General Fiat Bravo 1.2 Running Fault

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General Fiat Bravo 1.2 Running Fault

Roc

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Hi All
I have recently bought a low mileage 2001 Fiat Bravo 1.2 SX, which
has proved so-far to be reasonably well behaved apart from the horn which
seems to work when it feels like it – although a big hammer and some swearing should sort that issue out.
My only real observation is the car tends to follows no cold start protocol, straight from 1200rpm on starting to about 850 in about ten seconds, is this normal behaviour for this model – should this window of operation last longer?
I have given the car a mini service, replacing all serviceable parts, and even cleaned the throttle housing. The car still idles from cold in the same fashion.
Is this simply a case of its working okay, nothing to concern myself with, or is this like the Coolant Temperature Sensor not working as it should, it has never stalled or failed to start and the dash has shown no faults.
Any comments would be helpful.
 

jug

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it should take a lot longer than 10secs to settle at 85-rpm, this time of year it should be take few minutes.

on the 1.2 there are 2 coolant temp sensors, one for the gauge and one for the ecu, it sounds like the ecu's sensor is not working, which will waste fuel as well as giving you real problems starting when the weather gets colder.

do some tests by removing the sensor and comparing the results you get to the table in the attached image below. if in doubt replace it with a scrapyard part, or even a new one, they dont cost much. also check the wiring and connector, its in a vulnerable position and can rust.
 

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Roc

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Thank you Mr Jug sir, for taking the time to reply. :worship:
I will try your suggestion this weekend.
Please keep up the great work.
 
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Roc

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Over the weekend I swapped out the old Engine Coolant Temperature
Sensor for a new unit.
Its an Intermotor branded component, but is identical to the old unit.
After checking for corrosion on the car's electrical connector, I put everything back together.
Unfortunately the car behaves in the same fashion, its 'cold start window' is
about 10 seconds. It will start first time and seems to be happy to idle at 850rpm, 10 seconds later.
Fuel comsumption is quite good, spark plugs have a light brown deposit and the car does not hold back cold or hot.
Should I just chalk this one up to the car and move on?
Any comments would be helpful.
 

jug

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next on the list is a scrapyard throttle body (£10)

when you change it you must disconnect the battery before you touch anything, and do not reconnect the battery until everything is put back together.

i believe the throttle body from the 1.2 16v mk2 punto will also fit.
 
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Roc

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Unfortunately I will not be able to travel to my nearest scrap-yard which does only Fiat's, until the tail-end of next week, although I think £10
would be optimistic for a throttle body from that yard.
Would it be worthwhile removing and thoroughly cleaning the unit currently on the car, as this is something I maybe able to tackle this weekend?
Would the sheer fact of disconnecting the battery force the ECU to relearn its parameters, as its my understanding the ECU just has a problem fulfilling
the cold start/warm-up part of its programming, it seems to be reading the Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor 'correctly' otherwise the car would behave poorly?
Would a lazy/faulty throttle unit show up as hesitation or as erratic idling as these are issues the car does not suffer from?
Because its a bit of a journey to get to this particular scrap-yard are there any other parts I could pick up at the same time?
Thank you for taking the time to respond. (y)
 

jug

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a good clean with carb cleaner, WD40 or even contact cleaner is definately worth a try, but it sounds like your idle speed control actuator is not moving at all so it will probably need replacing or there is a wiring fault in its circuit.
 
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Roc

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Fortunately the scrap-yard I wanted to visit for a replacement Bravo
throttle body, did not have one in stock and needed me to bring
along my current one inorder to match it against the Punto's he did
have in stock......£35 if he could match it.:(
Plan B was to clean it a little more deeply in-situ, a can of carburettor
cleaner later and a night's rest.
She now seems to be be doing the Cold Start Protocol for a few minutes as
opposed to seconds.
Thanks Mr Jug and co for pointing me in the right direction, when I find the code for the radio, I will do the job properly.
 

The Sultan

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my cr does this
and a bravo 1.2 16v i drove last week at work did this
and come to think of it most cars i have driven from cold do this

i would say don't worry about it

it's injection after all if it's happy to run at 850 in 10 seconds leave it be
 
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jug

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come to think of it most cars i have driven from cold do this

i would say don't worry about it

it's injection after all if it's happy to run at 850 in 10 seconds leave it be

dont be silly, all cars that have an automatic choke should have an increased rpm for the first few minutes on a cold statrt. its important if you dont want to stall in harsh conditions, if you want to drive before the engine is fully warmed up, and if you want to demist the windows in a reasonable time.
 
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Roc

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On the surface I am inclined to sit on the fence gentlemen, initially I was happy to leave well alone. The car started first time and had a rock steady 'warm position' idle seconds later.
Unfortunately knowledge is a dangerous thing, and I did go down the road of 'this is what the car should do'.
Luckily the car responsed to Mr. Jugs suggestions, I am happy not to have
introduced a fault to the car, the threads of 'I have changed this and that' always worries me. Coming from a Ford Escort with it's own debit card to my bank account, I am very aware of problematic cars, although I do not want to make up a job. Its a fine line, that can become expensive.
Step away from the tools.
 
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