General Help! - V-Belt Pulley/Tensioner Location? (Pls see Photo)?

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General Help! - V-Belt Pulley/Tensioner Location? (Pls see Photo)?

Bolinhas899sx

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Hello good People.

So I'm on a demand to "restore" do some intensive care on my new cinquecento sx 899c 98. I'm a bit new to this, only simple stuff so far, so this is the first real project ?

So I'm doing a couple of Flushs on all the coolant, change the Thermostat and water pump.

But I searched everywhere (the forum and Google and I cannot find the location of the pulleys/Tensioner for the V-Belt (in order to change the water pump)

As you can see on the photos, the V-belt connects only to the Crankshaft, Alternator and Water pump. How do I do to remove the V-Belt and put it back on (after replacing the water pump)?!

Thank you everyone.
 

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Bolinhas899sx

Bolinhas899sx

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I've done some poor labeling to make it easy to any soul who can give me some enlightenment!.. ?
 

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RalphM

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I think it's by the alternator to
if you look at the bottom right pic it shows what may be 1 possibly 2 adjusters.
 
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Bolinhas899sx

Bolinhas899sx

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It is tensioned by the alternator.

Thank you very much David.

So that means in order to remove the belt i have to just unscrew the bolts that hold the alternator or remove the alternator it self?

And is it safe to remove the alternator with the V-Belt under tension?
 
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Bolinhas899sx

Bolinhas899sx

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I think it's by the alternator to
if you look at the bottom right pic it shows what may be 1 possibly 2 adjusters.

Here is a top view from the top, the only bolt i see that can disconnect is the alternator centre bolt.. Is this it?
 

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Bolinhas899sx

Bolinhas899sx

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I think I got it people..

I believe if i unscrew one of this bolts it will loose/ relief the tension.. Now which one.. Guess I will go by trial and error.. ?

Thank you very much everyone and sorry for the nubby question.
 

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I think this may be your alternator? https://www.micksgarage.com/g/alter...NGzaHH7SYu2poJvEYxPbod5vIyDL0plYaAn4_EALw_wcB

If so the top bolt hole is the pivot and the bottom one, being elongated, allows for the tensioning. Both bolts will need to be slackened Not removed, just slackened. Typically half to one turn will do. Once slack you should be able to swing the alternator along the sloted hole and slacken the belt. I have to say It looks slightly different to any I've seen before, and often they have 2 pivot holes, but the way it adjust is the same as most.
Hope that's helpful?
 
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Bolinhas899sx

Bolinhas899sx

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I think this may be your alternator? https://www.micksgarage.com/g/alter...NGzaHH7SYu2poJvEYxPbod5vIyDL0plYaAn4_EALw_wcB

If so the top bolt hole is the pivot and the bottom one, being elongated, allows for the tensioning. Both bolts will need to be slackened Not removed, just slackened. Typically half to one turn will do. Once slack you should be able to swing the alternator along the sloted hole and slacken the belt. I have to say It looks slightly different to any I've seen before, and often they have 2 pivot holes, but the way it adjust is the same as most.
Hope that's helpful?

Man that's it! You solved it! ?

The alternator is exactly that! And it has those two bolts, as you said.. One (the top) might be the pivot and the bottom the Tensioner, only unscrewing them a bit I can see which bolt correlates.

Bit that's it! It was giving me my head in looking and looking at it on a way to remove the belt.. ?

Thank you very much! ?
 
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Bolinhas899sx

Bolinhas899sx

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If you mean the bolt in the center of the pully no leave that alone,
Its hard to tell from the pics but the alternator usually pivots on two
bolts at the engine end then there's usually another bolt that acts to
hold it in the right position.

Have a look at this thread see if it helps

https://www.fiatforum.com/cinquecen...icento-1108-alternator-removal-refitting.html

That's it i discover those two bolts! Thanks to you guys! ?

I will make sure i don't touch that centre bolt! ?
 
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Bolinhas899sx

Bolinhas899sx

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The complication with changing the Aux belt on the 899 is the TDC sensor. It traps the belt.
So you either need to move/remove the sensor itself (or it’s mounting bracket) or remove the crank pulley.

Oh I see David.. ?

I will look closely tomorrow in daylight for that TDC sensor.. So far it looked quite straightforward removing the belt, once I figured it out where the Tensioner was.. But i will look tomorrow and post a pic (if I find it.. ?

Thanks once again ?
 
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The complication with changing the Aux belt on the 899 is the TDC sensor. It traps the belt.
So you either need to move/remove the sensor itself (or it’s mounting bracket) or remove the crank pulley.
Now you mention this I remember removing the bottom pulley on Felicity (1992 Panda Parade) to facilitate changing the fan belt. - I did try the sensor but it was not for moving so I went with the pulley. Bolinhas, be aware the pulley should be refitted with the little "pip" on the timing belt sprocket lining up with the small hole in the pulley. Nothing to worry about if you know about this but if you put it on in a different position it will confuse the engine ECU about when it should be firing the spark plugs!
 
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Bolinhas899sx

Bolinhas899sx

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Now you mention this I remember removing the bottom pulley on Felicity (1992 Panda Parade) to facilitate changing the fan belt. - I did try the sensor but it was not for moving so I went with the pulley. Bolinhas, be aware the pulley should be refitted with the little "pip" on the timing belt sprocket lining up with the small hole in the pulley. Nothing to worry about if you know about this but if you put it on in a different position it will confuse the engine ECU about when it should be firing the spark plugs!

