FIAT - so big rubbish ???

[Diwiak]

I'm always thinking about it, I was driving and checking a lot of cars, especialy FIAT(also IVECO and AR as part of)still got serious problems - electronics(tell me about airbag control light ), bearings(on IVECO after 60Kmiles replaced all the 4 also 5th on differential), again electronics, faulty starting of engine, handbrake shoes replaced twice in 80Kmiles, AR 156 1.6TS got serious problems with engine management, starter gone, immobiliser gone, variator gone, now again with Cinq, leads gone, coil packs gone...and lot of other stuff..I think after some chat and reading forums that every second italian car is faulty...

-What the f**k is wrong ???? Italians, (or polish), crappy, cheap materials, stupid staff/drunken staff in factories... Or what???

Can anybody answer me ????? Why on other cars coil packs and leads can work till engine is gone, but on fiat are gone after 40-50Kmiles?? Why there's still airbag control light on, after 4time repairing in IVECO official service??

It's such shame, because Italians are making nicest cars ever, but so so crappy...

 

[dan-the-man]

If the airbag light is still on afetr the 4th time then obviously they haven't fixed it properly

leads should be replaced around every 12k on ANY car not 40-50k.

When I bought a FIAT I knew I wouldn't get reliability but I got a much better looking car than most others on the road, plus I got it cheap as well so the amount I spent on the car and repair bills is still cheaper than getting a different make with similar spec/engine etc.

Also it's not just FIAT's and AR that have problems

 

[Biz]

i drove my 1990 MK2 Uno Turbo (From 74,000 miles to 80,000 miles) with only:

Not my fault:
Clutch master cylinder failure (I didnt take note of the signs of wear, the clutch pedel stopped halfway down its stroke)
Valve stem seals and turbo oil seals (Just general wear IMO)

My fault (I was yound ans stupid,lol):
Killed the turbo due to overboosting (cracked housing)

At no other point in a year of running did i have a fault with it, i treated it like **** at times, really gave it a hiding and it just took it and drove on

Why i love em and respect them, any one who will stand infront of me ands says italians cant build **** is a moron, who:

A) probably hasent even picked up a tool in there lives
B) Never owned one
C) Goes on "Word of mouth"

Cant stand narrow minded people these days mate to be honest

 

[pinin__prestatyn]

Don't know if it's the same with other fiats, but the electrics in the coop are 99% German (BOSCH) including the coil packs.

 

[T14086]

I'm always thinking about it, I was driving and checking a lot of cars, especialy FIAT(also IVECO and AR as part of)still got serious problems - electronics(tell me about airbag control light ), bearings(on IVECO after 60Kmiles replaced all the 4 also 5th on differential), again electronics, faulty starting of engine, handbrake shoes replaced twice in 80Kmiles, AR 156 1.6TS got serious problems with engine management, starter gone, immobiliser gone, variator gone, now again with Cinq, leads gone, coil packs gone...and lot of other stuff..I think after some chat and reading forums that every second italian car is faulty...

-What the f**k is wrong ???? Italians, (or polish), crappy, cheap materials, stupid staff/drunken staff in factories... Or what???

Quick edit to above post...yes alot of electronic components are bosch,then again that isn't nessessarily a good thing.
Can anybody answer me ????? Why on other cars coil packs and leads can work till engine is gone, but on fiat are gone after 40-50Kmiles?? Why there's still airbag control light on, after 4time repairing in IVECO official service??

It's such shame, because Italians are making nicest cars ever, but so so crappy...

Diwiak......spend some time on other forums please then you will find out its not only Fiat that have problems also alot of people only post when there is a problem with their car,rarely to say their car is working fine.Therefore if you think how many Fiats have been sold compared to the amount of faults I think you will find that ratio quite good.

To answer some of your questions...citroen,BMW,Ford,peugeot all have airbag problems so its not just down to Fiat who are at least getting them sorted...how many doblos/ducatos/grande puntos/cromas/sedici/pandas ave airbag problems?.....not many infact I have came across 2 !!

