Best car for passengers?

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Best car for passengers?

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I've just got back from hols. My kids are now teenagers /getting bigger and the Zafira has become an even bigger squeeze in the back, cue two hours of fights on the way home!
"Stop touching me!"
"Dad, tell child x to keep on their bit!"

etc, etc, etc.

I miss the Multipla!

What cars do people think have enough leg room and width for three people in the back? Given that most manufacturers have pulled out of people carriers for stupid SUV's, there doesn't seem to be much of a choice these days.

Most cars seem to have the "hump" of a middle seat and/or a "transmission" tunnel even though they're all front wheel drive.

I miss the Multipla!

Oh yeah, and I'm never considering a Renault or Citroen!
 
Oh yeah, and I'm never considering a Renault or Citroen!

Unfortunately the only not massive car that isn't an SUV that is still on sale today that has 3 full width seats across the rear is the Citroen C4 picasso/space tourer.

Peugeot 3008 is a similar deal inside if I recall correcty but trendy SUV thingy so ridiculously expensive even used as they are in demand.

Otherwise as I found when I was looking for cars recently spacious family cars that aren't SUVs are getting very thin on the ground and even if you find one..the chances are it won't have any clever folding or sliding seats or anything like that as they usually reserve those for the SUVs.
 
Oh yeah, and I'm never considering a Renault or Citroen!

To be fair I liked the Mk 4 Espace with 2.0 turbo petrol. It wasn't too "French" but did offer uber space. The only snag was the ridiculous clutch hydraulic line. There was no way I could get the master cylinder out so ended up clamping high pressure hose over the metal tubes with about 4 jubilee clips at each end. It worked for many thousands like that but really should never have failed in the first place.

Big snag today is their age. But saying that they are not silly money Just avoid the diesels. But saying THAT you dont want French.

How about one of these? Its a Vauxhall not another Renault (honest) ;)
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2006-Vau...204156?hash=item26385a5ffc:g:DmMAAOSwFAtejeeg
Whip out the back row of seats and you'll be carrying who-knows-what. Its been to the moon and will probably make the return journey as well.
 
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I do like the crew cab/minibus things. Brother in law just bought am 8 seater Merc' van. Lovely thing but freaking expensive. Still cheaper than a VW T5 though!!
 
I remember in the late 90s everyone running out to buy a people carrier, they were the car of choice if you were serious about being a “family man” so have one kid you’d better get yourself a 7 seater which to me at the time seemed incredibly wasteful, then times changed and people carriers have now been replaced with the small SUVs they have plenty of space front and back, they have an easy to get in and out of height and they are much more fuel efficient than the people carriers of old.

Honestly they are so popular because they are so useful, if you don’t like them and therefore don’t look at them you’re never going to know if they would actually suite your needs better than other cars that are available.

I remember one car that was extremely well designed for the family with built in booster seats and other features was the Toyota Corolla verso, ugly as sin but well designed for a family, not sure that they make them anymore and like anything the first generation was good but they tend to water down the design to save costs as a model gets older
 
Did you mean this one? - its a Yaris

1200px-2005_Toyota_Yaris_Verso_T_Spirit_1.3_Front.jpg


But it was competing with this
$_86.JPG
 
Did you mean this one? - its a Yaris

1200px-2005_Toyota_Yaris_Verso_T_Spirit_1.3_Front.jpg


But it was competing with this
$_86.JPG

No

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Corolla_Verso

The Corolla verso was a very well set up car for a family, it had things like the booster seats built into the back seat that other cars never had much better thought out than just making taller version of a family hatchback.

I used to know a guy who bought one new in circa 2005. Looking at my own link it seems it suffered the same fate as the multiple and they stopped making it in 2009.
 
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The Corolla was not especially ugly. I mentioned the others because it takes serious talent to make something so awful. But everyone seemed to be on the same game with the Skoda Roomster looking like a van had crashed into the back of a car. Even Merc had a small van MPV that few would be seen dead in.

The Fiat was praised for it's utility but the original Multipla could have been scaled up much in the way the 500 was scaled up. That might even have been a popular seller.
 
The only reason I remember that Corolla Exists is that my next door Neighbours son had one...he reversed it and it's towbar into my wifes Micra many years ago.

