Technical Punto intermittent stalling ?

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Technical Punto intermittent stalling ?

petel

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Hello All. Has anyone seen this before please?

1996 Punto, 1108, 8v, 72000 miles, good condition overall. Passed MOT just before Xmas with no problems so emissions within acceptable limits.

Engine has begun to stall without warning, never know when it is going to happen. Prone to doing this after coasting approach to junction or roundabout. Engine is generally quiet and if concentrating on traffic, stall can be unnoticed until attempting to pull away.

Owner asked me to look the car over. Plugs, leads, oil levels all OK, connectors from Lamda and other sensors pulled and Electrosprayed, ECU reset done, problem persists.

How about fuel filter or fuel pump or could this be ignition? Punto's have been about since 1994, so this must have come up before. If anyone has had this problem and been able to identify the cause, would be most grateful to hear of it.
Thank you.
 
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Hello All. Has anyone seen this before please?

1996 Punto, 1108, 8v, 72000 miles, good condition overall. Passed MOT just before Xmas with no problems so emissions within acceptable limits.

Engine has begun to stall without warning, never know when it is going to happen. Prone to doing this after coasting approach to junction or roundabout. Engine is generally quiet and if concentrating on traffic, stall can be unnoticed until attempting to pull away.

Owner asked me to look the car over. Plugs, leads, oil levels all OK, connectors from Lamda and other sensors pulled and Electrosprayed, ECU reset done, problem persists.

How about fuel filter or fuel pump or could this be ignition? Punto's have been about since 1994, so this must have come up before. If anyone has had this problem and been able to indentify the cause, would be gratefull to hear of it.
Thank you.

things to check,

coolant level ok?.. not loosing any
does it idle ok normally?

fuel pipe from left hand side of bulkhead behind the brake fluid resevoir to fuel rail ok?.. they can kink, as they are made of same plastic as the brake servo vacuum pipe.. not a common problem but 1 I encountered.. it starved the engine of fuel

MAF clean?
Throttle body clean?

checked for vacuum leaks?
 
Thank you for your reply.

Have had suggestion that this could be a problem with the idle stepper motor.
Can anyone confirm this from personal experience please?
Thank you
 
Hello Sqwidge.
Thank you for your reply.

Could I please enquire, when you say " That should sort it " are you speaking from personal experience?
Thank you
 
Finally a question I know the answer to. I had the exact same problem with my t Reg 1.2 8v punto about a month ago and yes it is really bloody annoying especially if your first in line at a set of lights and you realise you have no power. Do you also have the problem that after stalling it won't restart for a while? The sensor that is by your timing belt needs replacing. 25 pound at the most from euro car parts and your punto should be running sweet again.
Hope this helps just wish I knew the name of the sensor, I'm pretty sure its called a cam belt sensor.

Ian
 
Many thanks Ian for your reply.

The lady owner assures me that when this occurs, the car restarts immediately but she is becoming increasingly concerned that one day, she will be rear ended as a result of the stall.

I have already removed and cleaned the crankshaft TDC sensor, pulled the wiring loom connector, cleaned it, electrolubed it and worked it multiple times, all to no avail in this case.

Nonetheless, many thanks for your input.
Thank you.
 
Hi All,

Im having the same problem with my 03 punto mk2 1.2 16v but i have problems with engine management (lambda and map sensors) I have changed the sensors but seem to have the same things coming back.

Does anybody have a definate answer to this? If it is the CAM belt sensor as previously said does it need a new CAM belt?

Tony
 
Yes I speak from personal experience, have a look in guides for my throttle body guide.

Hi Sqwidge,

Just read your guide. Is the butterfly/gear easy to get wrong? I think i need to clean my tb as the car was running rich for months so is probably all coked up which could be my reason for stalling. Im just worried that it i take it off I wont be able to put it back together

also, sorry stupid question but what does my ECU look like? is it the box with the two big plugs going into it by the right hand top corner of the airbox?

Tony
 
Hi Tony, it easy to get wrong as it fits all ways so mark it on the butterfly and on the holder before you dismantle it so that you get it in the right way when you rebuild it.
If you forget to mark it or the mark comes off then the easy way to do it is fit it and then shut the butterfly fully, if it seals its the right way and in its natural position it will be a smidge open, the other thing you will notice if fitted wrongly is that your car will start fine but it won't rev properly if at all.