To also answer yuor lead/coils problems...most lead problems are due to customer pulling of the lead & not using the correct tool.Ford have had more problems with coils than Fiat ever had!

Also fiat have less rust problems than most other manufactuers,have better trained technicians than most,have better diagnostic & back up than most & handle like a car should do and not like a plank of wood!

Alfas dont have serious engine management/immobiliser or starter problems,dont know where you got this information from? Timing belts..yeah crap I agree there!

 

[ChrisUK]

Don't know if it's the same with other fiats, but the electrics in the coop are 99% German (BOSCH) including the coil packs.

Yep its the same on the GP's well the sporting anyway .

Only weak thing I find about fiat is there interior trim quality their mechanics IMO are much better and in most cases above standard of of car manufacturers my GP is far supirior to my Fabia vRS which nearly killed my due to a faulty component.

The reason they are cheaper than everything else is that they don't have time to stop the production line to do quality checks etc this is why warranty's exist the only time when problems arrise is when you get cowboy / unscrupulous dealers wasting time and f**king people about. All you need is patience and persistance and you can have as a good car as everything else. Unfortunatly this is where the car industry is going due to the high demands for cars these days as people don't seem to be keeping them as long.

If you don't have patience then spend the extra £'s and buy a Rolls Royce where each car is hand built to strict tollerances and triple checked by 3 engineers.

 

[faster4_tec]

to be honest, fiat are a lot better now then they EVER have been before.

most of the faults you have listed there are either wear parts (brake shoe's, variator, coils (not wear,but they only last so long), leads etc.

my 8year old mk1 punto has never broken down, but things have worn out, its done 81,000 miles, and parts have been replaced BEFORE they were allowed to break. there fore I've had over 2years and 35,000miles of trouble free, cheap motoring.

other manufacturers just have as many problems.

we got a brand new audi a6 3.0quattro avant (long name I know) in 2001, and to be honest, it was a shed!! we didn't actually keep the original car as there was A LOT of problems with finish quality, so we got a replacement car, but that took 12 weeks, so we had a 1.0l seat arosa as a courtesy car in that time (a £7,500 car to replace a £34,000 car:yuck: ) for 12weeks.
when we eventually took delivary of the replacement audi, the finish was OK, but there was a problem with passenger airbag AND front seat airbags, AND front heated seats and the traction control.
took them a further 3weeks for fix all that.

so fiat is actually pretty good by other standards.

 

[Diwiak]

so, after some time, list of faults :

-ign. leads
-coil unit
Fixed

-halfshafts boots
Fixed for time

more to fix:
-thermostat
-temp. gauge(maybe)
-cv boots
-handbrake(some time it looks like it's stuck a bit)

and regular service at all

so, not so bad after 6 months of using and around 2500 miles done, for 500pounds car with 50k miles , and it didn't broke up somewhere on road - great car , just need fix again

 

[fingers99]

And when, may I ask, did they last build a car in Slovakia?

 

[oldskoolmk1unoturbo]

Diwiak - try servicing your car properly and it wont break down so often, and some parts do wear out and need replacing, it is a car afterall so what you moaning about? you expecting to drive it for free?!?!

 

[SkinzCinqSporting]

Don't know if it's the same with other fiats, but the electrics in the coop are 99% German (BOSCH) including the coil packs.

Cinqs are originally Magnetti Marelli

 

[serin]

pretty much all those things that need replacing are consumables?!

none of them are gonna make the car break down and cause you to miss something.

other cars fail, Ive already posted the problems that my mum had with other makes (Renault in particular) and problems that my Dad had with his (lots of VAG products)

Your on a Fiat forum, people come here to ask questions about what is wrong

why would you come on a forum to say "joy, my cars running fine..."

