Technical 1108 Fire engine

[Puntodan]

Ok i have a cinq sporting in my possesion that didn't start, have pulled the starter out tested that, works fine, taken all the power leads for the starter and alternator cleaned them up all seem fine.

Car turns over now but very very slow, has a brand new bettery as well, the engine turns over as i can see the cam pulley turning, but the alternator dosent turn.

I can't get it to start at all, please help! Also so the 55 have a seperate bit on the battery, that comes off the positive lead, has 2 wires going into it.

Can't try and bump start it as it is on a drive way that goes down hill so pushing it back up is a no no!

Dan

 

[mase]

could be the starter motor mate

if u can reach it, give it a whack and try again.

they have a little soilnoid in them that usually goes, hit them with hammer and sometimes they start, but u will prob need a new one.

my dad did show me once how to bridge a starter motor with a wrench, but cant remember how to do it now

 

[Luke]

If the alternator isnt turning, try disconnecting the auxillary belt and spinning the alternator driveshaft - it should turn pretty freely but sometimes the bearings seize up.

Had that problem on mine, the torque eventually would stall the engine at idle (when i was working out what the hell the problem was), but would still start so not neccessarily the problem

 

[Puntodan]

I have had the starter motor out (what a mission!) and have tested that and it spins over fine and engages as it should and according to my man at the parts shop doesn't need replacing!

Taking the belt off for alternator is a mission looking at the book, undo the engine mount and drop the engine down one side!

I have taken the wiring harness for the power to the starter and alt out, cleaned it all up, loks ok and all back together noww it turns over but very slowly like it has a flat bettery, but the battery is brand new and has a very good charge in it! Was hoping it would be an easy fix but seems to be taken weeks rather than days to get it back on the road!

 

[Luke]

Taking the belt off for alternator is a mission looking at the book, undo the engine mount and drop the engine down one side!

Thats only to remove the alternator, to just remove the belt its a case of undo-ing the 2 tentioning bolts on the alternator so it moves (you dont actually need to remove the bolts). Tis a 5 min job. 16mm and 17mm socket

 

[Puntodan]

Ahh ha a man in the know!

Where are the bolts located? I will have atry with this tonight, with the belt disconnected it should start if the alt is sezied, well in theroy! Although it will discharge the battery it will prove a point!

If it is not that what else would cause the car to turn over so slowly!?

 

[Luke]

Ahh ha a man in the know!

Where are the bolts located? I will have atry with this tonight, with the belt disconnected it should start if the alt is sezied, well in theroy! Although it will discharge the battery it will prove a point!

If it is not that what else would cause the car to turn over so slowly!?

The bolts are on the right hand side (nearest to the block) top and bottom. The top one was the 16mm bolt IIRC, and the adjustment screw was the 17mm bolt at the bottom.

Its much easier with the wheel off and arch liner out to make it all nice and visible, although can be done without after alot of fuss.

Also have you checked all the grounding wires of the starter motor etc? If its got a poor circuit it wont turn over too well

Cant really think of anything else to cause it really, only if the engine itself is seizing up. are you getting any strange noises when you're trying to turn it over?

 

[Puntodan]

The bolts are on the right hand side (nearest to the block) top and bottom. The top one was the 16mm bolt IIRC, and the adjustment screw was the 17mm bolt at the bottom.

Its much easier with the wheel off and arch liner out to make it all nice and visible, although can be done without after alot of fuss.

Also have you checked all the grounding wires of the starter motor etc? If its got a poor circuit it wont turn over too well

Cant really think of anything else to cause it really, only if the engine itself is seizing up. are you getting any strange noises when you're trying to turn it over?

I have checked all the earths to the starter and alt and also the earth on the inner wing for the battery! is there any other earths i can check!? Engine earth strap?

Cool will have the inner arch out and see if that makes it turn over better than it does, no noises from the engine, well it turns over real slow but nothing knocking or banging! The woman who used to own it said it made a bit of noise and just stopped! Then when she turned the key it just clicked and did nothing! But that didn't help much really! So it now turns over but not a lot else!

