These 2 engines are not comparable. Whilst for people who are on a budget i can agree that the JTD is a good alternative to the Abarth. If you can afford to run an Abarth then the difference in Drivability is night and day.
Im afraid that i cant make this comparison to both stilos. I was asked to take a friend to collect their Cupra Kitted Diesel Leon. Now im lead to believe that you would be splitting hairs to compare differences between this and the Stilo in terms of performance. But even after racing the Cupra in my car and then his, even after a remap of the diesel the Abarth will **** all over the it.

Thats is all.

volxstu said:

These 2 engines are not comparable. Whilst for people who are on a budget i can agree that the JTD is a good alternative to the Abarth. If you can afford to run an Abarth then the difference in Drivability is night and day.
Im afraid that i cant make this comparison to both stilos. I was asked to take a friend to collect their Cupra Kitted Diesel Leon. Now im lead to believe that you would be splitting hairs to compare differences between this and the Stilo in terms of performance. But even after racing the Cupra in my car and then his, even after a remap of the diesel the Abarth will **** all over the it.

Thats is all.

Click to expand...

What kind of engine does the Abarth have? Isn't it a 1.9 diesel also? Or is it the 2.4 liter petrol?

Diesel is 1.9 turbo and Abarth is 2.4 NA petrol. The turbo is a big argument that people use for the JTD but for normal road driving this means nothing. By the time the turbo kicks in i have hot step into the horizon with my Abarth engine.
You only had to see the smile on my friends face when i took him to collect his car to see how much better the 2.4 petrol engine is.

Hahahahahahaha thanks needed a laugh, But the fact's you have forgotton to mention is that when your engine expires at what around 50-60,000 miles a jtd will go on for at least double ot treble that, Oh not forgeting 40+mpg, OOOOOh tax at £125 a year and lets be quite honest about it, Real world conditions you wont be that far in front of a well driven Jtd!!! Turbo lag isnt that much of a problem either!

And i doubt very much your smile would be much better than the one on my face either as i really do enjoy chucking my Mw around.

Will have to agree to disagree with you on this!!

The 2.4 is much much faster than the 1.9, even a remapped one. That's a fact I've seen them racing. What the guy above said is also not necessarily true don't know what kind of cars you guys drive but people here drive cars that have more than 500 000 km on the clock... and how long do you expect to drive this car... oh even the Bravo 2.0 24V HGT beats the 1.9....

I am categorically saying that real world performance the lag make a huge difference. From what i have discovered in actual performance the JTD isnt a patch on the Abarth. Seriously within seconds i was half way down the road, my friend was still pootling out of the junction. I then drove his car aned can again say that the JTD doesnt compare to the 2.4.
All these comparisons are made for financial reasons. Some people arent all that interested in the financial implications.

Also the point of these engines not lasting past 60k is a myth. This is a Fiat forum. Go compare the amount of JTDs with blown turbos or engines compared to abarth

Interesting argument you have raised here Stu.

I can't offer anything constructive to the argument as i have never been in or near an abarth. However what i can say is that a remapped JTD is quicker than you give it credit for. Whilst the abarth may be quicker 0-60 in terms of real life driving the JTD engine is great. Very flexible 30-80 in third gear is awesome and the pull in top from motorway speeds is very good too. my only experience of petrol to diesel cars is my Alfa 156 20v. It was remapped and was much quicker than my mates Leon Cupra R in gear acceleration and the same in 0-sillyness. Both cars made around 225hp.

Without actually seeing and going in an abarth and vice versa it is a hard call on which one is better. Whilst i can afford the running costs of the abarth i do enjoy the 40+ mpg and £110 road tax given that i have another car and a couple of bikes to run as well.

The 5 pot noise does appeal though.

I would add that the engines don't/can't compare in performance either. one is a torquey engine with a 3000rpm wide powerband and the other whilst having less torque will have a wider useable powerband.

The problem with the JTD (especially a remapped one) at this time of year is getting the power down.

At 3000rpm my JTD is making 150hp and is pushing about 170hp at 4500rpm. To get the best out of the jtd you need to drive it differently to a petrol engine. I find i am changing gear at about 3200rpm dropping the revs to about 1800rpm and peak torque.

I have had a little 1 2 with a w reg cupra R and it was quite even matched with my car. I'm sure the newer one is much faster. I have also been ass raped by a Clio 192. I will try and think of some other cars I have had a race with to make a comparison.

I had a remaped JTD with 160bhp and an abarth, in speed there wasn't that much difference between them.

Abarth is better though as it has a proper engine which sounds good and you have more than 3000rpm to play with

The 2.4 Arbarth is terribley slow when you compare it to cars in the same class.
My personel opinion is its a waste of Fiats time and money as it in no way fairs well against its competitors, major fail.

