Technical Doblo drive shafts- removal problem

[serenmor]

Hi, I am new to Fiats, having just bought a 2005 Doblo 1.3 diesel Multijet. I am having to replace the drive shafts, so I followed the usual sequence: undo the shaft nut, undo ball joints etc. I had no problem getting the outboard (ie roadwheel end) disconnected, and having done that I thought I was home and dry, and the gearbox end would just slide out. No chance! When I pulled the shaft out it parted company at the boot, so now I have a free drive shaft with the CV joints exposed, and the "cup" which holds the CV joint firmly stuck in the gearbox. This is the same on both shafts.
I have tried pulling the cup and levering it with a screwdriver end, to no avail, and I am scared of causing damage if I use too much force.

I am waiting for new drive shafts to arrive, so I don't know what the gearbox end looks like, but I am assuming the cup is part of the shaft and should come out easily, so what am I doing wrong? The cup on the left side goes straight into the gearbox and I can move it out a few millimetres, on the drivers side it is attached to a shaft which goes into the gearbox. On the driver side it seems firmly attached to this shaft.

I have changed many drive shafts (not on Fiats) and they all just slide out, so I am puzzled by this problem. Is it a Fiat quirk or am I doing something stupid? In desperation I am thinking of leaving the cups in place and exposing the CV joints on the new shafts, then inserting them into the old cups (as I said I don't yet know what the new ones look like.

Thanks in advance if you can help me out with this one.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

I'm not a Doblo man but we've had Pandas in the family for probably 40 years and now my older boy has a Punto - all petrol engined. The inner driveshaft joints on all these have a groove around the shaft with a "C" type expanding circlip in it which grips a similar groove in the diff spyder gear when the shaft is pushed fully home - you can't see any of this, it's inside the diff. As you've discovered, this circlip usually holds the inner joint shaft (which is splined) firmly into the diff. To remove you need to break the hold of the circlip by levering against the final drive casing and the back of the casting of the inner joint. Some people do it by using a drift against the inner joint casting and driving it away from the diff - same result just a different way of doing it. You need to apply a reasonably violent "snatch" to the lever (a big tyre lever works well, I have one about 18 inches long I use for this) or "hit" if you're using a punch and hammer. They can be quite stubborn to move. If it is reluctant to move try turning the shaft about a third of a turn and try again - sometimes the circlip can be slightly offset in the grooves and turning the shaft to a new position will often make it "slop" sideways a wee bit.

The circlip groove in the diff has a small chamfer on the edge of the groove and it causes the circlip to compress into the groove on the driveshaft joint as you apply a linear force to the joint some are a bit reluctant to compress. If you are levering, which is my usual method, the best technique is a vigorous quick "snatch" on the lever. A slowly increasing pull seldom gets the job done.

All the above relates to my experience with the Pandas but also some other makes of car I've worked on. Most likely the Doblo is going to be the same?

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Somewhere around twelve and a half minutes into this video it shows the chap levering out an inner joint. You'll notice the size of lever he's using. You're probably not going to do it with a typical DIY type screwdriver.

 

[serenmor]

Somewhere around twelve and a half minutes into this video it shows the chap levering out an inner joint. You'll notice the size of lever he's using. You're probably not going to do it with a typical DIY type screwdriver.

Thanks for your reply. I have seen the video you linked to, and I understand it, but I don't know if the Doblo is the same? I have tried a lever ( a crowbar) but there is nothing much there to lever onto, and the tool just slips without gripping anywhere.
One thing I forgot to mention in my first post was the presence of a "ring" surrounding the drive shaft as it enters the gearbox. On the passenger side this has 4 bolts keeping it in place, the one on the driver's side has three bolts. I don't know if it necessary to remove these to enable the drive shaft to be removed.
I have already used considerable force with the lever, despite the slipping, but I am afraid of causing damage if I've got it wrong. I suppose I will have to wait until the new drive shafts arrive, so I can take a look and see if they give me some clues.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Thanks for your reply. I have seen the video you linked to, and I understand it, but I don't know if the Doblo is the same? I have tried a lever ( a crowbar) but there is nothing much there to lever onto, and the tool just slips without gripping anywhere.
One thing I forgot to mention in my first post was the presence of a "ring" surrounding the drive shaft as it enters the gearbox. On the passenger side this has 4 bolts keeping it in place, the one on the driver's side has three bolts. I don't know if it necessary to remove these to enable the drive shaft to be removed.
I have already used considerable force with the lever, despite the slipping, but I am afraid of causing damage if I've got it wrong. I suppose I will have to wait until the new drive shafts arrive, so I can take a look and see if they give me some clues.

Good plan to wait for the new shafts because if they have the circlips on the end of the splined shaft then you know the old ones should just pop out if you shock them hard enough. Very rarely a circlip will dig into the edge of the groove and make removal very difficult. This is why I say to rotate the shaft - and give it a bit of a "wiggle" too - to encourage the circlip to take up a position centrally (not off centre if you can picture it?) relative to the centre line of the shaft.