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Old 14-10-2009   #1
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Cam Belt timing

Could someone give me a quick rundown of how to check the timing on the 1.2 8v.
My car has lost power since a garage did the cam belt change a couple of weeks ago. It has no power at low revs and jerky power delivery especially when I dip the clutch. Have stalled it several times and never did before. Still runs up to 70MPH okay and is fine once past about 3,500 rpm. I guess I'm going to require a torque wrench to re-tighten the tensioner if it is out?
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Old 14-10-2009   #2
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Re: Cam Belt timing

Me and my Dad recently had to time mine up again the other day as we were replacing the crankshaft oil seal..
Please excuse the lack of technical terms, I am fairly new to engine components! lol
You will need to remove the 3 bolts holding the alternator pulley to gain access to the crankshaft pulley - on the crankshaft pulley there is a roughly 2cm line indicating the timing mark.. We had trouble figuring out where the timing marks were on the oil pump but it is very hard to explain, from the ground upwards it is at about 10 oclock so pretty much facing the drivers steering wheel area, it's a smooth surface then it has like a lip on it. Perhaps if you were to take some photos of the area around the crankshaft pulley I can MS paint where the timing mark is. Luckily mine was tippexed from previous useage.
The camshaft part is much easier... again it is at around 9 oclock this time towards drivers seat,, there are two notches on the rocker cover, the one above is where the rocker cover attaches but below that there is an indent about 5mm further down, this is the timing mark. So hard to explain over typing ha!
As for the tentioner, my Dads a mechanic on weekends as a hobby so he knew how tight the belt wanted to be, I pushed the tensioner whilst he tightened so that the belt springs back fairly fast when it is twisted 1/4 of a turn.
Any of that make sense? lol
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Old 14-10-2009   #3
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Re: Cam Belt timing

I just found some pics of it that Dave posted 5 years ago! lol
Crankshaft pulley


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Old 14-10-2009   #4
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Re: Cam Belt timing

Hi Dan,

Thanks for all the info, I haven't delved into the engine compartment yet, but your advise has spurned me on to check it out. It all makes sense so far. So I have lined up a little job for the weekend!

The loss of power is really irking me, the car was running perfectly before the service and now I'm getting overtaken by everything (even mopeds) at the lights!
Philip
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Old 14-10-2009   #5
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Re: Cam Belt timing

If you look closely at that picture you will see the crank pulley has 19 teeth my 02 plate mk2 has 23 teeth
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Old 14-10-2009   #6
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Re: Cam Belt timing

Quote Originally Posted by nigel_bytes View Post
If you look closely at that picture you will see the crank pulley has 19 teeth my 02 plate mk2 has 23 teeth
Interesting, I supplied a belt to the garage which came from an on-line retailer. And it had the wrong tooth pitch. Probably was a belt for the mk2 then.
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Old 14-10-2009   #7
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Re: Cam Belt timing

Just had a look at timing belt box, Gates powergrip 5545XS 129x15 1.2 8v 99 onwards
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Old 15-10-2009   #8
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Re: Cam Belt timing

Do not use the oil pump method to get the crankshaft at TDC !!!
Although this method is in the Haynes manual it will put the timing a tooth out.
Use the timing marks that are on the flywheel ,which is accessed via a rubber bung at the top of the bell housing. There are photos on this forum which show it clearly.
This is applicable to both Mk1 and Mk2 Puntos.
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Last edited by richardllew; 15-10-2009 at 00:17.
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Old 18-10-2009   #9
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Re: Cam Belt timing

Thank you for everyone's help. I used the flywheel method to check timing on the camshaft. The timing is exactly spot on, so the garage did the job properly.



For reference, I found this guide for the Panda and expect it to be very similar for the Punto, as its the same FIRE engine:
https://www.fiatforum.com/panda-guid...re-engine.html

Apart form a water pump, the only other thing the car had at the same time was a catalytic converter, so I'm leaning towards this being more restrictive than the old one by upping the back pressure.
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Old 20-10-2009   #10
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Re: Cam Belt timing

check all electrical connections/sensors have been refitted correctly and pushed home, particularly plug leads/firing order and ?renew sparkplugs; lambda sensor could also be the problem
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Old 20-10-2009   #11
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Re: Cam Belt timing

When the engine is at top dead centre on No1 cylinder, the cams should be both facing up. That is the buckets below should be in the between the start and end points of the inlet and exhaust cams.

On a twin cam they will be facing outwards (exhaust about to start lifting and inlet about the max distance away from lifting.

So on the 8V set the engine at TDC and lift the cam cover. If No 1 cam angles look symmetrical, the timing is ok.

As TT says, there are lots of other things to check before you get into heavy duty spannering.
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Last edited by DaveMcT; 20-10-2009 at 11:36. Reason: tyrping
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Old 19-07-2015   #12
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Re: Cam Belt timing

ever since i changed sump few months back, car isnt running as it was before, like its running rough on idle and also makes strange sound when started which wasnt there before

only thing i touched was timing belt, so i had to time it

today i timed it again via hole in gearbox and cam notch as seen on those panda pictures



are these correct timing marks for punto?

if that timing is correct what else can be causing car to run rough immediately after sump change

no errors shown in mes, i tried few other parts from my donor: coil packs, crank sensor, also disconnected lambda and it is same

a real mystery
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Old 21-07-2015   #13
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Re: Cam Belt timing

tried all other variations on gearbox 15 10 5 and still struggles to start hard

tried other spark plugs too

wat ze hel is hapening
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Old 21-07-2015   #14
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Re: Cam Belt timing

i would say looking them pics (although they are tiny and hard to see) that your cam is not right and it should be clockwise a tooth. See pic below, appears to me you have it on the lowest mark making it a tooth out, might just be the angle and fact the pic is small though i suppose

Can't comment on the mark on gearbox side, i have never used it, only the mark on the crank pulley

here is pics from the manual
cam
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crank
Click image for larger version

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Old 21-07-2015   #15
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it started after 15sec of cranking
injector light was on for like 10sec
plugged it to mes and it showed lambda error
Disconecting lambda doesnt do anything

tries to stall , when car is in gear and i try to take off there is metal noise in engine, rough idle
got enough oil in engine
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