, rear right, front left, clutch)?

Yes, that's right, for the brakes start at the brake furthest from the master cylinder and finish closest. Some cars have separate reservoirs for brakes and clutch.

 

[Zardo]

Hi,

there isn’t really much space for getting to the clip in order to move the oil pipe back and thereby open the bleed tap of the clutch. What approach is best?

- removing the battery and it‘s tray in order to gain better acces?
- removing the big hose of the turbo air conduit?
- removing the coolant reservoir?
- with the car on a lift, reaching for the clip from below, maybe with a small mirror for visual control?
- all of the above ;-)

thx