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Old 17-07-2008   #1
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1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR or MAF?)

Hi!
I have 3d 1.9jtd 115km stilo (no chiptunning or sth).
In the City board computer shows between 7.8 ~ 9 l/100, outside the city I've never reached consumption below 6.5.
I spoke to some other owner of same engine and they told me that their stilo eats about 6~6.5 l/100km in the city and about 5.5 outside.

What make me sad also, when I accelerate, about 3000 rpm there is lots of dark smoke behind me car (I see it in my mirror).

Could you, dear Friends, advise me what to check and what to fix to optimize fuel consumption of my car and solve problem with the black smoke?

Regards,
Slavomir
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Old 20-07-2008   #2
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

Quote Originally Posted by Argonought View Post
If you're sure the intercooler pipework is good then you could try driving for a few days with the MAF sensor disconnected. If consumption improves then that's your problem.

Use Search to find more info if you need to.
Could you tell me please how to disconnect MAF sensor easily?
Can I do it myself or visiting Fiat service is required?

What about intercooler pipework? Where to find it? I've checked the pipe which is seen when wheels are turned left maximally. And the safety plastic engine cover is a little fat next to the pipe. I've touched the pipe and it wasn't wet but it's very dirty and has probably dried oil. But I'm not sure if it's a pipe you had advised to check.

Thanks in advance!
Slavomir
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Old 22-07-2008   #3
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

Hi Slavomir,

If you are my fellow countryman, from eastern Europe (read Serbia), than there should not be too much to bother you. Mine is on 7~8 l/100km (town) and 5,6~6 l/100km (highway) depending on how fast I;m driving and/or Aircon is on.

The thing is quite clear; if your car isn't loosing oil and has good acceleration,
than it's a bad fuel that you use.

It can be that MAF sensor as "Argonought" stated, or even a bad turbine.

Anyway, read my consumption on this post:
https://www.fiatforum.com/stilo-tech...ussion-10.html

Pozdrav.
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Old 22-07-2008   #4
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

Slavomir,

I have the same problem with the smoke, and i already bought the intercooler pipe (about 40EUR) to change it in few days along with the "big servicing".
I hope it will help!

It is positioned on the right top side of the engine and if there is an oil spill on it and the engine plastic cover, it is broken for sure (where is transiting from oval to round shape before the connection with three screws to the engine)

Regarding consumption - 7.6 to 7.7 in City, driving with A/C on (hot days in Belgrade), Higway - 90kmph - 4l ; 120kmph - 5.5l.

Well, that's it!
I hope that it will be less smoke and more fun after the replacement!

C.U.,
Ivan
1.9 jtd, 115HP, 2005., Dynamic, 5 door, 16" wheels, Olive gray...what to say...
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Old 24-07-2008   #5
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

Ivan!
Thanks for your info.
I will try to change that intercooler pipe.
Could you update me if chaning that pipe will help in sth?

I feel that my car is very weak before the turbo start (about 2000 rpm).
Below 2000 rpm it's accelerating like a tortoise...

I wanted to disable MAF but I don't know where to find it....
Any ideas?

Thanks,
Slavomir
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Old 27-07-2008   #6
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

Quote Originally Posted by slavomir View Post
Ivan!
Thanks for your info.
I will try to change that intercooler pipe.
Could you update me if chaning that pipe will help in sth?

I feel that my car is very weak before the turbo start (about 2000 rpm).
Below 2000 rpm it's accelerating like a tortoise...

I wanted to disable MAF but I don't know where to find it....
Any ideas?

Thanks,
Slavomir
Slavomir!

On saturday i did the big servicing (belts, all of the spanners, oil, all filters changed) and also the intercooler tube replaced!

Two more things done: MAF sensor cleaned, and GER (EGR?) valve shut off!

What happened after that:
1. Consumption fallen to 7.0 l/100km in the City! (-10%);
2. Smoke really reduced to the minimum (no clouds, clean exshaust);
3. The car is better accelerating when starting in 1st gear and up to 2000rpm (can't tell about the HP gain, but doesn't matter!)

Placement:
MAF sensor's connector is placed under the engine plastic cover, behind the injection system, and GER is a valve also placed behind the injection system (cylindrical, with the ribbed tube to the right).

