How much of the energy come from burning all the waste products in oil a fair bit of assumeAre you still here ?
you scoured that whole post didn't you to try and find something to challenge ?
Well it maybe utter BS and it seems to depend where you look some places say it could be 6kWh or even less but I will also tell you what else is BS, that's every petrol car in the country doing 50mpg. Not counting my a factored 25% error margin on top of that, and still came up with less than 10% extra power use.
Go look around, as the petrochemical industry doesn't produce any figures on the amount of power that is used on refining oil, not since 2005 when people started criticising the ridiculous amount of power used refining oil the exact numbers are not known estimates vary.
EV Charging
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EV Charging
Aye Bill us oldies
I don’t have a driveway, so little chance of a charging point at my house, but I have a solution ; I ain’t buying a lecky car simple. 
There are very little waste products from the oil,
Everything from lpg which is gas to the thickest tar and everything in between has some sort of use, if it can be burned or turned into plastics or chemicals, it’s useful.
About the only things that are not are some flammable gases that might be vented off and burned on some sort of stand pipe.
This is why a lot of refineries usually have some large flame somewhere out on a long arm or pipe, also oil rigs usually have an arm sticking out to the side to burn off gasses that they can’t use.
What they don’t tend to do is use those unneeded gases to produce any energy they just burn them in the air. I don’t know if in more recent times they are making more effort to contain these and use them in other ways but the amount that they burn off is nothing compared to the energy a refinery uses.
Some councils are already installing streetlight fitted electric car chargers, no idea of the cost but you can assume if it’s a company making money off it, it’s not going to be super cheap like economy 7.
That said if you only need to charge your car once every 7 - 10 days, combined with charging speeds getting quicker and quicker, people will charge at work or the supermarket, and I’m almost certain there will be cars very soon with 10-15 minute charging so maybe even the supermarket when doing your weekly shop. How many people fill there tank at tesco on the way out of the carpark?
Something that seems to be ignored, is that so many plastics are oil-derived products. When demand for oil drops, prices will increase, including all the other stuff, not just fuel. I'm aware that they are able to vary the products derived as teh oil is refined, but I doubt it could be swayed that much towards the plastics content.
Whilst some companies are installing chargers, the number will be limited. Currently this is seen maybe as the 'right' thing to do, but as demand increases, there will be a cost, that will have to be met from company profits, or a charge to the employee user, which will become another profit opportunity. At the same time, there will be lost productivity, when employees have to 'pop out' to move the car to/from the charger, as well as someone co-ordinating this.
One day, you'll miss your slot at work, then the supermarket option is full, or not working, and a lot of time is taken finding another option, if capacity won't take you home and back to work next day.
As EV numbers increase, owners will 'enjoy' all these challenges, and more, and it will take some time to settle. "Sorry I'm late, had to wait while the car charged."
The reasons against electric cars do get more and more tenuous, If you consider that the reason for switching to electric cars is to stop us poisoning ourselves with fumes, the human equivalent of a a fish filling it’s own tank with ****, then I find it bizarre that people actively look for reasons to be against it.
Then there will always be a pay off, ok we’re not digging up oil but now we’re digging for lithium and cobalt.
Solid state batteries are now just on the horizon and will reduce the special metals needed like the cobalt.
Anyway if we are reducing petrol we are reducing plastics and there are already a lot of plant based plastics being made lego for example switching to plant based plastics already.
It’s in certain companies interests to keep us dependent on plastics there profits rely on it. But do we actually need them ??
There is plenty of plastic material already that can be recycled. Land fills may become mines in the future to reclaim the stuff with threw away.
Also as I said if you could plug your car in and charge it in 10 minutes (I’ve heard rumblings of 8 minutes) then charging stations like we have petrol stations now will make the experience really not all that different, and with a lot of people being able to charge from home the demand at those stations should not leave massive tail backs
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If I read correctly the early Li-Ion batteries used Lithium Cobalt Oxide as a cathode and graphite as an anode material. Now they use a variety of variants (phosphates, titanates, spinels, etc.). These been shown to have a much longer lifetime, with types using lithium iron phosphate lasting at least more than 10 years and more than 7000 charge/discharge cycles and LG Chem expecting their lithium-manganese spinel batteries to last up to 40 years.
Current year 2016+ Li-Ion batteries are supposed to allow >4000 charge cycles, goor for 100,000 miles and a life span of >10 years.
All very promising.
