Technical Punto 55 S, what have I bought (problems)

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Technical Punto 55 S, what have I bought (problems)

belgrade_punto

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Feb 3, 2004
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Belgrade, Yugoslavia.
First, to say, that I'm so surprised with this forum. It's really something super.

I have bought (imported from Germany) 2nd hand: Punto 55S engine 176B2.000, 1108 cm from 1997. I'm beginner driver and quite inexperienced with car mechanics. Please, advise me before going again to garage. I have read that even people in West Europe with all customer protection laws are having significant problems with servicing then you can imagine how it looks like in East Europe.

Odometer shows 73000 km with last service stamped around 63000 km in the checkbook.

When should I change teeth belt (or cam belt, timing belt what's the correct term)? As I understood it's in the motor. Is it possible to check is it for replacement? Does it create damage if it breaks?

I have driven it so far for only 400 km, because of constant problems. I have to change both rear shock absorbers and some silent blocks. I also have to change some pipe going from motor to catalyst. These were easy noticeable problems. But, there's more.

- Temperature was around zero Celsius (32 F), I made a short drive around 4 km at most, stopped, turn off the engine and fan started to roll. How? Later, in the garage where I changed the oil and coolant told me nothing to worry about it and that I should start worrying when it's not turning on. OK I though it just starts a little earlier, wasn't noticing the fan again, drove with heating on in cabin just a few times waiting for salary to pay additional repairs. But, today is around 12 degrees (53 F) outside; heating was not turned on though it's working correctly and again, the same thing after just 15km drive. I heard the fan, after motor turned off. I opened motor bay. Nothing was smoking but for sure it was hot. The upper and lower pipes where very hot, radiator warm. I opened that plastic bowl with coolant and some smoke went out. Is my motor overheating? How to find out, there is no temp. gauge on the dashboard. What should I expect in the summer, head gasket blow ballad or it’s already done. That one really frights me a lot. Anyone has some trick on installing a temp. gauge in cheap Puntos or idea what’s going on here.

- There are no leak drops on the pavement underneath where car was parked for days. But, there is tiny oil film covering top of the motor. How important is this and how to fix it?

- Clutch and gear changes. When motor is off, no problem. I can put it in any gear with two fingers. I really like the gearbox set-up and Punto in general. But, in driving after some time and from time to time I have a problem when shifting from 3rd to 2nd or from 3rd to 1st gear. No strange noises, it just does not want to step into gear from neutral position. Furthermore, sometimes depressing the clutch pedal is not so smooth. It glides and then I feel small bump, like it's cracking something. Clutch to replace or could be something smaller?

- Fuel gauge, is it normal to show different values depending is it on flat or climbing up the hill? It's really funny and untrusting.

Buying it was a big investment for us. So many problems makes me asking was it a disaster purchase and what else to expect. How to check is it at least motor in solid state. There are some very small vibrations on the wheel while idling. On the other side even under -10 it was starting in a second with no problem. I don't mind to invest in repairs but is it worthy or I should sell it asap.

Thank you all...
 
Welcome. Your English is excellent - an example to us all.

Cam Belt: If you don't know that it's been changed - change it asap - it's not very expensive to chnage, but if it snaps - then there are varying opinions as to how much carnage it will cause from 'some' to 'lots'. Best not to chance it. Might be an idea to change the Cam Belt Tensioner at the same time - they have a tendancy to give up slowly - they start to squeal when the car is cold.

Hot Engine: Sounds like your radiator might be partially blocked. Might be an idea to drain coolant and backflush it to see if you can remove some debris. The other possible explanation is that the thermostat isn't working properly - I forget the procedure for checking this, but I'm sure someone will advise you soon.

Oil Film: Might be the Cam Carrier Box Gasket - they sometimes fail. I don't think it's critical unless the oil is really pouring out. Try cleaning the engine with a degreasent and find the source of the oil?

Clutch and Gearchange: Known issues for the Punto. People seem to 'suffer' these problems for a long time before any failures occur. The clutch one, I'm not so sure about - mine is smooth all the way to the bottom. If the clutch is cable operated then the cable might be damaged. Or is it hydraulic? Not sure?

Varying Fuel gauge: Yes - mine gives a vague idea of how much fuel is in the tank, but there is no way youd describe it as precise!

Good luck




Here come da judge...
 
hi there welcome to forum.

the cambelt i would change i know on the mk2 punto its supposed to be changed at around 60000 on mine. better to be safe then sorry.

the gear box thing i beleive is a common problem. i have a 2001 and sometimes it hard going 2nd to 1st.

the fuel gage is completly normaly it will vary depending if you are on a slope or flat level ground.

the temperature thing could be blocked radiator or an airlock. if you can try draining it and flushing it through then refill making sure you use correct amount of anti-freeze in it and watch out for airlocks. also be carefull when opening the platic bottle if its hot it can spray out and burn. the smoke you saw was probbaly steam from being hot. oh one more thing make sure the water is not brown and a lil sludgy if the water is brown and sludgy then your head gasket has gone and water is getting in the coolant system. blown head gaskets can also casue over heating.

the oily film does not sound to bad. if its not leaking on to floor then i would not worry to much.
 
Thank you all for quick and most helpful replies.

