General Fiat 500 Suspension on 100hp 169

[koalar]

So the only difference in the beams seams to be a slot for ABS sensor. Which cost£394.80 But i can buy the same beam for £129.00 with no ABS slot. Just goes to show this world has gone nuts! Be drilling a hole and grinding a slot. Me Thinks View attachment 475218

As I said earlier in post 28

Buy the one for the diesel disc brakes

You were still have to cut the slot

No it's not the only difference you will have to remove a web that's in the way

Brake brackets are different but can be safely cable tied

Been done many times

 

[Baggey]

As I said earlier in post 28

Buy the one for the diesel disc brakes

You were still have to cut the slot

No it's not the only difference you will have to remove a web that's in the way

Brake brackets are different but can be safely cable tied

Been done many times

Do you have the part number for the panda diesel Disc Break beam.

 

[koalar]

Do you have the part number for the panda diesel Disc Break beam.

It's hard to go off part numbers as some adverts include both drum and drum/disc part numbers


Here an example of one that specifically mentions discs

It's one of these two number, I am guessing it's 50705127

Both are for the latter diesels but there's no info on eper as to differences between them, just a modification date

 

[Baggey]

Almost got the rear beam off. The RUST is unbelievable! There's been a lot of bolt snapping and grinding and blow torching. This car must of come from a flood area!?

What a bad design the lower cup mounts have no drainage hole so ill be putting in a drainage hole in and getting another set of rubber top mounts for the bottom. So theres no metal to metal.

 

[jrkitching]

The RUST is unbelievable!

Before investing too much time and money in this car, I'd suggest doing a borescope inspection inside the sills, and then possibly putting a cavity protection material into the box sections.

The galvanised bodyshell is known to be good for about fifteen years or so, but I'd be wary if you're planning to keep the car substantially beyond that. Once the galvanising fails, corrosion can set in quite rapidly.

It'd be a shame to put in all this effort and then have a failed MOT put it beyond economic repair.

And remember the warning about not jacking anywhere on the newly installed rear beam. When new, there was a warning sticker to that effect on the beam - most fell off before the first tyre change was due, with predictable consequences when the car met one of the discount tyre fitters.

 

[Baggey]

Before investing too much time and money in this car, I'd suggest doing a borescope inspection inside the sills, and then possibly putting a cavity protection material into the box sections.

The galvanised bodyshell is known to be good for about fifteen years or so, but I'd be wary if you're planning to keep the car substantially beyond that. Once the galvanising fails, corrosion can set in quite rapidly.

It'd be a shame to put in all this effort and then have a failed MOT put it beyond economic repair.

And remember the warning about not jacking anywhere on the newly installed rear beam. When new, there was a warning sticker to that effect on the beam - most fell off before the first tyre change was due, with predictable consequences when the car met one of the discount tyre fitters.

Well got some pics finally to show damage. I need to find out if this can be bought as a piece or will i need to fabricate myself its been 30 years since ive done stuff like this. Tried ringing a few scrapyards. It seems getting phone numbers is an impossibility these days. I finally got someone on the phone. "Your not allowed to take parts off and we cant grind anything out as its a fire hazzard"! What a FOOKING joke. This world surely is going mad. So can anyone hear tell me how to get this part or can someone hear who has a shell cut this bit out for me. Chassis arms are spotless!

When you say cavity protection. You mean waxoyl i presume. Im going to be pumping the car full of it as i want this car to last!

Also when garages charge £90 pound an hour for anything. It's a joke! Any repair becomes uneconomical unless you have the skill's yourself.

 

[koalar]

The bump stop cup is an easy repair

I showed a nicely repaired one a few months ago

Don't recognise the area in borascope image


The important area is inside the sill from the rear wheel arch to the jacking point

 

[Baggey]

The bump stop cup is an easy repair

I showed a nicely repaired one a few months ago

View attachment 475273

View attachment 475272


Don't recognise the area in borascope image


The important area is inside the sill from the rear wheel arch to the jacking point

Yeah but wear did you get the part from nice job!

 

[koalar]

Yeah but wear did you get the part from nice job!

Not my work

The cup is from a donar, as far as I know there isn't any available separately, there are for other fiats just not the panda

 

[Baggey]

Not my work

The cup is from a donar, as far as I know there isn't any available separately, there are for other fiats just not the panda

Thats what im after a donar just been looking at one for £250 but its no good. Scrap yards wont cut one out either mental! Dont even seem to be able to get one for a 500 either. I know theres the Ford Ka not tried that and i think theres another car an American version.

 

[jrkitching]

When you say cavity protection. You mean waxoyl i presume.

There are other more modern and less malodorous alternatives, some of which are considerably pricier, but waxoyl will do the job just fine.