 

[The younger modder]

To be fair i find Fiat good, my sisters 2001 punto mk2 is a shed now, sounds rough as a dog and its slowly dying but its been in a crash twice (non fault) and has only ever been serviced properly once and gets thrashed every day, day in day out by a woman so i dont expect any different

i have a vag group Seat Arosa 53 reg and have had more problems in the time i have owned it than i have ever had with either my cinq sx or sporting but i still love it :yum: and have got used to it

my mum has a 54 reg Seat arosa exact same model as mine which weve had since new, the original car we refused as it was dented by the dealers when they were doing the delivery inspection :bang: so they got a replacement from the docks and to name a few probs its had a new engine at 1 year old, new shockers, clutch thrust bearing, engine mount, drivers seat as bracket snapped and new centre console as it was a competely different colour to the rest of the interior

fiat are wrongly criticsed by people who dont maintain/lok after cars or know nothing about cars same as renaults can be good if looked after

wayne

 

[sumplug]

If you want Coil pack problems, ask VW/Audi/Seat/Skoda owners. The 1.8 petrol was so bad, they did a world recall !! Same cars have huge Air flow sensor failure on the diesels. The diesel turbos are non repairable due to them being variable vanes. So its a brand new unit every time, and turbos go frequently. Same on Renaults. Turbos are a weak point. Ford have had numerous problems with electronics. Where do you start ??!!!
If your car is maintained properly by someone who knows what they are doing, then a Fiat is as reliable as any car out there.

Andy.

 

[jug]

When I bought a FIAT I knew I wouldn't get reliability but I got a much better looking car than most others on the road, plus I got it cheap as well so the amount I spent on the car and repair bills is still cheaper than getting a different make with similar spec/engine etc.

thats what it all boils down to for the consumer.

and as for why the 'niggling faults' are so persistent with fiat s.p.a. vehicles, that is due to their in-house approach to pretty much everything. they dont buy the electrics from companies that actually know how to make reliable components, instead they make thier own and save a shed load of money, allowing them to sell their cars at competitive prices and still make a small profit. the fact that this approach means they have to sell cars with shoddy electrics and badly fitting interior plastics does not appear to be a concern to them. but then again, fiat arent bmw or vw, so should it really be a concern?

if you see magneti marelli on something, be afraid!

my main concern is the move to total drive by wire. when italian electrics dictate what your breaks & steering are doing, millions of people will die.

 

[Diwiak]

my main concern is the move to total drive by wire. when italian electrics dictate what your breaks & steering are doing, millions of people will die.

that's exactly what I am talking about

 

[Diwiak]

And when, may I ask, did they last build a car in Slovakia?

I think thousands of vw's, kia's and peugeot's (at the moment) are leaving factories daily

 

[mountainmachine]

thats what it all boils down to for the consumer.

and as for why the 'niggling faults' are so persistent with fiat s.p.a. vehicles, that is due to their in-house approach to pretty much everything. they dont buy the electrics from companies that actually know how to make reliable components, instead they make thier own and save a shed load of money, allowing them to sell their cars at competitive prices and still make a small profit. the fact that this approach means they have to sell cars with shoddy electrics and badly fitting interior plastics does not appear to be a concern to them. but then again, fiat arent bmw or vw, so should it really be a concern?

if you see magneti marelli on something, be afraid!

my main concern is the move to total drive by wire. when italian electrics dictate what your breaks & steering are doing, millions of people will die.

Totally agree!

 

[maddogmorg]

don't magnetti make parts for the ferraris? i think they tend to be good for a short period. but soon go wrong.

 

[sumplug]

don't magnetti make parts for the ferraris? i think they tend to be good for a short period. but soon go wrong.

Magneti Marelli are one of the biggest auto electrical companies in the world, and they are used on many manufacturers. Peugeot and Citroen use the management system under the Weber-Marelli name. Alot of coils used by most Manufacturers are made by Marelli. Indeed the Cosworth cars ran Weber-Marelli IAW management, and they were deemed good.
It tends to be the wiring and poor connectors Fiat/Alfa use that cause the biggest problems, not the actual components. On Toyotas for example, they use Gold covered connectors for a very reliable connection, as gold does not deterioate. Ive cleaned hundreds of Fiat connectors that have turned green and lost the ability to pass current/voltage. When a connector is fitted, it needs to be sealed, that is airtight. Fiats are anything but !!

Andy.