 

[Catseyes]

Does the engine turn over when you use a rachet on the crank? sounds like either the engine has seized or the alternator has packed up, if it turns over freely then remove the belt as instructed above.

Also when trying to start put your foot on the clutch as this removes the drag from the gearbox.

Check your getting a spark....

How long has it been standing...? Are you sure there is enough oil in the car?

 

[rallycinq]

Pop the plugs out and make sure it turns over by hand. Could be seized.

Cheers

D

 

[Puntodan]

Does the engine turn over when you use a rachet on the crank? sounds like either the engine has seized or the alternator has packed up, if it turns over freely then remove the belt as instructed above.

Also when trying to start put your foot on the clutch as this removes the drag from the gearbox.

Check your getting a spark....

How long has it been standing...? Are you sure there is enough oil in the car?

Yes it does turn over, and if i reomve the cam belt cover and turn the key you can see the pulley turning round, so i don't think the engine has seized up! I am going to try removing the belt and see what happens tonight!

If it wasn't getting a spark it woud still turn over quite quick but wouldn't fire up though would it?! It has been standing sice christmas, have checked the oil, seems ok and also pushed that car backwards and forwrds to circulate it around the sump a bit as it was up on ramps.

 

[arc]

dont keep starting with foot on the clutch though, it'll bugger up the clutch release bearing!

tbh it does sound like a siezed alternator. if everything bar that is turning,then it cant be much else really?

 

[HP]

dont keep starting with foot on the clutch though, it'll bugger up the clutch release bearing!

Fiat's reccommended way to start is to press the clutch down and alleviate the drag.

Have you checked the engine/gearbox earth strap? If you're getting all the power into the starter but it has nowhere to go after that, it could cause your problems.

 

[Puntodan]

Where is that earth strap located as i did have a lok for it but didn't se anything!?

 

[arc]

its on the top right of the gearbox, near all the gearchange linkages

Re starting with foot on the clutch, i used to do that - (habbit from driving a hyundai accent which you had to start with foot on clutch or else it wouldnt let you turn the engine over!) - sure i read somewhere that it's best just to leave the car alone and just the turn the key to start it.

 

[rallycinq]

Re starting with foot on the clutch, i used to do that - (habbit from driving a hyundai accent which you had to start with foot on clutch or else it wouldnt let you turn the engine over!) - sure i read somewhere that it's best just to leave the car alone and just the turn the key to start it.

Yes, foot on clutch can help with a drag problem.

No, foot on clutch a bad idea as it will push the crank into the thrust bearings when there is no oil pressure.

Catch 22

Cheers

D

 

[Puntodan]

Ok had another crack at it last night, managed to get one bolt out of the alt and it loosened off the belt a bit more but was just going to cut it offas it needs to be replaced anyhow! Now it is loose it turns over a bit better but is still quite slow.

Engine turns over, can see the bottom pulley turning, so don't think it has seized.

Dan

 

[Catseyes]

Cool.

Now its just a case of checking for spark, if Yes then check earth points if No then check rpm sensor (crank sensor) and make sure its clean.

It hasn't been standing too long so it should start, a friend of mine managed to start a panda that had been standing for 3 years with determination and wd40 lol.

You can do it!

 

[Puntodan]

Cool.

Now its just a case of checking for spark, if Yes then check earth points if No then check rpm sensor (crank sensor) and make sure its clean.

It hasn't been standing too long so it should start, a friend of mine managed to start a panda that had been standing for 3 years with determination and wd40 lol.

You can do it!

I was on my own last night so trying to check a spark and turn it over is a little much even with such a small car! :lol

Now you mention it the crank sensor is pretty dirty as there looks to be a fair bit of oil leaked from the rocker cover gasket, will sort that once it is running!

Plan of action:

Cut alternator belt
Try and start
fingers crossed!!

Dan

 

[Puntodan]

ok bit of an update, cut the alternator belt off yesterday and it started eventually, turns over like normal now although didn't run for longg as there is no water in it due to the expansion tank being off!

So i need an alternator, how much!!! Does anyone have a spare they want to sell?

Dan