General 2012 Spec and Price Increases?

[bgunn]

Will be interesting to see exactly what differs with the 105hp one - mapping, maybe compression ratio and clearly more boost. Now, how many years until my warranty runs out I wonder....

 

[FloJo]

...and according to another dealer you have to get your order in tomorrow to pay the current prices. Yet another dealer suggested the deadline was Monday this week although it should be possible to modify an existing car to your spec provided it's already on the 'system'... Must confess to being confused myself!

Fingers crossed mine is on the system then!

ffxmy - was this the dealer we were discussing?

 

[loveshandbags]

Will be interesting to see exactly what differs with the 105hp one - mapping, maybe compression ratio and clearly more boost. Now, how many years until my warranty runs out I wonder....

103bhp .....and the gearbox

https://www.fiatforum.com/500/274562-twinair-will-reliable-discuss-4.html?p=2799117

 

[bgunn]

You guys fret too much. The gearbox will be fine.

Don't forget, these things are rated/tested using very harsh testing to allow for the most idiotic driver to mash it about and not break it - you can quite happily drive something with an underrated gearbox around as long as you have some mechanical sympathy. It's not like 105 PS is an amazing amount of horsies (and therefore torque).

 

[ffxmy]

ffxmy - was this the dealer we were discussing?

Unfortunately that dealer wasn't in today. He phoned yesterday when I was in the middle of test driving a new Kia Picanto so I couldn't take the call... No doubt he will be calling again tomorrow.

I've been speaking to some other dealers today with some success. More later when the deal is done. That should be tomorrow or Friday.

 

[loveshandbags]

You guys fret too much. The gearbox will be fine.

Don't forget, these things are rated/tested using very harsh testing to allow for the most idiotic driver to mash it about and not break it - you can quite happily drive something with an underrated gearbox around as long as you have some mechanical sympathy. It's not like 105 PS is an amazing amount of horsies (and therefore torque).

Thanks for clearing up the bhp of the 'newer' TA whenever it arrives. A lot of reviewers on the Zagato coupe had confused the terms PS and bhp.
105PS -> 104HP -> 103bhp akin to the Panda 100HP having 99bhp.
I would have been an advocate of increasing boost and sceptic that I am I reckon that the bean counters have been looking at ways of cutting cost. If they can shave 2c of the price of a gearbox to make £x they will do it and I don't feel that the tolerances that were once there are still there today. If you do a search on maps, re-maps you will see some of the casualties with those who tinkered with the Multi jet I. History does repeat itself.
Your posting on the development costs on Mondeo and Rover were very interesting because I could not find any figures for FIAT except the 500 Electric Vehicle that will be supplied in 2012 to the US which will lose $10K per car sold (nothing unusual for EVs). Merc spent $1 billion on its S-Class (their questionable Monoblade wiper cost ???). Fiat have given a figure of $100M to develop its multiair engine unlike Chrysler who refused to reveal their development costs to Forbes.
I don't know how much Ford gave Fiat for their engines and drivetrain or if the new suspension developed for the Ka by Fiat gave them a cash injection but a lot manufactures are looking at joint developments to share cost.
Interesting article in Forbes in the US setup about the concept of Studios not showrooms (macdebbie educated me on this) and the term Fiat Specialists not salesmen
http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2011/0228/features-laura-soave-autos-chrysler-fiat-first-lady_3.html
If you look at the price of the base 2012 US 500 at $15,500 this equates to £9562. The cheapest 1.2 POP is st£9,665 and a comparable model e.g. the 1.4 Lounge is st£12,470.
For the US it has been able to pitch their 500 at the price it does because it has picked a particular type of distribution model with lower than expected overheads or maybe its more price sensitive and its a way for Fiat to get a 'foot in the door'.
With the collaborative partnership of Fiat with Chrysler this should allow them to keep their prices competitive and I would be surprised if the 2012 500 will go up by much despite getting all the new advances that the US have got first. At least Fiat can push some of their suspension costs to the Panda (bigger seller) for the 500 and the Multiairs are already well established in the GP and the Alfas (expect 1.4 might be dropped like in the Ypsilon)
[1 billion equates to One thousand million -the US standard which the UK have now adopted]

 

[Kaulitz]

I wouldn't be surprised if prices increase to coincide with the new quarter, apparently car sales are on the up.
I put off ordering my 500 as I was expecting the facelift to appear soon but in the end I decided to go ahead and order.
Judging by the look of the American 500 and the Zagato (albeit a concept), the 500 still appears to look the same from the outside. I couldn't imagine fiat releasing the 500 in America only to cosmetically facelift the Euro model. Add to this the fact that Fiat are still releasing newer special editions to the range such as the Gucci edition.
I wouldn't be surprised if the Euro 500 gains some of the mechanical differences seen on the American model though.

