Technical Dualogic Transmission

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Technical Dualogic Transmission

bobm

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I've been following the thread about changing transmission oil on a Speedgear auto box and out of curiosity had a look at the service schedule for the Dualogic which says it should be changed every 12k miles. As I did not get any additional info about the Dualogic system when I got the car does anyone out there have a Dualogic and if you do is there an additional instruction booklet (or leaflet) that goes with it. If there is and you would be willing to copy it and send to me that would be great.
 
I've been following the thread about changing transmission oil on a Speedgear auto box and out of curiosity had a look at the service schedule for the Dualogic which says it should be changed every 12k miles. As I did not get any additional info about the Dualogic system when I got the car does anyone out there have a Dualogic and if you do is there an additional instruction booklet (or leaflet) that goes with it. If there is and you would be willing to copy it and send to me that would be great.

there should indeed be a small booklet instructing you on how to use the gearbox

if you bought the car from a main dealer they might give you one if you complain

if your intrested to know about serving then all you ned to know is as far as the actul box goes it's a robotised manual gearbox and should be serviced the same as a manual gearbox oil changed at 92k miles

the robotised system attached to it howether does require it's hydraulic oil changed i can't for the life of me remember when fiat say thou havn't done many i can find out if this intrests you
 
I've been following the thread about changing transmission oil on a Speedgear auto box and out of curiosity had a look at the service schedule for the Dualogic which says it should be changed every 12k miles. As I did not get any additional info about the Dualogic system when I got the car does anyone out there have a Dualogic and if you do is there an additional instruction booklet (or leaflet) that goes with it. If there is and you would be willing to copy it and send to me that would be great.

I think you'll find it's checked every 12,000 miles not "changed". ;)

As pip said, it's a manual box (with levels checked/oil changed as per a 'normal' 1.2 8v) with a hydraulic selector mechanism which uses a separate built-in reservoir with it's own special fluid.

(y)
 
Thanks for that, have just rechecked and you are right it is checked every 12k miles.
 
I think you'll find it's checked every 12,000 miles not "changed". ;)

As pip said, it's a manual box (with levels checked/oil changed as per a 'normal' 1.2 8v) with a hydraulic selector mechanism which uses a separate built-in reservoir with it's own special fluid.

(y)

yea but note the hydraulic oil does have to be changed at some stage it is not fill for life or anything like that i jut not sure something like 6th service or something i really aught to have a look tomorrow
 
I'm still experiencing a judder when pulling away for the very first time - that goes away very quickly - and acting on advice received, by giving the car more revs on the first pull away that definitely helps. As for the performance of the Dualogic system, I think it works well. In non economy mode the gears change at higher revs and sometimes (particularly in 2nd gear) the gear change seems reluctant to come resulting in much higher revs than you would expect. In economy mode the gear changes have a more solid feel to them and while acceleration is slower it makes the car feel better. In manual mode it works really well - I like the smoothness of the changes - you really do not feel the changes happening and by keeping your foot on the accelerator you can get a quite nippy performance.
 
or theres a new software update...probably not available in AUS though!

i thought that was to solve jurky gearchanges witch he does not have

the judering is just borgbeck clutch doing it's usual and needs a little abuse to sort or replacement with valeo would be the ultimate fix

and the sudden jerking set off's are the clutch bite point has worn quicker than the ecu expects meaning simply need a clutch learn assive you had just replaced the clutch but havn't

not sure if you have tried this on the ones that jerk as you set off but don't show any judder or jerky gear changes before t4 it stops the problem all together works very well have done a few and they have not come back with any problems some very happy customers

as we don't see to many of thee cars and customers don't often complain about gear changes i have never personally updated gearbox ecu so not sure what it helps with but never read the campain

but as you are relearning the clutch anyway after updating the ecu then you can never tell witch procedure has actually fixed the car as you are forced to do both right

anyway when i start to see some dualogic 500s for pdi i'm guna be checking the gearbox for updates just to make sure every one i do is perfect
 
Re littlepip's last post on this subject - how does the ecu relearn the clutch setting? Is it just something that happens after a while or by doing the higher rev starts in 2nd gear that eventually sorts it out? Any info would be welcome.
 
ok can i take a few minutes to make thing's a little clearer

firstly as you all should be aware it's no normal auto gearbox it's a robotised manual gearbox there fore shares all the same clutch components as a normal manual

and there fore some of them have suffered the curse of the mk2's horible clutch judder problems with the borg becker clutches ways to sort this were replace with a quality valeo unit and risk a release bearing problem or give it a thrashing to burn off judery layers

now with an dualogic it's a little harder to give the clutch some abuse hence my tips override it into second and give it some beans or just generally give it beans everywhere anyway it all helps

we find that the cars that had clutch judder are the ones driven about buy old fogies who slip the clutch allot at low rpm's wile caring out life long manurers around our forecourt

the younger drivers have never reported a problem

if on that first set off as you press the throttle the revs rise a little more than expected and the bite point comes in anything less than perfectly smovely then you can fix this problem with a clutch relearn basically if it jumps like a learner driver would on first drive out you know what i mean

the procedure is to drive the car till warm and then stop with the fiat examiner activate the clutch relearn procedure and then simply set off again up to something like 30mph and stop again and that's it it's happy

this problem arises when the clutch wears faster than the ecu expects and it has trouble keeping up with the clutches new bite point so in hilly areas this can reocure

any other problems like jerky gear changes are simply down to updates for the ecu to improve operation as and when applicable to certain vehicles

from what i understand anyway i must admit i don't know much abut the updates for the dualogics maybe dave might have an idea what they are specifically ment to change in the system's operation

maybe it allows for quicker self learning and more variable parameters regarding the clutch to solve both jerky set off and gear change
 
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Thanks for that detailed explanation. I think the previous owner must have driven the car very cautiously. I will now go and give it a good thrashing and hope that gets it sorted. Cheers.
 
the procedure is to drive the car till warm and then stop with the fiat examiner activate the clutch relearn procedure and then simply set off again up to something like 30mph and stop again and that's it it's happy

Would the same be with my CVT with it's powedered clutch then lil pip? When moving off slowly it can jump, like you descibed. No problems when putting one's foot down though.

How do you activate learn mode?
 
Would the same be with my CVT with it's powedered clutch then lil pip? When moving off slowly it can jump, like you descibed. No problems when putting one's foot down though.

How do you activate learn mode?

erm no completely different

clutch learn on the modern ones can only be activated by fiat with examiner

if i'm right if it's similar to puntos there is a switch on the throttle so as soon as you just begin to press it it powers the clutch and begins to creep even before the revs have risen atall

if this switch is sticking a little your revs will rise too much before the clutch grips making it jerk just test it you should be able to here it clicking positively as you just put your foot on the throttle a tiny bit and the car creeps

if the switch fails then the gearbox ecu also looks at engine revs and if the revs rise with out the switch clicking it will let you set off anyway ignoring the switch and resulting in a jerky set off but this would also be coupled with a gearbox warning light

it's also good to remember to make sure your foot is fully off the throttle when selecting forward reverse as this mechanism is a simple syncro gearbox in the back of the cvt box after the input shaft from the engine if not you end up with a crunch and the syncros will suffer and brake eventually

althou on the panda not sure about punto i think there is also another switch to tell it when you plant it hard into the floor
 
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