Technical 40mm TB and GSR

[Randomman]

Hey all, just to keep another thread a little more on topic I thought I'd shift over here.

How well does the 40mm (Tricker) TB work with a GSR induction kit? Was talking to bushboy and he said it wont work properly, I'm hoping he will elaborate here, if not could someone else?

Wont be a problem, I'll just sort out a 38mm one

Cheers for the advice Bushboy

 

[rallycinq]

The only problem with a GSR induction kit is that it uses the standard Fiat 'bob'. From memory this has an inlet hole of about 35mm(ish) which is obviously less than the 40mm of the TB. The nett effect is that although you may have a 40mm TB it will be operating on 35mm of air.

Cheers

D

 

[Randomman]

The only problem with a GSR induction kit is that it uses the standard Fiat 'bob'. From memory this has an inlet hole of about 35mm(ish) which is obviously less than the 40mm of the TB. The nett effect is that although you may have a 40mm TB it will be operating on 35mm of air.

Cheers

D

So do you think it will inhibit the flow of air? Or just not release its full potential?

Cheers

 

[Dan]

Ive got a GSR coming in Sept and will be fitted to 40mm TB. Im guessing it will just withold further potential. Will eventually make a custom 'bob' to maximise the GSR and avoid the need for an oil breather.

 

[dave]

you could get a bigger bob made up

EDIT like he ^ is

 

[Bushboy]

as rally cinq said.

its not proven but theoreticaly, the bob will restrict the flow of air to just 35mm (or whatever the bob is) so the tb wont run at full potential so is pointless.

 

[Dan]

What is the narrowest airflow point measurement of the silicone hoseing, anybody got any idea?

 

[GhostWKD]

Yannia's induction kit has a bigger thinnest point iirc? could use gsr filter on that setup, could always get a bob made up like the turbo's have but then you have the problem of fitting the gsr pipe to it as the bob will have bigger bore so the gsr piping wont slide over it

 

[Dan]

Or the other way round so that the silicone hosing goes into it

 

[Randomman]

So I could just get the 40mm TB and await the development of a 40mm bob (or directions on how to make your own off here)

Would it make much difference over the standard 32mm TB?

 

[Dan]

Simple answer YES.

 

[Bushboy]

again,

YES

 

[Oldschool]

I just have measured the bop again with the vernier caliper.

The bop has got a diameter of 38mm. This results in a cross section of 1134smm.

The 40mm throttleboby would have a crosssection of 1256smm if there were not a shaft and a butterfly in the way. The shaft and the butterfly wan't be reraslistically thinner than 3mm reducing the cross section by a little less than 120smm.

1256 minus
1134 equals
122 minus the shaft
118-119 equals
3-4smm.
The difference is less than a third of a percent. Additionally the shaft is an obstruction in the fastest point of airflow, which is in the centre just where the shaft is running through. Effectively the air can't flow through the 40mm tb quicker than through the bop. The silicon hose is a no point smaller than the bop.
38mm in diameter with the maximum airflow without starting to impede airflow on a normaly aspirated 1242 would be at around 7200rpm.
As the GSR induction is not only using the superior airflow (over standard induction) but much more the Helmholtz effect (pulse charging) the claim that alternative filters are dramatically better is difficult to believe. But I stand to be corrected.
The only way to substantiate such claims would be on a rolling road with one car as a reference, at the same day, under the same conditions and with the same fuel.
I want to make quite clear that this is not subject to interpretation. I am not claiming that I want to conclude that the Tricker tbs are not working. What was possibly not done was an objective comparison.
But a RR session can be arranged.

Edit: I forgot the screw heads that are about 10 - 15smm and are a turbulence factor in the throat.

 

[Randomman]

Well you have good theory there, and an RR would solve it all.

Would the GSR Bob(or bop) physically fit onto a 40mm throttle body? If so then I am buying one and awaiting development of a bigger bob(p)

Cheers all

 

[custard]

why wait fro the "development",theres nothing to say anyone will make one nor will they share it. look into making one yourself. should fit okay on the 40mm i would think

 

[cinquecento_sunderland]

i am making myself a bob today from sheet steel only thin of corrse if it all works i will show drawings etc but you will require mig, anyway ill show yes all when it done

 

[custard]

i had wondered if you couldnt get a standard bob and dremel it out to size? perhaps if this wont work go round the scrappys looking at other SPI engines to see if you could find a moddable bob

 

[Randomman]

i had wondered if you couldnt get a standard bob and dremel it out to size? perhaps if this wont work go round the scrappys looking at other SPI engines to see if you could find a moddable bob

Good idea, I'll go out and start collecting next weekend, afterall they cant be that much!

Is it the same for a SPI Cinque/Sei as a Punto 60 SPI? As I'm looking to sort out my 1242'er with something.

Cheers

 

[project-cinqy]

as ghostwicked said, the yanniya kit is 40mm I believe? or, you could get a grill punched into the top of your bonnet, just infront of the TB and fit a k&n/green/ITG filter straight on? that would allow plenty of cold air to go right into the filter? The most efficient way would be a yanniya Bob kit and a BMC CDA airbox? expensive though!

When alls said and done are you going to race/sprint it? or are you going to cruise? or do you just want it to run a bit better. it's gonna cost a lot of money if you want it to be 100% efficient regardless of how you do it! Depends how poserish you want it to look?

Jon+Em

 

[Oldschool]

Problem with Yanninas bop is that you can't fit the CDA. If you remember he said that the K&N 127 x 90mm filter is the biggest you can get in.

Going for your first option will soon kill your engine in the first rain and possibly push a lot of air out at higher speed rather than in as you have a pressure build up under the bonnet.

People have thought about many solutions a long time before this thread came up. Why do you think so few ideas survived and made it to production?