The ecu on mine is a slim silver rectangular shape but is as you describe with 2 big black plugs plugged into it next to upper right corner of airbox, it actually bolts to a frame which bolts to the TB so is actually above the TB, the guide is for a 16v, not seen an 8v (if you have one) but should imagine it would be the same or similar.
 
i would be looking for a vacuum leak somewhere,ie a split pipe on the engine at the induction side

I did have a mechanic tell me this morning lambda and map fault codes are usually caused by an air leak somewhere. Can you be a bit more specific about where this pipe is and how I could test the system for leaks? im not really a mechanic if you cant tell but im tryign to save myself some cash by doing it myself

Tony
 
Clean the TB first, I had the same two things giving codes when mine did it, ended up buying a 2nd hand map sensor and £70 lambda that I didn't need! when you get carbon build up on your butterfly it effects the airflow which causes the two things listed above to give off the wrong readings, if you have an EML then you will notice that this will come on then after 3 ignition cycles over 1 minute each that it'll go off and then come on again.
Either way cleaning your TB will do it nothing but good.

Edit: Do you have an 8v or a 16v?
 
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I have an 03 16v sporting so im working with the same as you as described in your guide. If I mess with the gear this could leave the butterfly open the wrong amount is this correct? so best not to mess with this as I dont really know what im doing i'll just give it a good clean on the weekend.

Also do i need the star and inverted star tools? or can i get away with the correct sized philips screwdriver like i did when changing my MAP sensor?

Tony
 
You need the correct fastener tools. get a universal screwdriver kit with interchangeable tips for the smaller jobs.

For air leaks check out at the small rubber breather pipes (coming from the top of the engine) for splits or disconnected.
 
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Dont wory about the butterfly, if you fit it wrong it wont harm your car it'll either rev up and down like a yoyo or not rev at all and will remain at 800rpm on stock tick over, ask me how I know :)
Just mark it before you take it out and you will be fine, use a perm marker or tipex or something, anything that can help you identify the parts and the way to be seated but is removable, I've stripped mine so far back that it shone like a new penny and reassembled it and this was without any knowledge and before I got the manual!

Its best to get the proper tools they are cheap from Halfords and will save you carving up anything you need.

As for air leaks, there are two main pipes, one from rocker cover to airbox (wont really do owt as if memory serves its located before the map sensor anyway) and the other on the rear of the manifold, I can check if you get stuck with anything as I have a Haynes manual, so do the TB clean and if you have any problems after that ie it has made no difference let me know and we'll go through every pipe step by step, but I'm willing to bet this will help you.

Do you have an Engine Management Light (EML) and does it go on and off?
 
You need the correct fastener tools. get a universal screwdriver kit with interchangeable tips for the smaller jobs.

For air leaks check out at the small rubber breather pipes (coming from the top of the engine) for splits or disconnected.

Ironically the small 3 way pipe from the top of the engine split a few months back and after a wait from fiat this was changed. I'll have to check it again make sure its fitted correctly.
 
Dont wory about the butterfly, if you fit it wrong it wont harm your car it'll either rev up and down like a yoyo or not rev at all and will remain at 800rpm on stock tick over, ask me how I know :)
Just mark it before you take it out and you will be fine, use a perm marker or tipex or something, anything that can help you identify the parts and the way to be seated but is removable, I've stripped mine so far back that it shone like a new penny and reassembled it and this was without any knowledge and before I got the manual!

Its best to get the proper tools they are cheap from Halfords and will save you carving up anything you need.

As for air leaks, there are two main pipes, one from rocker cover to airbox (wont really do owt as if memory serves its located before the map sensor anyway) and the other on the rear of the manifold, I can check if you get stuck with anything as I have a Haynes manual, so do the TB clean and if you have any problems after that ie it has made no difference let me know and we'll go through every pipe step by step, but I'm willing to bet this will help you.

Do you have an Engine Management Light (EML) and does it go on and off?

cheers for the offer :)

i'll get down the local halfords and get me some carbcleaner and a some extra soxkets to make sure i got the E and T bits

will let you know at the weekend how it goes

Tony
 
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