Belts: Cam belt, timing belt, teeth belt? All same thing or I have all three in my motor? I'm still confused with belts and terms. I have an owner’s handbook but German one, which I don't understand. I notice some squeals on cold which comes I think from the starter unit (alternator). Belt itself looks as brand new, but who knows. In some of the posts I have read that 1.2 8v engine is "safe", I though 1.1 is safe, too. But, for sure, I will change that belt, now.

Overheating: It was already too dark when I got back home for a good look at plastic bottle. Further, I have found good instructions how to test thermostat, which I will do. Can I check for air blocks and radiator blocks without draining the coolant? I'm still learning how to detect the problems on my own, so I'm quite unwilling to do any do yourself repairs at this stage. My goal is to reach the phase where servicemen’s cannot fool me around.

Gearbox/Clutch: Meanwhile, I found good thread about gearbox and I have done a test of the clutch. Stop on flat, shift to 3rd, no touching gas pedal, slowly releasing the clutch pedal, car starts to move forwards easily. As I read, this is a proof that clutch is ok. Few days ago, the serviceman has told me that my clutch disk is worn, that I should change it ASAP and it will eliminate the gearbox problems and clutch "bumps", too. I don't know do I have hydraulic or cable operated clutch. I notice that brake is having some "servo".

Oil film: Clean and find the source...

The fuel gauge performance: I haven't notice the same behaviour on other cars, really looks so funny the way it is on Punto. But, I will get used with it...
 
The most common term for the belt is "cambelt", "timing belt" meand the exact same thing. "Teeth belt" isn't a term I've heard before, stick to cambelt or timing belt :)
Squealing on a cold engine is usually the cambelt tensioner, which is a relatively cheap and easy part to replace.
To check the overheating, run the engine until it reaches the normal running temperature (about halfway up the temp gauge). At this point, both the top and bottom hoses running from engine to radiator should be too hot to touch; and eventually the fan should start running (the temp gauge should be below 3/4 of the way up when the fan starts).
And most cars have the same fuel gauge issues, it's caused by the fuel surging to one end of the tank under accelaration, braking or cornering. It's at its most accurate when the car has been stationary on level ground for a few minutes.

------/F/I/A/T/------

Fart In A Tin
<font color="orange">1994 Punto 55SX, metallic red, small, Italian and beautiful! </font id="orange">
 
Belts: "teeth belt" is not a valid term. I made a mistake. Should write toothed belt that's what I got by google translation from German to English. Anyway, I found that part and translation says 105 Kkm, which should be around 60 K miles that you have told me. Strange, servicman told me 60 K but kilometres. So, I should be safe next 10-15 Kkm.

Clutch/Gearbox: I've checked the clutch on mine own with 3rd gear test; a colleague who is professional driver did it, too. Final conclusion: excellent. But, I still don't know why it's clicking, sometimes. How to know is it cable or hydraulic and what difference does it make? Gearbox problem should be "synchronisers thing". I have managed to adopt driving style and now it's much easier.

Overheating: Maybe, I was just overreacting. I have checked the way it goes, bottom pipe, upper pipe, cold, hot, etc. Everything went as explained to be correct. Still, I cannot believe that there is no temp. gauge, even all Yugo's are having it since ever. Water in the plastic box crystal clear, I can see all down, level up to Max.

Squealing belt: I've advised to "soap" the starter belt and to listen in order to find out, which one is squealing.
 
Hi your serviceman is right the belt should be checked at 60K and replaced if worn or damaged.Do not worry about the belt breaking because the engine is fail safe basically there is no internal damage caused.
Fit a new belt and good as new.
David coupe 20vt
 
>>Hi your serviceman is right the belt should be checked at 60K and
>>replaced if worn or damaged.

I asked him when it's time for replacement and can he check is it already replaced, because I have a stamp for 60 Kkm service in the checkbox from the authorized Fiat garage. He told me: 60 Kkm is time to replace, no it's not possible to check its status. It might looks brand new but still to brake, tomorrow morning.

>>Do not worry about the belt breaking because the engine is fail
>>safe basically there is no internal damage caused.

Are you sure this counts for 1.1 engines, too. Btw. is 176B2.000 "fire" motor? I've been asked once "do you have fire motor on your Punto".

>>Fit a new belt and good as new.

I know it's the best, but I'm still without garage that I would trust. I've read here posts of people who got broken belt after replacing it in some local garages.
 
Yes, the 1108cc unit is one of the original FIRE engines build entirely by Robot in Fiat's purpose-built factory. They are generally very reliable. I also have this engine in mine.

My own personal opinion is that the 1.1 is safe generally, but it is better not to risk breaking the belt if it can be avoided. You've done the right thing in having it changed. This opinion comes from a discussion I had with my mechanic.

I don't know too much about how Belgrade is fairing lately but I'm guessing mechanics are going to be fairly inexperienced in many cases, and perhaps not certain of the best methods of fitting various things. It may be difficult for them to get hold of Fiat specifications for repair jobs? I'm sorry to say I'm really quite ignorant of standards in a country so relatively close to us.

Spirito di Punto | M-reg 55SX, black, 5dr. Clear repeaters. Remote locking fitted, no light confirmation yet though - need relay fitted
 
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