 

[Baggey]

So been looking at the Ka alternative the cups can be bought for a £5. I may be doing a rear suspension mount conversion to a KA!? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/393527620517?fits=Car+Make:Ford&_skw=ford+ka+upper+rear+beam+suspension+donut&epid=1409715983&itmmeta=01K7PZ7H4KX40BMP1RMAZH6CKJ&hash=item5ba012f3a5:g:14UAAOSw8sphI7m0&itmprp=enc:AQAKAAABAFkggFvd1GGDu0w3yXCmi1eYnowm1jDUCZ7VpydI8GKD8NjDTImlfPU/aAq+ft+k6wwckCFoatJcP/bnVJVvMSFL+/atFQhhjfn66dFs3WF5lNv8dNQ5CNjRsV0KwQejMe87R6SBOqTsFdnKPoH3MBc0YJP/VJCGCvlvDEk5YfoBL7vE9PPoPSUy7kwtitISF66s3ayH0tqUv+s2khCPGM0W8O6jO8NI83rO4JaK7LDch6wOQf3K5YV+fjsj5VCwDAOI0xfEG+e2N1nmfpHMeuPiNfFuw0mzVSweqU6PozqaNMK2iaYE+f0lNAxv2+OJZ1WT9C1iRVVgBJ8IPk+Kc=|tkp:Bk9SR8ySnt-9Zg

Ahh after further research the ka has macphearson struts and a proper rear arch. So the stalectight dome rear mount obviously stops the spring from dropping out!? Now if the ford top mount could be welded with a sleeve through the suspension to attach to the car. It would need some sort off coil shock such as the types on a motor bike? or a bit of 20mm threaded rod bolted top and bottom to stop the spring from dropping out. hmm

Maybe ill just have to by a donar car!?

 

[irc]

That's for a mk1 Ka, not the RU8 Ka, which is based on the 500 (which is based on the Panda...)
Only things likely to be an easy swap between the mk1 and a Panda would be... tail light bulbs, at a guess.

 

[DaveMcT]

I would use a lanolin based treatment. Lanoguard is pricey but others are available. Chain saw bar oil thinned with white spirit is amazing for protecting bare metal. It's runny so soaks thought minor rust and over time it gels. The "runnyness" makes it less useful inside box sections.

Check the box section/floor inboard of the rear sill. They can go there before the sill bottoms rot out.

Any 1/2 decent scrap yard should let you angle grind the bump stop cones off a scrapped Panda (or 500) body. Ask nicely.

 

[jrkitching]

Chain saw bar oil thinned with white spirit is amazing for protecting bare metal

+1.

That's exactly what it's designed to do. It's incredibly sticky by design, though it gives me the opportunity to use that 'm' word again. Having spilt a small amount on the garage floor, it took ages for the smell to disappear.

 

[Baggey]

I would use a lanolin based treatment. Lanoguard is pricey but others are available. Chain saw bar oil thinned with white spirit is amazing for protecting bare metal. It's runny so soaks thought minor rust and over time it gels. The "runnyness" makes it less useful inside box sections.

Check the box section/floor inboard of the rear sill. They can go there before the sill bottoms rot out.

Any 1/2 decent scrap yard should let you angle grind the bump stop cones off a scrapped Panda (or 500) body. Ask nicely.

The Lanogard is very pricey. Ill be useing waxoyl hammerite. Ive used it on my T4 which has original body work still!

My inner rear sills and bottoms are very clean and solid. rear beam axle mounts etc.. all solid and good. Its almost like the rear beam on the car was a Friday afternoon job and never got painted properly. I have one tiny hole in upper osr arch were the bolts hold the arch protector nothing to worry about. Its just that stalektight rear mount that's shot. Don't understand really as you'd think the osr would off gone first? and the nsr.

I did speak to them on the phone and it was a lady . Maybe i should go in person and offer a Blowy

 

[Baggey]

Good results today got my part cutout of the donar car. Nothing caught on FIRE! So Here's some picy's of progress. Rear Beam arrived for the fiat 500. Beam has got an hoofing antiroll bar and twice as thick metal! Just need to cut a U slot's for the Abs sensor's.

Here's some photos of progress.

 

[koalar]

Why fit a 500

There 50 mm too wide

 

[jrkitching]

The Lanogard is very pricey. Ill be useing waxoyl

On an older car, I'd do the same.

If I were protecting a brand new car straight out of the factory, then I'd use one of the more premium products to maximise the lifespan of the protection.

I've found waxoyl tends to dry out & flake off with time, but we're talking 8yrs+. Probably less of an issue when used inside a box section.

Why fit a 500

There 50 mm too wide

Later OEM 500 beams have the stiffening bar, which improves the ride considerably, but you need the matching springs & shocks.

IIRC you can get away with it on a 1.1/1.2 Panda running 13" steelies, but my understanding is the extra width causes clearance problems with the stock 100HP wheel/tyre combination.

Supposedly isn't a problem with handling, but looks odd when viewed from certain angles; once seen, you can't unsee it!

Reminds me that, back in the day, the Renault 4 had a different wheelbase left & right.

 

[koalar]

Supposedly isn't a problem with handling, but looks odd when viewed from certain angles; once seen, you can't unsee it!

50mm at the rear on a light short car that already understeers, I am sure it will have a negative effect, how much I don't know

I did offered to set up some cones on an old airfield, when I had a standard panda, to compare, and swap wheels and tyres over for a fair comparison

If you drive well within its limit you will see no difference

But at the limit It will understeer more in the dry, and more likely to swap end in the wet

If your tuning a go-cart for a wet track you loose the rear wheels on the axle and move them inwards

Disc axles are now readily available for little cost, yes they need a small modification to fit the 100hp 10 minutes max if you have the correct tools

As of today under £200 including shipping, last week I saw one for under £150

100hp axles are now available but they are roughly twice the cost

I don't see any advantage now to fit the wrong axle, unlike when the panda axles were unobtainable

But each to there own. People can do whatever they like to there own cars