 

[allen_b]

I was much the same. In the end, I decided I preferred the look of the current Euro model to the new US one, so stumped up the cash now.

As much as I trust Fiat, too many cars are ruined by facelifts, so I didn't want to risk that happening to the 500.

 

[Super Uwe]

When I collected my car from the dealer the other day after the recall work.... he also said prices were going up on the 1st July. He also said the 105bhp TA was due the end of the year. But in the Panda first off.

I did wonder why this might be the case, but then I realised it's probably to replace the Panda 100HP. Would that be right?

I am really, really intrigued as to how this 105bhp version will go. I reckon it'll be a beast!

 

[arorat]

As much as I trust Fiat, too many cars are ruined by facelifts, so I didn't want to risk that happening to the 500.

the basic 500 shape will remain the same, look at the mini facelift a lot was changed but at first glace it seems the same.

 

[allen_b]

the basic 500 shape will remain the same, look at the mini facelift a lot was changed but at first glace it seems the same.

Every external panel was changed with the Mini, though. That's how you facelift right.

It's minor additions that bother me. The 500, and indeed any car, was designed as a whole. Adding a new style front bumper means there's a disconnect between the initial design and the facelifted model. I think even the Abarth and the US 500 suffer in that way.

 

[loveshandbags]

When I collected my car from the dealer the other day after the recall work.... he also said prices were going up on the 1st July. He also said the 105bhp TA was due the end of the year. But in the Panda first off.

I did wonder why this might be the case, but then I realised it's probably to replace the Panda 100HP. Would that be right?

I very much doubt they would bring out the 103bhp TA engine first in the Panda - this is just a case of a Fiat specialist giving some mubo jumbo. If you think of how manufactures launch new vehicles e.g. MINI brought out the Cooper first and then the lesser Mini One afterwards. If they were looking for say a £3K premium for a Zagato over a 'normal' 500 they would not miss the opportunity of this top of line TA engine on a Panda.
Also I somehow don't think that the TA engine even in 'normal' mode suits the new heavier 2012 Panda and I don't why.

 

[FloJo]

Just noticed that there have been some changes on the fiat config website... Twin air is a model option, new colours etc.
Also that ACC seems to be standard on the TA lounge?

EDIT: Couple of new i deal finance options on the special offers page too.

 

[bgunn]

Ahh, these are the new models that have been spoken about for a couple of months - the TA and the TA+..

 

[loveshandbags]

Ahh, these are the new models that have been spoken about for a couple of months - the TA and the TA+..

Had a quick look at the new line up:

Air con included in the price of the 'Twin Air'
Twin Air £11365 Twin Air+ £12465 compared with a Pop TA @ £10865
No choice on wheels 15inchs or 16inchs (+)
New colour Indigo Blue
Dropped Ragamuffin red & Volare Blue & Backbeat Grey
Predisposition for Blue & Me Tom-Tom (listed as an option may come a £)
Painted black roof and spoiler on Offer on the TwinAir+
Fog lights are extra on the TwinAir +

Like the option of getting the half leather sports seats from the 'old' Sport in the TwinAir. Great value - wheels & seats & aircon at a £500 premium over Pop. This spec would have suited a previous enquiry from another Forum member who was looking for good seats (with a bit of leather) at a good price without having to pay for $$$$ for the leather.

It's a 'dark' look and reminds me of the matt black with the 'black' wheels.

We will have to invent a new abbreviation for these models !

 

[bgunn]

The Tom Tom socket is free - add it and see on the configurator (I hate that word).

 

[loveshandbags]

The Tom Tom socket is free - add it and see on the configurator (I hate that word).

I noticed it was free but on the OHs Mito you don't need to specify it. I would have thought it came with the B&Me as standard without having to specifically ask for it. I know that some people specifically requested it on the orders to be sure this year. They might end up charging for it.

 

[bgunn]

When I ordered mine, they put the option on but it was a no cost option.. When I asked about it, they said everyone wants it anyway, so they just add it routinely. Suited me!

 

[loveshandbags]

When I ordered mine, they put the option on but it was a no cost option.. When I asked about it, they said everyone wants it anyway, so they just add it routinely. Suited me!

Last March there were one or 2 who didn't get the socket and they refused the car so everyone learned to make sure it was written on the order form ! Looks like your dealer knew the 'story'.

 

[306maxi]

When I ordered mine, they put the option on but it was a no cost option.. When I asked about it, they said everyone wants it anyway, so they just add it routinely. Suited me!

Mine came with it and I never asked, they just add it to all orders with Blue&Me.