No I wasn't aware of this.. Thank you very much!

So by the "pip".. You mean on the alternator.. Where the bolt to untension the belt, there is a mark where the stripe on the new belt should line up?

Thank you very much!
I'm really learning loads!! I love this car, and want to do all this jobs myself for a simple reason (want them to be done properly, not be ripped of by garages and to have the pleasure of fixing it myself) but need your help.. ?
 
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No I wasn't aware of this.. Thank you very much!

So by the "pip".. You mean on the alternator.. Where the bolt to untension the belt, there is a mark where the stripe on the new belt should line up?

Thank you very much!
I'm really learning loads!! I love this car, and want to do all this jobs myself for a simple reason (want them to be done properly, not be ripped of by garages and to have the pleasure of fixing it myself) but need your help.. ?

I believe Jock was referring to this on the FIRE engine crank pulley..

Not the Alternator

https://www.fiatforum.com/panda-guides/437184-panda-8-valve-cambelt-change.html?p=4160027

See the 1st image :
1 bolt.. 2 empty bolt holes and a tiny hole (for the pip)
 
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Bolinhas899sx

Bolinhas899sx

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I believe Jock was referring to this on the FIRE engine crank pulley..

Not the Alternator

https://www.fiatforum.com/panda-guides/437184-panda-8-valve-cambelt-change.html?p=4160027

See the 1st image :
1 bolt.. 2 empty bolt holes and a tiny hole (for the pip)

So as mine tension of the belt is done by the alternator i won't need to worry about this?

Or is there a specific direction / way my belt has to be fitted?

I was going to unscrew a litte the bolt on the alternator, the belt would come off and then fit the new tension the belt by putting the alternator on the original position and them tight the bolt on the alternator. Am. I doing this Wright? Or does the belt need to at a specific position?
 
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Am. I doing this Wright? Or does the belt need to at a specific position?[/QUOTE]
Hi

I am not super familiar with the 899 motor..never owned one.. but I had a 903 panda 25 years ago..

But All alternators are driven by a basic belt.. linking engine and 'generator'

There is no element of 'timing'

You just need to ensure it is Tensioned correctly :)
 
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No, nothing to do with the alternator. I'm talking about the bottom (crankshaft) pulley. This is the pulley that drives the auxiliary (alternator) belt. The crank angle sensor uses the serrated pattern on the outside of this pulley to determine crankshaft position so the ECU can command the plugs to fire at the correct time. This pulley is bolted onto the front of the bottom sprocket (the toothed wheel that drives the Timing belt) with 3 bolts which are equally spaced - so it could be put on in 3 different positions, only one of which would be correct and let the engine run.

To make sure it goes on in the correct position there is a wee raised "pip" on the front face of the sprocket - you can see it here in the seventh picture down at about 2 o'clock on the front of the sprocket : https://www.fiatforum.com/panda/459903-beckys-timing-belt-ongoing-saga.html?459903=#post4338582 and the aux belt pulley has a wee hole in it which you have to make sure is lined up over this "PIP" before you put the bolts in. Because the "pip" is quite small it has been done that the pulley is not put on in the right way. Of course because the pulley can't then seat properly against the sprocket it will wobble when the engine is turned over, but of course the engine won't run because the plugs are then being fired at the wrong times.

PS Sorry, I'm a bit zonked out after going 6.30 am to 7.00 pm yesterday with my wee grandson! Completely missed that Charlie had already explained it all! DOH! Think I'd better have a nice strong coffee and take a walk!
 
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Bolinhas899sx

Bolinhas899sx

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No, nothing to do with the alternator. I'm talking about the bottom (crankshaft) pulley. This is the pulley that drives the auxiliary (alternator) belt. The crank angle sensor uses the serrated pattern on the outside of this pulley to determine crankshaft position so the ECU can command the plugs to fire at the correct time. This pulley is bolted onto the front of the bottom sprocket (the toothed wheel that drives the Timing belt) with 3 bolts which are equally spaced - so it could be put on in 3 different positions, only one of which would be correct and let the engine run.

To make sure it goes on in the correct position there is a wee raised "pip" on the front face of the sprocket - you can see it here in the seventh picture down at about 2 o'clock on the front of the sprocket : https://www.fiatforum.com/panda/459903-beckys-timing-belt-ongoing-saga.html?459903=#post4338582 and the aux belt pulley has a wee hole in it which you have to make sure is lined up over this "PIP" before you put the bolts in. Because the "pip" is quite small it has been done that the pulley is not put on in the right way. Of course because the pulley can't then seat properly against the sprocket it will wobble when the engine is turned over, but of course the engine won't run because the plugs are then being fired at the wrong times.

PS Sorry, I'm a bit zonked out after going 6.30 am to 7.00 pm yesterday with my wee grandson! Completely missed that Charlie had already explained it all! DOH! Think I'd better have a nice strong coffee and take a walk!

Would this still apply to my cinquecento 899c sx?

As I have no Pulley.. Only the alternator.. And my belt is different from the picture you directed me.. I have a V-Belt.

Please see the photos..

As you can see I don't have the "pip".. I only have 7 holes on the top of the crankshaft wheel.. Anyone knows what they are for? Just design or is this alignment of the V-Belt?
 

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