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Old 09-04-2014   #1
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Question Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

After getting a new front lower suspension arm fitted to my Punto I took it to have the tracking checked and adjusted. However they couldn't free the locking nut (pictured below). They put the blow torch on it but no good, said they could try fitting a new track rod end, though it might need the inner one as well.

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Name:	TrackRodLockNut2.jpg
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Size:	102.5 KB
ID:	134037

Wondering about tackling the job myself. I have the Haynes manual but it only covers the basics of removing the track rod end (splitting the ball joint, counting the number of turns to undo the end, etc). I've looked at similar posts but not found very much about the inner rod so would value any advice/hints/tips. In particular:

Is it worth trying to replace just the track rod end? If so what would be the best way to separate this from the inner rod?

Would it be easier to replace the inner and outer parts together? If so how do you detach the inner rod from the steering rack -- the joint (picture below) doesn't seem to have any flats to put a spanner (or crow's foot) on. Also, I gather it is likely to have threadlocker applied - how difficult will that make it to unscrew - has anyone done this?

Click image for larger version

Name:	InnerTrackRod.jpg
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Thanks!
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Old 09-04-2014   #2
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

Quote Originally Posted by PuntoR60SX View Post
After getting a new front lower suspension arm fitted to my Punto I took it to have the tracking checked and adjusted. However they couldn't free the locking nut (pictured below). They put the blow torch on it but no good, said they could try fitting a new track rod end, though it might need the inner one as well.

Attachment 134037

Wondering about tackling the job myself. I have the Haynes manual but it only covers the basics of removing the track rod end (splitting the ball joint, counting the number of turns to undo the end, etc). I've looked at similar posts but not found very much about the inner rod so would value any advice/hints/tips. In particular:

Is it worth trying to replace just the track rod end? If so what would be the best way to separate this from the inner rod?

Would it be easier to replace the inner and outer parts together? If so how do you detach the inner rod from the steering rack -- the joint (picture below) doesn't seem to have any flats to put a spanner (or crow's foot) on. Also, I gather it is likely to have threadlocker applied - how difficult will that make it to unscrew - has anyone done this?

Attachment 134038

Thanks!
there is a special tool for the inner tie rods,

in the past ive just used stilson's or used an old exhaust clamp.
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Old 09-04-2014   #3
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

when i had seized brake pipe bolts i took them to a guy i know to heat them up, they would undo easy
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Old 09-04-2014   #4
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

If a garage has heated (red heat?)up the lock nut and it still wont undo it's unlikely you can do anything at home with a pair of axle stands and set of spanners. Some jobs are best left to a garage.
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Old 09-04-2014   #5
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

Quote Originally Posted by PuntoR60SX View Post
how difficult will that make it to unscrew - has anyone done this?

Attachment 134038

Thanks!
water pump pliers should undo the inner if you can get them in there i cant remember how much room there is on a punto. i undid my cromer one with mole grips
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Old 09-04-2014   #6
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

I usually use stilsons but, as said above, it can be a struggle on the drive and if you're not confident then safety related stuff like this is best left to a garage.
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Old 10-04-2014   #7
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

Quote Originally Posted by PuntoR60SX View Post
They put the blow torch on it but no good
Do you mean a blow torch, or proper oxy-acetylene gear? Working on bolts that have been in place since 1918, there's not many that proper oxy-acetylene gear won't shift. Simple propane torches have failed many a time to get the job done though.
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Old 11-04-2014   #8
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

Quote Originally Posted by oldhammer View Post
there is a special tool for the inner tie rods,

in the past ive just used stilson's or used an old exhaust clamp.
Ah, something like this ...

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Old 11-04-2014   #9
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

That's one type, others are a tube like device that slips over the end and grips when turned.
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Old 11-04-2014   #10
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

Quote Originally Posted by PuntoR60SX View Post
Ah, something like this ...

Attachment 134246
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Old 12-04-2014   #11
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

Quote Originally Posted by MikeSalt View Post
Do you mean a blow torch, or proper oxy-acetylene gear? Working on bolts that have been in place since 1918, there's not many that proper oxy-acetylene gear won't shift. Simple propane torches have failed many a time to get the job done though.
Not 100% sure. They said they were having trouble getting a good grip on the nut itself as well. To be fair I was there for the tracking so I suppose they were limited in how much time they could reasonably spend working on it.
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Old 12-04-2014   #12
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

I have had to apply heat to literally every turn of a track rod end on many occasions, again IMO if you haven't the proper tools/ramps and the track rod end nut is probably now rounded get garage to do it, it wont be expensive.
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Old 12-04-2014   #13
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

new innder rod is less than a tenner delivered, just pop the outer out of the hub and remove the whole lot, steel wont be all soft from heat then

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FIAT-PUNTO...-/400562412150

new outer about a fiver http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TIE-TRACK-...-/111303062033
so cheap may as well do both sides
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Old 12-04-2014   #14
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

Quote Originally Posted by PuntoR60SX View Post
Not 100% sure. They said they were having trouble getting a good grip on the nut itself as well. To be fair I was there for the tracking so I suppose they were limited in how much time they could reasonably spend working on it.
by looks of the picture youve posted above
your mechanic friends have heated that up until glowing red.

if heat dont move it nothing will,

replace inner tie rod they is not expensive.,

by the time youve paid out in more labour costs trying to undue something that is obviously welded with age /rust and heat it aint worth it
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Old 12-04-2014   #15
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Re: Track rod (tie rod) lock nut seized up - repair options?

Dont forget to get the tracking done afterwards!
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