Technical Clutch:to change or not to change? Mk2 8V

[shaun200765]

Clutch: to change or not to change? Mk2 8V

When I depress the clutch pedal with the engine stationary, the pedal gets to about half way down before making a big clicking sound from under the bonnet and a corresponding notchy feel from the pedal.

Its not much better when its running either although its not slipping at all and the gear changes are reasonable although I suspect its not disengaging properly and most likely causing the notchy 3rd gear I can feel each time

I'd put money on it being the release fingers being worn on the clutch diaphragm. I'm a little gutted really because I really look after the car and always give the clutch an easy time of it. But its not a new car and for all I know the previous owner may have sat there at junctions with their foot on the pedal or used it as a foot rest on journeys

So, dunno what to do now. Should I change it for a new one or bear with it until it gets worse?

The way I see it, its not going to be doing the gearbox any favours if its dragging between gears and if it fails completely then I will be in trouble if its a long way from home.

Not sure here guys? Thanks for any thoughts

Edit: Its only done about 45k miles

 

[MikeSalt]

Re: Clutch: to change or not to change? Mk2 8V

Change it now, a worn release bearing can burrow through the gearbox input shaft bearing, costing you a new rebuilt gearbox. Plus, it is inconvenient if the clutch goes on you.

 

[DaveMcT]

Re: Clutch: to change or not to change? Mk2 8V

That clutch has failed and if the gearbox shaft survives the clicking is telling you the pressure plate is about to fail totally and leave you stranded.

http://www.shop4parts.co.uk/?name=s...1&secondary=14&opts=51&btnViewProducts=Search

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/New-FIAT-Pand...CarParts_SM&hash=item335d88286f#ht_1438wt_809

Plus about £120 to have it fitted.

If the slave cylinder looks suspect change that too, though it could be done later if you prefer to see how it goes.

 

[shaun200765]

Thanks guys, new clutch it is then.

 

[BLKC99]

Hi there shaun200765, juts wanted to say these guys are absolutely right , i juts saw off my MK2 Punto a few months back, what a beast, served me for over three years.

I had a clutch go on my Punto MK2 and the symptons that you were describing were the exact same ones that I had. Unfortunately I got round in fixing the problem a tad late and nearly got stranded 30 miles away from home :tempt:.

Good tip for whoever has a clutch failure and does not fancy paying for a recovery truck like me and just wants to get home,

- Switch of your engine
- Ensure that the coast clear ahead of you, if not pull the handbrake down and try to push the car with someone to a safe position to set off.
- When ready flaten the clutch pedal and put it in to second gear
- Again, when ready to set off, start the engine, bring the clutch up and begin accelerating to no higher than 2000 rev`s so that the car can pick up momentum and begin moving.
- Once moving I would advise not to attempt to change gear
- For the traffic light stops, best thing to do is begin slowing right down to say 20 and 10 miles an hour with your foot flat down on the clutch pedal, way prior the lights as they have time second changes. This will avoid you to fully stop and have to begin the start up procedure again.

A bit of mad tip some might say but it worked for me

Here is a pic to show you what the pressure pedal looks like and give you a clue of what the clicking noise is all about:idea:.

 

[shaun200765]

Thank you mate Your advice is most welcome.

Your right about driving with no clutch, it can be done (twice for me now) but not something i'd like to repeat

I'll report back on here with pics hopefully when I see how bad it is.

I'm hoping to maybe take pictures of the whole clutch swap and if I can work out how to post pics properly i'd like to do a kind of "walk through" that maybe of help to others if I can

Thanks again for your advice though guys

 

[DaveMcT]

When the clutch is failing or failed its best to not use it at all, because broken pressure plate fingers can chew the gearbox shaft.

Some cars will will start in gear. Select 1st and turn the starter, the moment the engine fires press the accelerator and if its going to it will chug away. To change up pull on the gearlever (not too hard) and release the accelerator. As the gearbox unloads the gear will drop out then quickly move the lever into the next gear but dont force it. When the revs are right it will drop in. When the revs drop too much or you are too quick on the gearlever the synchromesh takes a hammering.

This will get you home but its easy to damage the gearbox, 2nd to 3rd is "a challenege" and downshifts are very hard to do as you have to match the revs. Get it right and it snicks in nicely. Get it wrong and you chew your gearbox synchromesh.

AA or RAC memberships are probably cheaper.

 

[BLKC99]

Blimey, I never thought or knew about the reproduction's involved, l had to carry out the procedure myself once as i described in my post, horrible and intense overall. I was told to try the gear slotting technique but unfortunately it did not work and i had to pull over on the motorway hard shoulder and fully stop and restart the start up procedure again as i lost complete gear .

