General 500L Restoration

[Shepster998]

Hi all,
I'm restoring a 500L and I'm new to these cars in particular.
I've found some rot that needs cutting out behind the rear seat where the firewall, inner wheel arch and floor meets.

My main worry is that the mount, where the rear shock mounts to, also looks bad. I can't find reference for a replacement or repair panel for this. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

Also as the firewall is double-skinned is it better to replace the whole thing or try and weld in a patch (as only the top layer is bad).

 

[Franko500]

Don't think I have ever seen the rear floor cross member ever available.


There is a rear seat panel available.


https://www.motobambino.com/item.as...+made+out+of+double+skinned+metal+as+original
It all depends on how bad it is.
can you upload some photos?

 

[Shepster998]

Hi Sean, I couldn't figure out how to upload pics

 

[Shepster998]

Right, took me a while but figured it out. Please bear with me, I've restored minis before, but never a 500.
So you can see the firewall is in bad shape, heavily pitted and if I try and grind it back to clean metal it's just too thin to weld to. So I think my only option there is to replace the firewall. But as you can see the rot extends to the inner wheel arch and the shock absorber mount and the floor that goes over the top of that mount. I need to get a good look from underneath, but wanted to find out what the mounts where called - I haven't seen one either. I may be able to fabricate something if it's not too bad, but the shock absorber nuts are seized, so I'll probably have to cut them off and buy new shocks.

 

[Shepster998]

 

[Franko500]

Oh dear!
that's not nice


I haven't seen one that bad apart from the one I decided not to buy about 5 years ago.
Sadly none of those panels are available as far as I know.


I would suggest replace the fire wall. Although I don't know anyone who has completed that task yet.
You could ask Mark at Motobambino.
With the fire wall out you could have a new rear member made. it wont look original but at least you know its strong.
With the cross member and rear wall removed you should be able to repair the wheel house and those shock mounts are really thick so you could remove it and get it blasted or clean it up the best you can.
I will be interested to see how you do this one as its the only part of a 500 I haven't tackled.
Where abouts do you live?

 

[F123C]

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but the shock absorber nuts are seized, so I'll probably have to cut them off and buy new shocks.

You could use a 'Nut Splitter' or drill a couple of holes into one face of the nut or one hole down through the nut close to the shock stud, then split it with your cold chisel.

AL.

 

[Shepster998]

Thanks Sean, looks like I've got a bit of work ahead of me!! Thanks for the advice. I'm in Kent, near Bromley. Not too far from Ricambio.

 

[Shepster998]

Thanks Al, I've definitely give that a go

 

[Franko500]

Thanks Sean, looks like I've got a bit of work ahead of me!! Thanks for the advice. I'm in Kent, near Bromley. Not too far from Ricambio.

Just a word of warning, Ricambio is the highest priced Fiat 500 supplier in the world - I think.
Most forum members tend to purchase from:
Italy - Passione500
Germany - Axel Gerstl
Neverlands - Van der Lann
UK - motobambino
Mark at Motobambino will give you some discount over a certain value that will often be better than abroad depending on what postage costs will be.

 

[lazylobster]

Thanks Sean, looks like I've got a bit of work ahead of me!! Thanks for the advice. I'm in Kent, near Bromley. Not too far from Ricambio.

Rob, I’m also near Bromley. We met the other weekend at Westerham for cars and curry. i brought Valentina with me!

If you need to come up, take some measurements or look at mine for reference then drop me a line fella.

Cheers
Rob ( another one! )

 

[the hobbler]

Rob (lazylobster)---where about 'near Bromley' are you. For many years, in my yoof, I lived just round the corner from the West Wickham swimming pool. Bromley, Hayes (use to go for coffee and a chatter at 'Piper cars' bottom of Hayes high street) and Coney Hall were my happy motoring area. Now live just outside Chester, but lots of good memories of the area.

 

[lazylobster]

Morning Tom, I live in Chislehurst. Grew up in Foots Cray, near Sidcup. Moved around Kent a bit. But been living in Chislehurst for the last 9 years. Love it, good for the commute as I work in Marylebone :bang:

Love the trains and tubes me !

Cheers
Rob

 

[Shepster998]

Hey Rob!
I might take you up on that offer! Mine is actually a 500L - sorry I was still getting my head around the different variants when we met. The log book says it's a 500F, which I've since discovered is the same as an L. So it's slightly different to yours, but the measurements should be the same. I've got quite a journey ahead of me, but thankfully I learned how to mig weld, when I restored a mini. I'll need to whip out the engine and then may have to take the entire firewall and rear parcel shelf out as all is pretty bad. But first I'll have to asses the underside shock mounts etc.
I'll also let you know about another car meet at Botley Hill. Third Saturday of every month at 9am - really good mix of cars, well worth a visit. There's also one at the Woodmans on Ide Hill. Haven't been to that one but looks like a good turn out.

 

[telemike4]

My first 500 had the same rust. I am sure i have seen photos of a new bottom of the firewall grafted in. I was going to do this, cutting the thinner inside of the firewall back about 7cm higher so that the tar-like inner doesnt melt down into the weld.

The cross member is easily folded up as i recall.

My shock mounts were rusted through. I was going to replace them by welding in narrower cylinders, weld a flat plate across the top with a hole for the bolt, abd then brace them with triangular braces spaced at 90degrees around the perimeter (if that makes sense). Good luck.

 

[Shepster998]

Thanks for the advice. I think I'll try and repair it before I resort to taking the lot out as it's a massive job (I'd have to also take out the parcel shelf and the other panel that sits above the engine). I think I've decided to do pretty much do what you've said (at least give it a go first). The back of the firewall is actually fine, so if I can cut the bottom off the front, I stand a good chance of repairing it. It's quite a tricky shape to fabricate, however. But I think if I joggle the top of the repair, I can probably plug weld it from the back of the firewall (engine side). btw what is the black tar like stuff in between? Is it for noise reduction or fireproofing?

 

[fiat500]

Thanks for the advice. I think I'll try and repair it before I resort to taking the lot out as it's a massive job (I what is the black tar like stuff in between? Is it for noise reduction or fireproofing?

I think you're wise to avoid ripping out big chunks of the car and rather to patch things in a bit at a time. You could quickly loose a lot of structural integrity and I think a lot of amateur restorers have vainly chased after the very high standards achieved by the highest-achieving home and professional restorers only to despair of the demands of the task and give up or to make a mess of it.
The purpose of the bituminous coating as you will discover [emoji3] is not fire-protection but intended as sound-deadening, corrosion protection. (ha, ha[emoji3]) and to give some density to the panels.
Good luck and please keep us posted with better images.[emoji3]