But, if you really want to compare it to a remapped 100,000 mile diesel family estate car then yes, an Arbarth is(slightly) quicker.

If this comparison is supposed to impress its also an epic fail. The performance of Hyundai's new 2.4-liter Sonata will make an Arbarth look slow.

yes the engine is shocking and slow, my old MR2 was quicker (a 20 year old 130k miles 2.0 twin cam engine) but a 5 pot sounds nice

Hold on a minute what car is in the stilo abarths class? Civic type R? Modern engines don't count as you can't get one of these for under £3.5k. A friend had a 1.6 corsa that ripped mine but at that time they were going fr 17k second hand which buys me a lot of juice, extra engines etc etc considering the fuel economy was very similar. If I were to put the same money into mine then I'm sure I would rip a VXR corsa with very littl effort
I see that people say the MR2 ect is quicker but they are not NA and as fiat fans we can can 3 good seats, a good size boot and the look null and voids the MR2 from the equasion.

Also the point of the thread is that an Abarth is not just slightly quicker in the real world than a JTD. It pisses all over it.

What's wound you up on this one anyway. And which particular JTD engine are you comparing the abarth too. Bearing in mind that the 2.4 is 170hp stock and an 8 valve jtd is 115hp of course you will leave it for dead. A 150hp 16v jtd i think you will find will give you a harder time and with a remapped jtd you will have a lot of fun keeping ahead of (both about the 170hp mark)

the thing with the jtd's and remapped ones is that you don't know what the hp is and how good a remap it has. I had a Celtic Tuning 163hp map on mine but felt it underpowered. They came back, remapped it and it is miles quicker. I haven't had it on a dyno yet but it does feel about 170hp so i wouldn't mind coming down to your private test track and maybe see the difference between the two.

BTW the MR2 is an n/a unless its the import turbo model and an abarth definately won't keep up with that one.

Not wishing/trying to be picky but a W reg Leon would not have been an R model. If standard it would have been 180hp so would have been similar to the abarth.

Well my nowledge of cars isn't the be all and end all. It didn't have to be a Cupra R I raced a while back but it was a w reg an motorway driving mine did just have the edge.

Now I do have to challenge you here. I have grown up with lots of people in the motor racing industry. They would seriously strugle to to tell the difference between the drive of the same car at 163 and 170 bhp. You either have a mad tallent that should be earning you at least a 6 figure sallery or you have surcomed to the placebo effect. Or I spose the company could have done something very wrong the first time. But i can't imagine that a remap company can xo anything so wrong that it can add another say 10 bhp. Not without their being a mechanicle problem anyway.
Maps are pretty much generic bar a couple of tweak points dependant on modifications of the car. Even the. I don't believe the maps are massivly different on Stilos. Maybe on much more popular cars that have has a lot of reverse enginering but not stilo's

I know what you mean about being able to tell the difference but from a motorcycle point of view it is possible to be able to notice a 2hp increase and with 5 years racing bikes and working on a motorcycle dyno i guess you do get a bit more sensitive to changes.

With regard to the map on my car it was the generic map they advertise as 163hp give or take a couple of hp. when it was put on the car it felt lacking above 3000rpm. When looking at the power curve on the website you could see that between 3000-4500rpm there was only a 10hp increase.

Following a couple of emails they agreed to come back and rewrite a map to give a bit more above 3000rpm which they did but warned me about the DMF. I agree that the original map may not have been 160hp but it felt better than the tuning map that was on the car at the time.

Don't you guys have any problems with clutch/flywheel. Did you go to a dyno to confirm this hp? And one guy above me talked about reliability... give gas to a remaped jtd.. and let's see how long your clutch, flywheel, suspension is going to last The thread is pointless, the abarth has a 2.4 and 20 30 hp more.. on the same car.. that's it... yes the jtd pulls better... but for like 2000 rmp.. and that's it... on the abarth you have 7.3..

you mean 6.3 (selespeed model anyway)

neonglow said:

Don't you guys have any problems with clutch/flywheel. Did you go to a dyno to confirm this hp? And one guy above me talked about reliability... give gas to a remaped jtd.. and let's see how long your clutch, flywheel, suspension is going to last The thread is pointless, the abarth has a 2.4 and 20 30 hp more.. on the same car.. that's it... yes the jtd pulls better... but for like 2000 rmp.. and that's it... on the abarth you have 7.3..

Click to expand...

I'm proposing that even with higher torque and power figures a remapped Diesel still won't outpace the abarth around town and possibly on a motorway.