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General And the third worst car in the UK is....

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General And the third worst car in the UK is....

PROV said:
What a load of tosh
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How is it tosh? :confused:

The results of the JD Power Surveys are calculated from surveys carried out on owners of the cars, not the Motoring Press or Motor Trade, so clearly owners of Bravo have spoken and judged it to be as bad as the results suggest.

You may not personally agree with the results, but that does not make them inaccurate.
 
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I didnt say inaccurate. How on earth can one persons views be compared with another?

Also on the reliability front, a German mag stripped their long termer (100k km IIRC) and found it one of the best made cars they had ever done.

Another point is that the scores given for all the cars are so close together if you look, that if these results were for exams they would pretty much all be A grades.

In a previous years JD power survey an Audi TT came above an Alfa 156 for practicality. A coupe with not enough space in the back for people to sit and a smaller boot scores higher than a 5 seat saloon with a larger boot. Says it all really.
 
I agree with what you say, what I dont agree with though is that its the 3rd worst car in the Uk.
 
Scrogg said:
Yep.

A league table based on nothing more than opinions will only ever be as accurate as the information provided by those taking the survey...

...and those that took the survey rated the Bravo as one of the worst cars in the UK.
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Perhaps more a reflection on the readers of What Car than it is on the Bravo then? ;)

You bought the car and you like it, what does the opinion of the faceless masses matter?
 
And Toyota/Lexus is still GOD??

p/s what do you call a dog who likes to roll over?
 
Take no notice... had x2 Fiats in our family in the last 7 years both have been excellent, both got bad press (Stilo which now has a new very happy young owner, 50,000 miles & my 1.9 Mjet GPS with 70,000 miles on it)
 
I'm on my fourth Fiat and would gladly have another. I am extremely happy with my B2, as I was with the B1, Tipo and Regatta.

My previous 3 Fiats were kept for 10 years, 9 years and 6 years. Who in their right mind keeps an unreliable car for that amount of time?
 
Scrogg said:
How is it tosh? :confused:

The results of the JD Power Surveys are calculated from surveys carried out on owners of the cars, not the Motoring Press or Motor Trade, so clearly owners of Bravo have spoken and judged it to be as bad as the results suggest.

You may not personally agree with the results, but that does not make them inaccurate.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't put a massive amount of faith in them either. In Auto Express' driver power survey the Bravo came in at 32nd place overall, 22nd best car for reliability!

You get bias too in the results psychologically and emotionally and in other ways. Marque expectations play a part too, so I'd take everything with a pinch of salt. Any surveys that disagree so much as the Bravo results do suggests perhaps issues there- did they make sure owners of the older model weren't answering?
 
PROV said:
I didnt say inaccurate. How on earth can one persons views be compared with another?
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Through a well written survey.

Yes, some people will rate cars more generously than others, but that margin of error applies to all the manufacturers.

Would I say my Bravo is one of the best cars on the market? No not at all.
The handling is OK, but I know there are better choices.
The performance and economy isn't bad but neither is it class leading.
The reliability hasn't been great, with major DPF issues that have been documented here, though since then it's been fine.
The interior is pretty nice, but again not the best out there.

Overall I'm reasonably happy with it, especially given the huge discount I got when buying it, but I wouldn't rave about it to friends....
 
So at the very least I would expect to see it score very highly on value for money. And looks (though subjective it is widely regarded as very good looking).

As for DPF issues, dont forget all other manufacturers have them (and other more serious issues, coil packs on VWs anyone?)

By the way I dont need convincing this or any other Fiat is no good, I know they are very underrated cars.
 
PROV said:
So at the very least I would expect to see it score very highly on value for money. And looks (though subjective it is widely regarded as very good looking).

As for DPF issues, dont forget all other manufacturers have them (and other more serious issues, coil packs on VWs anyone?)

By the way I dont need convincing this or any other Fiat is no good, I know they are very underrated cars.
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Well the VFM depends a lot on how good a discount people get - at list prices it compares pretty badly to some makes....

Yes, lots of makes have had DPF issues, but Fiat were amongst the worst there, and their attitude towards fixing it was abysmal.
Oh, and coilpacks haven't been a major problem on VAG engines for 7 years or more - it affected the 1.8Ts very badly at the time but has long since been fixed. :)
 
Reading on here some of the attitudes by dealers did seem poor, though wouldnt know as ours just belches out great clouds of smoke when booted :D.

The VAG thing I meant the injectors (IIRC). The diesel engine (last year or the year before) had a major issue. A work friend took it in to main dealer, who said his was 18th in line when the parts show up (took 9 weeks).
 
PROV said:
Also on the reliability front, a German mag stripped their long termer (100k km IIRC) and found it one of the best made cars they had ever done.
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Doesn't prove anything, unfortunately, as this is one car. It may have proven reliable just out of pure luck, but there's no luck involved in big numbers and statistics...I still love my Bravo though :D
 
The only people who respond to these surveys are those that are very happy or very unhappy.

When you look at the percentages between the top and bottoms cars they are very close which suggests that there is not much in it.

These surveys are misleading in the extreme until you actually think about what they are actually showing which is that most cars are fine, some are better than others but not by that much.

I dont know anyone who has had no trouble with their car whatsoever and I have had more than my share of Fiats and less than my share (so far) of problems. Would any other brand be as good, more than likely (unless it was a Renault ;-) ) would any others be better, perhaps but they would have a hard time, that doesnt mean people dont have trouble with their Bravos but its not as bad as people are making out.
 
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