Technical 1.4 hydraulic lifter died

[Santaniello]

Hi All,

My '98 1.4 Bravo has had valve tappet sounds when starting for as long as I can remember, but it always went away after a few seconds.

But now one of the lifter has died. I popped the cam cover off, and I can push the faulty tappet down about 1cm right above the lifter. It's springy. The other ones don't move when I push them down.

It seems like the lifter is stuck down.

Is it possible to pry the valve down and pull out the tappet without pulling the camshaft? Can I then just screw in a new lifter?

I also notice the number 1 cyclinder cams look awfully dry. Anything I can do to clear out the oil bar without pulling it all apart?

It's cold outside and I don't have a garage so I want to spend as little time as possible just exploring in there.

Joseph

 

[Santaniello]

I pulled out the lifter after pushing the rockerarm to the side.

Is the lifter supposed to be springy? I'm trying to figure out if it's the lifter or the oil delivery that is the problem.

 

[bluejohn125]

A rattling top end on a 1.4 is always the sign of poor lubrication.. you probably suspected this but didn't fix it until it's too late... If you're unlucky you may have worn your camshaft.

You should do a proper oil flush and change for a good 10W/40 - possibly diesel spec so that you have extra detergents to clean the engine.

I don't know about the lifters...

 

[Santaniello]

I'm revising my diagnosis a bit: The one lifter is probably the one that was always a bit leaky (and thus noisy on start), but now I have basically NO oil flow up top. It was clacking and squeaking a big racket when I would start it, and I was preoccupied with the one lifter making most of the noise and quite visibly not doing what it was supposed to be doing.

But I was a bit surprised how I could run the engine with the cam-cover off and how little mess (none) it was making. The oil should be visibly squirting out of the rail onto the lobes, right? I couldn't see any.

I started it up with one rocker arm and lifter removed (12 valves so no problems running on just 1 intake on the one cylinder) so I could see if any oil would come out of the lifter bore (lifter removed) to see if the lifter was getting oil. No oil coming out of the lifter bore, suggesting poor oil delivery. So I poured some oil onto the whole camshaft and started it up again. Runs like a champion! Even with the one rocker and lifter removed.

So looks like my problem is clogged oil rail. Can I just unbolt it? Would that be bad loosening just the one camshaft retaining bolts? Do I need a torque wrench to refit?

 

[aurick86]

You can remove the oil ramp.. no problems.
Be careful to mount it back perfectly as the only oil line to the cam lobes and lifters is thru the oil ramp, oil comes through the head in one single hole ( on the top side of the head, in the middle ), then through the oil ramp to the bits that need lubrication.

So if the ramp loses oil anywhere (at the 10 rubber gaskets for example) it will result in low oil presure for the lifters .. and not enough lubrication to the cam lobes.

 

[Santaniello]

Thanks for the reply. Is it likely that these 10 gaskets will survive pulling out the rail or ramp? In other words, can spare myself the 60 km (round trip) sub-freezing push-bike ride to the dealer?

 

[aurick86]

Yes, they are reusable.. if they are in good condition that is.
Just be gentle.
Remove the 5 ( or so) bolts and then gently pull the rail straight out, be careful not to twist or mangle it.

Use some diesel/petrol to clean the inside of the rail, with some steel/copper wire and some rags. Then with a needle check each of the 12 holes squirting oil on the cams are free of crap.

My advise:
-use engine flush to clean engine after you reassemble it and check it's ok
-replace oil with the cheapest you find + oil filter
-run engine on that for 1-2000 km
-the use engine flush again
-put in a good oil + oil filter

In some 1.4's the 12 ( 12 not 10, cause there is one next to each lifter) rubber gaskets cause the oil starvation problem, badly mounted or cracked resulting in lose of oil pressure .

 

[Santaniello]

Of course it snowed last night so each time I dropped a tool I had to get frostbite finding it!

I pulled the oil rail out and it was pretty straight-forward like you say. I used some bike brake cable to "snake" out the tubes. Hard to say, but before doing that I blew into each outlet, and a few were rather blocked. I also shoved the bike cable down the oil feed hole. That was pretty gummed up.

For laughs I swapped the beleived faulty lifter with another to see if it was the bore or the lifter that was the problem. Lifter.

My facilities are a long way from the clean-room at Ferrari so I can't tell if the gaskets are ok (or even see if they were there). But now when running the engine, it makes a mess with oil splatter, so I guess the flow is improved.

I ordered a lifter (42 GBP local!) so I'll try it tomorrow. Then a big flush.

I think the blown lifter was letting too much oil out so that combined with the semi-blocked tubes was depriving the number one cam of oil. It was easier for the oil to leak out of the lifter than work it's way through blocked tubes.

Seems like a crap design.

 

[Santaniello]

It wasn't the lifter... It was/is perished/blocked gaskets causing the oil to 1) not get into all the lifters as it was instead leaking out of the cracks in the gaskets, and 2) allowing the oli pressure in the rail to be too low to squirt any oil out of the semi-blocked pin-holes.

Now I've got an extra lifter, and the dealers have closed for Christmas so no chance to buy the (at least) 2 gaskets I need. So since my middle-name is Bodge, I'm scrounging around in my shed looking for some rubber to make some...

 

[aurick86]

As i remember the gaskets come as a set, about 10-20 euros.
Try any other auto parts store, if they don't have it ( probably) they can get it for you in 1 or two days, you might get a better deal that the fiat dealers, and might get it before new years.

 

[Santaniello]

I was just at the dealer and ordered some. He said the distributor had only 4 in stock, at a price of about 14 EUR (110 NOK). Prices here are so insane I won't be surprised if it is per piece, but that would make my day if it was a complete set. I ordered all 4 figuring that was better than none. It looks like I only NEED 2, so I'm hoping this will sort me out.