I am warmly recommending a.m. works for your car, IT MUST HELP!
Although it's not cheap...

Thats' my experience (for two days of driving),
and now i can enjoy driving my fixed STILO!

Best regards!
Ivan.

1.9 jtd, 115HP, 2005., Dynamic, 5 door, 16" wheels, Olive gray...what to say...
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Old 28-07-2008   #7
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Lightbulb re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

I see you guys need some help on finding the MAF sensor.

Here it is

...right in the middle with the yellow clip on the side (battery is on right side).

To remove, push the clips together to disengage the latch and then simply pull off. It's a 30 sec job you can do in any laybye. You can put if back even quicker. I strongly recommend protecting both the plug end and socket with say a plastic bag if you intend traveling any distance with it disconnected

As regards to blocking off the EGR valve. This only makes sense if the valve is faulty. If poor fuel economy was due to a split in the intercooler pipe then you'll have done yourself no favours by blocking off the EGR since this contributes to good fuel economy anyway



@Ivan, sounds like you've found and cleaned the MAP sensor which is at the position you describe (but no where near the MAF sensor)
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Last edited by Argonought; 28-07-2008 at 09:28.
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Old 28-07-2008   #8
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

Yeah, MAP not MAF sensor! My mistake!

Regarding the EGR valve, i'll see what to do yet!

ARGONOUGTH, thanks for your detailed info (with the picture and the explanation!)

Regards, Ivan.
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Old 29-07-2008   #9
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

Quote Originally Posted by ivan73 View Post
Slavomir!

On saturday i did the big servicing (belts, all of the spanners, oil, all filters changed) and also the intercooler tube replaced!
Ivan!
Thank you a lot for your info. I will try to fix my car next week after weekend and will let you know what si the result.

Thank you once again,
Slavomir

Regards from Krakow (Poland)
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Old 10-08-2008   #10
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

Hi There!
I took pictures of my pipes in engine chamber which has oil well seen on them.
One pipe if the pipe from : MAF sensor to ???
Second is the pipe which is partly covered by the plastic safe cover mounted under the engine.

Could you tell me the parts number of exact names? Is it definitely intercooler pipe?

I will try to change them first as replacing MAF sensor and EGR fiat service wanted almost 350 euros...

How do you think? Could it be the reason of low power below 2000 rpm, big fuel consumption and black smoke during acceleration?

Regards,
Slavomir

pipe from maf :
intercooler pipe? :
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Last edited by slavomir; 10-08-2008 at 14:28. Reason: forgto about photos
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Old 10-08-2008   #11
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

Pipe you've outlined is the vapour trap pipe. Best to check it's not split as that might explain where the oil is coming from.

Unless you've got money to burn I wouldn't just change things for the fun of it

You should hear the air escaping from the intercooler pipe (from underneath) and there's no point changing it if you can't.

Same applies to MAF and EGR valve - only change if you have evidence they're suspect.

You haven't yet mentioned what happend when you disconnected the MAF sensor
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Old 10-08-2008   #12
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

What about blot of oil on the engine cover shown on the second picture?
I'm not sure what is broken (and when I should hear the air? is it loud?) but have mentioned problems :
- smoke
- lack of power below 2000 rpm
- big fuel consumption.

I didn't unpluged MAF sensor yet.

Do you think is it worth to change those pipes if they are in oil?
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Old 10-08-2008   #13
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

I can't really make out that 2nd photo but I'm sure you'd hear a problem with the intercooler pipework if you had one, as I think it's fairly loud, so I guess you don't.

You should test the MAF as I've already described.

Can't really see the EGR causing the problems you mention and in any case it would make more sense to clean it or block it off before fitting a new one.

All of these issues have been covered very thoroughly in previous posts so don't forget to use the Search tool to get more info
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Old 10-08-2008   #14
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

the second picture is NSR view of the pipe from turbo to intercooler.
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Old 11-08-2008   #15
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re: 1.9 jtd 115 - poor mpg & black smoke (EGR stuck?)

Ah yes, I see it now (strange angle).

It's extremely common for that pipe to get covered in oil so I'd get some GUNK (as called in the UK) and give the whole lot a good clean.

If you were that close to it I'm sure you'd hear the leak (with someone blipping the throttle)
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