Wikipedia article here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_vehicle_battery
Current year 2016+ Li-Ion batteries are supposed to allow >4000 charge cycles, goor for 100,000 miles and a life span of >10 years.
All very promising.
Wikipedia article here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_vehicle_battery
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Current lamp post chargers are limited to 3.6 / 7.2 kW so 6 to 17 hours for a charge. The Siemens scheme in london requires a special lead costing £200-300 and power costs between 16 and 19p per kWh, up to 6p per mile.
https://www.fleeteurope.com/en/new-...3]=charging infrastructure&t[4]=London&curl=1
Another issue is lamp posts are about 40m apart and on one side of the street. So with 5m per car parking space thats about 1 charger for every 15 cars.......
https://www.fleeteurope.com/en/new-...3]=charging infrastructure&t[4]=London&curl=1
Another issue is lamp posts are about 40m apart and on one side of the street. So with 5m per car parking space thats about 1 charger for every 15 cars.......
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Talking of charging why are manufacturer's not looking at putting solar panels on bonnet, roof and boot real estate. Flexible panels now exist and whilst I'll fully admit for a typical EU vehicle such a surface area could deliver possibly only up to 800W with current technology a car sitting all day with say an average of 400W-500W for 8 hours+ is not to be sneered at. Every little bit counts.
I guess the answer to my question is that a prestige (or not) BMW or Mercedes covered in panels is not appealing to many, most, ....
Yes I seem to recall Fiat did a full plastic body experimental Panda. This was a typical rough 80s/90s matt bumper style finish. I loved the idea. Matt, fading, when really dirty just hit it with a scrubbing brush or jets wash. No polishing, no shinny "look at my smart stylish car status symbol, etc.
Vehicle vanity seems to be a driving factor in what/where manufacturers tread.
I guess the answer to my question is that a prestige (or not) BMW or Mercedes covered in panels is not appealing to many, most, ....
Yes I seem to recall Fiat did a full plastic body experimental Panda. This was a typical rough 80s/90s matt bumper style finish. I loved the idea. Matt, fading, when really dirty just hit it with a scrubbing brush or jets wash. No polishing, no shinny "look at my smart stylish car status symbol, etc.
Vehicle vanity seems to be a driving factor in what/where manufacturers tread.
Talking of battery technology I seem to remember that Tesla were working on a plan for a “life time” battery and that they were aiming for a minimum 300,000 mile battery.
I’m also pretty sure at least Toyota have put solar panels on some cars and I’m sure Hyundai and Kia will be offering them as well soon.
I’m also pretty sure at least Toyota have put solar panels on some cars and I’m sure Hyundai and Kia will be offering them as well soon.
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Well what I posted was supposedly valid info from 2016/2017 that was/has not been wikipedia publicly challenged.
i would like to think that come 2020/2021 things have improved, if only a little.
As for solar panels on domestic as opposed to commercial vehicles I do think there is a large/huge (status, snob, would not been seen in this, ....) set of public personal barriers to be overcome. No doubt this reluctance will for most become overcome but sadly for (IMHO) not for many years to come.
We here of FF buy cheap crappy Fiats in the eyes of the BMW, Mercedes, .... vehicle owners (no offence meant). But we here are happy and wonder why the others waste their money on overpriced status symbols.
What may happen in future years is there may? be a levelling of so called status/wealth/prestige around vehicle ownership where vehicles (due to environmental pressures) lose there status value and just become a required shopping trolley requirement. People will then be focused on their mobile phone supremacy, residence supremacy, or even pet ownership supremacy.
We have seen this in the likes of Facebook. For many if you are not on Facebook you are a nobody. Even to the extent that some employers (to be) in the past have asked to see/know your Facebook content/presance at interview.
Thank God I'm happily retired!
I don’t think that would ever happen, especially if you look at the electric cars mercedes have been recently touting about. And having a Tesla is most definitely a status symbol. Someone I worked with had an Model X made a big thing about it but then had to sell it (I’d guess they couldn’t keep up the repayments. They made a very big deal about it when they had it but then when it very very suddenly got put up forsale they suddenly started finding everything to complain about and then went out and bough something very cheap and bland.
Let’s be honest someone will buy a very cheap Dacia then tell everyone down the pub why there car is superior two everything else,
Almost certainly there will be ‘range superiority’ I can imagine people going”Ooh you bought the ….. doesn’t that only go 258miles to the charge, that’s why I got the …… which does 262 miles which is obviously a massive difference.