If you want to know how to add pictures to your post, when clicking on a new post or reply to the threaded posts, when your text box appears, scroll down to attach files and click manage attachments. From there you can add pics from your desktop and URL`s.

 

[shaun200765]

Once I start the clutch swap i'll take pics and then i'll try what you suggest re posting pics and see if I can create a half decent how-to with torque settings for the important bits

Car not been driven since I wondered about the clutch failing.

All your imput (no pun intended) is well received guys

 

[paulm]

Have you started this yet mate. I'm probably gonna have to change mine soon and some advice would be much apprieciated.

 

[Brendan W]

Had the same clicking noise on our 1.2 8v at 42000 miles. Turned out a few of the tips of the release springs were broken - clutch plate itself was fine. Replaced the lot with an aftermarket kit - QH iirc. Developed a mystery oil leak from the top of the box afterwards which was the stud for the earth strap not refitted properly - hard to see as it's under the slave cylinder.Now past 76000 miles with no problems.

 

[DaveMcT]

My HGT clutch went lumpy at about 70,000. The pressure plate was failing.

Isnt there already a FF Guide for this?

 

[shaun200765]

Have you started this yet mate. I'm probably gonna have to change mine soon and some advice would be much apprieciated.

Hi mate

Weirdly, the clutch came in the post about an hour ago

Just a couple of daft little things to organise now and then after a look at the weather forecast i'll swap it over (fingers crossed).

As fas as a guide for a clutch swap, to be honest i've not yet looked but thats my next job.

Cheers guys

 

[red]

Guys,

I wrote "how to" guides for clutch on Mk2 (and also Mk1) - see "Guides". No pictures but step by step, having done clutches on both models. Same reasons for failure as you guys - bearing eating into tines on pressure plate.
The Mk2 failed completely about 1/4 mile from home - short tow. The Mk1 hadn't failed but was getting very hard to release. I renewed in the nick of time. There were several tines broken off.

red

 

[shaun200765]

Thanks Red, just about to have a look now

 

[DaveMcT]

Mine had a complete clutch kit, but it still releases close to the floor. Is it possible the operating lever is bent or worn? I had it done at a garage so never got a look at the parts.

 

[shaun200765]

Sorry Whitesei, not been on here since this morning.

In theory at least, any hydraulic clutch set up should be self adjusting and providing all is well with both cylinders then it should more or less look after itself. In theory

You've helped not only myself mate but most of everyone who has posted on here so i'm kinda looking to try and offer an opinion that'll do some good re your biting point. Struggling a bit if i'm honest though

If I had to have a bash though, deep breath and apologies in advance if I go on about stuff that's just obvious to everyone but me lol.

They way I understand it...in the clutch master cylinder there is a drilling part way down the bore, this is connected to the fluid reservoir.

Providing the piston is at its correct "resting" position ie slightly above this drilling then any correction for wear has already taken place re extra fluid being allowed into the cylinder/s.

Once the piston begins to travel down the bore, the moment it obstructs and then passes the drilling then thats it as far as being able to influence the position of the slave cylinder piston is concerned, its all down to the fluid being displaced by the master if you see what I mean.

(I wonder if there's a smaller slave cylinder that could be fitted? That would be your answer here just thinking about it. Dunno if there are different bore sizes fitted to other Punto's?)

But, as you say mate, your clutch arm could be bent but you'd think that it'd "adjust" itself because of that?

Sorry I cant help a bit more White, you've helped me plenty mate

 

[red]

As shaun says, the hydraulic arrangement takes up the slack. The clutch release arm is substantial enough not to get bent anyway.

The more likely cause of a long pedal is air in the system. Have you tried bleeding it WhiteSei?

I wouldn't recommend trying to to fit a different spec. of slave. A narrower bore would indeed give a longer stroke but you'd have to ensure that the piston doesn't get pushed beyond its designed operating stroke. Also you'd lose some mechanical advantage so it would be harder to press the pedal and stress the hydraulics more.

red

 

[shaun200765]

Well said Red

 

[Kevin Hammond]

Re: Clutch: to change or not to change? Mk2 8V

Just done my clutch on my Punto 8V - yet to finish the job though. The car has done 58000 miles, but the friction plates, the sprung fingers and the thrust bearing were all severely worn. The job is do-able with a Haynes manual - but beware you need at least two people to manhandle the gearbox in and out and 2 or 3 jacks to hand. (You don't need a hoist). The Haynes manual was not very good, with very few pictures - so seek advise when you get stuck.