Hi folks
daughter was gong home in the punto and it broke down on A1,
AA towed it back to me (luck me, as if I don't have enough to do)
lifted bonnet lots of water about due to leak from back of water pump (still waiting on her getting the rubber O ring to fix it)
could not get laptop to work so could not read codes,
took off Cambelt & Crankshaft sensors and gave them a wipe, tried to start car, but it just turned out, would not start
found a new charger for laptop so connected lappy to car
fault codes P1325 Knock sensor P0170 Fuel trim malfunction bank 1
cleared codes but car still will not start, but no codes showing now


anyone give me a guide on what to look at now, will need spoon feeding here
I've retired now and I think my brain is falling about
thanks

God knows! I'd guess the fault codes are a red herring, neither of those should stop it running. I presume the AA did their usual shoulder shrug and said "dunno" instead of offering anything usefull? Pop a plug out & check for spark/fuel and take it from there.

Is the key code light going out after like 2seconds?


Ziggy

not sure about key code light, I'll check later, as battery is low and needs charging
I'll remove live and earth cables to discharge the ECU, in case it holding a fault
will also check the plugs again once battery is re-charged


its an 02 reg, 8V 1200cc punto mk2


just re-reading other threads on P0170 fault codes on here, can this fault cover lots of faults
ie my p0170 said "fuel trim malfunction bank 1"
in another thread the P0170 fault said "low fuel"
etc
or is that just a red herring?

Probably. It just means the ECU has trying to compensate for too little/much fuel at some stage, it may have been set months ago.

if it's any help at all the relay under bonnet,09 controls fuel injection. I have fault codes come up And once it wouldn't start so I took relay for fuel injection Out and back in again and it works ok. Check them all

key code light goes out after few seconds
fuel pump run's but not for long.
no new fault codes stored
checked with multimeter
crankshaft sensor plug connections 1-2 = 1187 ohms 1-3 & 2-3 = open circuit
camshaft sensor (on top of engine) all open circuit = no reads to each other
(similar readings I've seen in another thread)


spark at plugs ok, but no fuel showing on plugs after engine been turned over.
will go back and check fuses & relay's
can someone tell me which pipe to remove to check fuel coming to injector body.


one thing I did notice was spark plugs were more a green/beige, instead of normal beige colour

green?

What colour is your engine coolant?

yes slight green tint, but not wet,
coolant is brown

ballboy said:

can someone tell me which pipe to remove to check fuel coming to injector body.

Click to expand...

Does the injector rail have a red cap covering a car tyre valve? Disconnect the battery, cover the valve with a cloth and push a small screwdriver thru the cloth against the pin in the center of the valve. It should be fairly highly pressurised so it needs to be done with caution. The injectors make quite a loud click when they work and you can pick that up with a long screwdriver against the injector and pressed against your ear when compared to nearby solid parts.

my one has a black cap
cover it press valve petrol pressure there not very high, only shot up to top of the valve,


checked fuse 22, ok
checked relay 9 tested it via connecting to battery works ok
car still not starting,


will have to wait till Mrs back to test injectors with screwdriver to hear sound


when I turn engine over I get 1 backfire "bang" still turning over nothing else, no start


sparkplugs not wet (no petrol ?) after turning over engine

ballboy said:

my one has a black cap
cover it press valve petrol pressure there not very high, only shot up to top of the valve,


checked fuse 22, ok
checked relay 9 tested it via connecting to battery works ok
car still not starting,


will have to wait till Mrs back to test injectors with screwdriver to hear sound


when I turn engine over I get 1 backfire "bang" still turning over nothing else, no start


sparkplugs not wet (no petrol ?) after turning over engine

Click to expand...

Not sure what you mean by petrol only shot up to top of valve. There should be 3.5Bar there so presumably you are saying it dribbled a bit?

When you turn the car on do you hear the petrol pump run under the back seat? it should audibly run for 5 seconds every single time you turn the ignition on.

Certain faults automatically disable the petrol pump as a safety feature but you are getting a spark. If the ecu knows the injector is not working probably you will get no fuel pressure. Have you dried the engine compartment?

i think pump doesnt run for 5 sec when you turn key once, maybe like 2-3sec

flisko said:

i think pump doesnt run for 5 sec when you turn key once, maybe like 2-3sec

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Well i recall others have said 5 seconds. Just measured mine at 4.93 and 5.05 seconds

like this?

1 mississippi, 2 mississippi, 3 mississippi, 4 mississippi, 5 mississippi

flisko said:

like this?

1 mississippi, 2 mississippi, 3 mississippi, 4 mississippi, 5 mississippi

Click to expand...

My ten year old cell phone has a built in stop watch. The hardest part was being able to turn the ignition on while operating the cell phone button with a delay to allow for the same delay i would react by when the pump turned off without simultaneously turning the engine off as the stop watch started. I had to do it about 3 times before i stopped turning the engine off!

On other threads the OP is talking about having a mk2 punto. Surprisingly there is a fuel cut out valve on the passenger side

https://www.fiatforum.com/punto-ii/199716-fuel-pump-not-working-punto-mk2-y-reg-1-2-8v.html

Or maybe this is called the inertia cut off valve and is also present on the mk2b in the same place. I have a left hand drive so it will be on the other side for RH Drive. Finger and toe marks the spot.

yes pump runs for around 4-5 secs
also hear it running as turning engine over
there is 1 backfire when I turned it over the first time (each first time) not 2nd time in a row.


water was all over the engine side of the bumper, when I got to car after it had broken down
I did not notice it when she came to me the day before after she had driven here, I had the bonnet up then as the rad fan bearings were noisey,
will recheck the spark plugs to see if they have fuel on them
wonder if I should get a compression tester in case that water had squirted out of head gasket
just grabbing at straws as not should what to check next

ballboy said:

yes pump runs for around 4-5 secs
also hear it running as turning engine over
there is 1 backfire when I turned it over the first time (each first time) not 2nd time in a row.


water was all over the engine side of the bumper, when I got to car after it had broken down
I did not notice it when she came to me the day before after she had driven here, I had the bonnet up then as the rad fan bearings were noisey,
will recheck the spark plugs to see if they have fuel on them
wonder if I should get a compression tester in case that water had squirted out of head gasket
just grabbing at straws as not should what to check next

Click to expand...

You need to clarify the apparent very low fuel pressure before you grab at more straws. If the pump runs and then you press the fuel valve as before what actually happens? Just a dribble or something representing 3.5Bar of pressure coming out of a relatively flexible fuel pipe system which will drive out a considerable amount of fuel?

Edit: I just tried this on my car and the results are not very spectacular. The sound was less than from opening a fizzy drink bottle and the petrol amount only a bit more than a dribble!

photos attached of spark plugs, can't see that green tint on it
also attached throttle photo, at bottom of throttle chamber there was what smells like burnt oil, which I expect came in view the rocker case breather pipe, the rubber which goes on the neck of the air filter also had lots of same oil on/in it
that has been in there since yesterday as filter is off, should the pistons have suck is in to the chambers as I turned the engine over ?
I clean the oil out and sprayed it with carb cleaner, turned the engine over and that is still siting in base of the throttle chamber


turned engine over turn engine off, and pressed the petrol valve this time squirt went into the air, so yes looks like pressure is there, but its only about a teaspoon full if that, not a tablespoon full.


checked all plug leads they all spark ok, listened to the injectors all clicking