Otherwise not a car that sticks in the mind unless you've spent a day buffing it's paint of a back bumper. Oddly it left most of it's paint on the micra which then buffed off other than where the tow ball hit.
 
My problem is leg room and the middle "hump" in most back seats.

I'd get another estate car but they aren't designed for three in the back on a regular basis. I've driven loads of SUV for my job and find them pointless and not much different to the hatchback on which they are based a lot of the time. Unless I win the lotto and get a Discovery...

I would like 7 seats as I have three kids and two grandparents to ferry about. So I'm not buying one out of choice really but necessity.

C4 picasso looks the best but after my experience with French cars I'd be terrified everytime I took it out. I love Chrysler Voyagers too but they are all quite old now and see above for terror factor!
 
C4 picasso looks the best but after my experience with French cars I'd be terrified everytime I took it out. I love Chrysler Voyagers too but they are all quite old now and see above for terror factor!

It depends where in the life cycle of the car you're buying it, I'd not touch a 7-8 year old one with a long pole.

Something still in warranty then the risk is not that high of it leaving you high and dry.

We've had 2 modern Citroens over the last 6 years and mechanically/electrically they've never gone wrong. But I'd not happily hop into an old family bus one that's probably been maintained on a budget.

If it's less than 3 years and 60k miles at point of purchase it's 200 quid a year to maintain manufacturers warranty (I've literally looked this up today for ours!)

Otherwise you are looking at taxi spec commercials, so Dobbins, Scudos, Tourneos etc.
 
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Maybe a bit long in the tooth now, but a late Mazda5 might be an option? 7 seater but not a huge van.

It had some pretty clever seating arrangements, the middle seat can be moved completely out of the way, leaving a sort of 'corridor' to the rear. Only trouble then is you might have a fight on your hands over who gets the rear to themselves...

I think the Citroen C4 Pikachu is a good option too, as it is quite wide and the three rear seats slide and recline individually, so even three teens could surely find a way to share the space? Possibly.... Although I agree, all those electric toys put me off.

I think the Ford C-Max does something similar with its rear seats, but maybe not as spacious as the C4.

I always thought the Honda FR-V was an useful 3+3 concept too, with a middle rear seat that retreats into the boot, but getting old now.
 
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Bearing in mind we are talking about roominess here, the best we ever had was a 2.0 litre twin carb Austin Ambassador HL.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austi...n Ambassador is a,that had lacked a hatchback.

Although we also had a Renault 20
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renau...lt 20 (R20) and,Renault between 1975 and 1984.
which had very similar carrying capacity and was also incredibly comfortable but it had the small 1600cc engine and was grossly under powered which wasn't a problem on the motorways/dual carriageways but made it a pain if you were trying to make rapid progress on single carriageways (like when trying to make the ferry) - most had the larger 2 litre which was much more lively to drive. Spares were pricey too and certain things, being typically "French" in design, were a pain to work on.

Getting back to the Ambassador, our three kids had plenty of room in the back, often with camping gear packed in around them and the hatchback just seemed to go on swallowing everything we put in it - plenty of room for "emergency tools" too. Living in Edinburgh we did lots of long distance holidays down into the West Country and several times down into the Vandee region of France. It's hydragas suspension and armchair like seats gave a wonderful ride compared to almost anything else I've owned. Eventually I traded it in for a Vauxhall Astra Estate SRI 1.8 litre which was a much more interesting car to drive but not actually quite as roomy inside. I have very fond memories of the Ambassador, especially the fact that there was so much room around the engine, you could almost climb in beside it when doing some jobs! Although I had to sort out the gearbox when I bought it - got it for peanuts because of this - it then gave me very little trouble over the years I owned it but I always dreaded that I might need to dismantle the rear suspension because the big "fulcrum pins", on which the rear suspension arms were mounted, were seized completely solid in their housings. Luckily I never needed to touch them - Phew!
 
Austin/Rover cars were always very good on interior space. Almost Tardis like.

For suspension I loved the Citroen hydropneumatic system which also powered the steering and brakes. It got a bad reputation because the steel hydraulic pipes rusted and were a pain to fix OR the body rusted and the pipes gut in the way for repairs.

