Technical Panda 1.3 bad exhaust gas values

Tim0815

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Nov 19, 2021
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hi, i am trying to keep our older panda (2004 1.3 jtd 250k km) alive.
so far the timing chain is changed a new clutch installed and numerous smaller repairs done.
unfortunately it does not pass the emission test. the turbidity is too high.
I noticed that the egr is soiled from the outside. I have cleaned it during the timing chain repair and it could be moved freely
but i am not sure if the electrical part is working properly.
tomorrow the cylinders will be tested for compression and we want to check the crankcase ventilation.
do you think we are on the right track (egr or crankcase ventilation)? or do you have any suggestions as to what the problem could be?
 

koalar

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Oct 24, 2016
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we need more information to be able to make an educated guess

fault codes
emission results
ability to read live data


"turbidity is too high."


possibly actuator stuck !
 
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Tim0815

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thank you for the answers

turbohoses looking good!
there was P0401 not long ago but after deleting it did not come back.
yes i can read live data.
turbidity results where 2,5 m−1 and 1,25 would be allowed.
do you mean the egr actuator? ok, will remove it and check it for function i wanted to check the egr-cooler for leaks anyway.
 

koalar

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thank you for the answers

turbohoses looking good!
there was P0401 not long ago but after deleting it did not come back.
yes i can read live data.
turbidity results where 2,5 m−1 and 1,25 would be allowed.
do you mean the egr actuator? ok, will remove it and check it for function i wanted to check the egr-cooler for leaks anyway.

wastegate

common for them to stick causing over pressure. Hard to get to


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmeCtn7jGtk
 
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Tim0815

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i tested the wastegate via the vacuum hose. works flawlessly. the egr also seems to work.
 

koalar

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i tested the wastegate via the vacuum hose. works flawlessly. the egr also seems to work.

I was hoping someone else would jump in and help

its been over 15 years since I worked on a diesel fiat

as far as a know the EGR and the DPFE work together and if either isnt 100% throws up the P0401 error

whether this is the cause cause of your emissions failure I would be pure guessing and dont know how to test the DPFE

i could easily be wrong also
 
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Cinq999

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Does it drive okay? Any hesitation or stuttering from the engine?

A 2004 won't have a DPF fitted.....just EGR valve.

Mine got stuck open, and caused a lot of running issues, and blanked off actually lowers emissions.

How did you clean the valve? It's notoriously difficult to take off and replace.
 
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Tim0815

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yes, only EGR no DPF. engine starts and runs fine.
i cleaned the EGR with engine cleaner and then ground it in a little. removal was quick but reinstalling was almost painful.
 

Cinq999

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yes, only EGR no DPF. engine starts and runs fine.
i cleaned the EGR with engine cleaner and then ground it in a little. removal was quick but reinstalling was almost painful.

Did you remove the whole EGR valve, or just the top solenoid?

It's just it's normally a good 2-3 hour job to take the EGR completely off. I had to take the intake manifold off of mine, as I couldn't fit my hands in the space round the back of the engine.
 

Cinq999

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For reference, this is the complete EGR assembly.
 

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Tim0815

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I have removed the complete egr from under the car including cooler and solenoid.
next i will do a backflow test on the injectors. maybe one is leaking.
 

DaveMcT

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If the car has done a lot of gentle town driving it's possible for the inlet manifold to get clogged with soot. An endoscope camera would help to check if it's actually clogged.
 

RalphM

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Nov 26, 2020
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turbidity results where 2,5 m−1 and 1,25

I take it this is the turbo pressure in atmospheres if so was this foot to the floor under
load? if it was on tick over there's no way the turbo could get the pressure that high
so the sensor or maybe it's wiring or connectors must be suspect.
 

DaveMcT

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Turbidity in air means smoke or dust. In water it means sand or mud.

It's either not injecting properly (hopefully not) or its not getting enough air.

Check the air system end to end including manifold and EGR valve. If they are OK get the injectors and injection pressure checked.
 
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Tim0815

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now have values from maf and boost pressure.
the maf range goes from idle 1v to full load 4.2v or 250mg/l to 600mg/l.
the boost pressure goes from 2v to 3.3v or 950mbar to 1700mbar.
both had no signal runaways.
also i have now done a leak back test on the injectors.

idle 5min.
1) 45ml
2) 39ml
3) 32ml
4) 31ml

at 1500-2000 rpm 3min
1) 76ml
2) 49ml
3) 36ml
4) 36ml

what do you think of the values (sensors and injectors)?
I will now do a pressure test on all air hoses and then report back.
thanks again for your answers.
 
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