The Citroen C5 and C6 iused the system. There are not many C6 about so prices are holding up. But all are diesels and they have so many early noughties electronics they are likely to cost a fortune when things break.

Then again, just found this -
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Citroen-C5-tourer-exclusive/392911534908?hash=item5b7b5a3b3c:g:reoAAOSwjPtfOpTO
 
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For suspension I loved the Citroen hydropneumatic system which also powered the steering and brakes. It got a bad reputation because the steel hydraulic pipes rusted and were a pain to fix OR the body rusted and the pipes gut in the way for repairs.

The Citroen C5 and C6 iused the system. There are not many C6 about so prices are holding up. But all are diesels and they have so many early noughties electronics they are likely to cost a fortune when things break.

I always liked the look of the DS's. Way, way back we had one in the workshop which needed one of those brake pipes renewed - the boss gave me the job. Luckily I was running around in a Dyane at that time and had just done some of it's brake pipes so I knew that they were 3.5 mm diameter pipes (compared with the 3/16 inch (4.75 mm) stuff used on nearly everything else.

Because "everything" was hydraulically powered there were pipes running all over the place - quite daunting at first glance! I also knew that the flares were very different and needed different flaring tools to ours and used "O" ring seals too! My boss looked quite surprised (and impressed) when I came into his office/showroom and asked where I was to go to get the stuff needed to do the job. Did my "cred" a lot of good! Oh, and the fluid was mineral too not mixable with the stuff we stocked in our stores! - Called LHM if I remember? He was even more impressed when I told him I had a contact who would flare the ends on the pipes for us.

Citroen were very "different" cars to work on and many of my workmates would do almost anything to avoid being allocated one to work on. I remember being very surprised when doing the pipes on the Dyane to find they don't use flex brake hoses! Instead the pipe itself is wound round 3 or 4 times, in a coil - bit like a closed coil spring - inside the hollow pivot point of the suspension arm so the coil slightly tightens or loosens as the suspension goes up and down. A bit like how they used to coil metal fuel line on really old cars between the chassis and engine to minimize the chance of fracture. This was only on rear brakes of course because the fronts were mounted inboard on the gearbox so didn't have to accommodate the steering.

As you may know, but some may not, because the suspension on the DS was maintained by fluid pressure it would slowly sink to the ground overnight as the fluid leaked back to the reservoir (the quicker it settled the more problematic the suspension might be) When you returned to the car in the morning it would be virtually resting with it's floor on the road! Very alarming if you didn't know this was normal! On starting the engine the engine driven pump would cause the car to rise up to it's normal height as the pressure was restored. The fun bit was that there was a lever between the front seats which allowed you to almost double the height of the suspension for going over rough ground so, if you were so inclined, you could sit at traffic lights amusing yourself, and others around you, by making the car go up and down - it went up slowly but down quite impressively fast!

This "high" setting was used when a wheel needed to be changed (maybe because of a puncture). You simply set the lever to "high" and, once the car was at full height, put a stand under the jacking point and put the lever back to "low". The suspension would go down until the chassis contacted the stand and then the further contraction of the suspension lifted the wheel off the road. So no need of a conventional jack! I think they also advertised that you could drive around with one back wheel missing? But I never really saw the point of that?

A very good friend of mine, another mechanic so he should have known better, bought a cheap, well used, C5 estate but I never actually got a ride in it as it was always being "mended"!
 
I had a 1.9 BX Mk1 which had the "satellite" switches in a very 80's Star Wars style. But they worked very well indeed and I grew to like them. The hydraulics powered suspension, brakes and steering. Everything else was "normal". Body roll was semi active with the car cornering very flat yet still slipping over bumps as if they were not there. Steering and brakes were very precise but needed a very light touch and needed while to adjust your brain.

The BX was built lightweight which I think they over-did on the doors as they felt too light, though they were never a problem. Bonnet and rear hatch were a fibre reinforced plastic. Light but tough.
Today there seem to be a few diesels about (but they were clunky and the odd GTI (for a price). The 16V and 4x4 is extremely rare with prices to match.

Edit https://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C1258661 so perhaps not "too" bad. Maybe its the Covid effect.

13370770.png
 
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