Unfortunately the issue with the fuel sender is now the least of my problems.

Got caught in the flooding in South Wales. Was on a main A road, went round a bend, bam, straight into a flood.

I'm going to give it a go at draining the pipework and taking out injectors to see if it'll clear out....1 in a million chance, bit worth a shot.

But if the engine is knackered, will another 70hp multijet be a straight swap?

Does anything electrically need coding in?

And would a MJ of the same year from a Punto be the same, or did they have the 75hp fitted?

I'm not adverse to fitting one of the newer MJ engines, but I'm guessing that'll mean new ECU and more mucking around.

Sadly, it's probably toast con-rods and crank often get bent when this happens. But you never know. Take out the glow plugs and turn it on the starter to pump water out. Put the plugs back, change the oil and then see if it runs.

Another 70hp should be a straight swap. Even a Vauxhall-sourced one, except for a few gotchas (starter motor is one, can't remember the others at the moment).
Recovered one which was full of water, but it hadn't been running when the water went in.
As you said, drain oil, glow plugs out, spin over. Watch out - sprays black oily water over a huge area, so some protection required. Don't just use rags laying over the front, as they will get fired off in all directions!
If you swap, change the cam chain while it's out. Much easier than in-place.

If you put anew engine in the new Injectors will need coding in to ensure correct running
It will probably work without coding but not 100%

chris3234 said:

If you put anew engine in the new Injectors will need coding in to ensure correct running
It will probably work without coding but not 100%

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Good point.
I used the originals, kept in the right order, so didn't need coding.
Most second hand MJs seem to come without injectors, but you may need them if it's hydraulic locked bad enough.
As above, may run uncoded, but probably like a dog.

Thanks for the advice.

The AA recovered it back to my work. I'll have a go at cranking it over with plugs out....worth a shot, and can't do any more damage.

I've seen several of the Vauxhall 70hp engines around....I'm guessing it's exactly the same, bar the air intake pipework being different?

Assuming the injectors are okay, I'll swap them over.

If you have fully comprehensive insurance it should cover this damage, though it may well write the vehicle off, but you could buy the car and fix it anyway.

Robert G8RPI

are you sure its hydrolocked ?

if its like the petrol version the air intake is faily High up.

spray on the sensors would normally stop the engine well before hydrolocked

plenty a diesel where the driver has to swim out of the window in USA swamp meetings. Get towed out. Fuel changed and start

I know its an old Petrol A series but it always Good for a laugh. Especially when is restarted right at the end




First to get hit by water would be the MAF. if it turns over by hand I would disconnect and try

Cinq999 said:

Unfortunately the issue with the fuel sender is now the least of my problems.

Got caught in the flooding in South Wales. Was on a main A road, went round a bend, bam, straight into a flood.

I'm going to give it a go at draining the pipework and taking out injectors to see if it'll clear out....1 in a million chance, bit worth a shot.

But if the engine is knackered, will another 70hp multijet be a straight swap?

Does anything electrically need coding in?

And would a MJ of the same year from a Punto be the same, or did they have the 75hp fitted?

I'm not adverse to fitting one of the newer MJ engines, but I'm guessing that'll mean new ECU and more mucking around.

Click to expand...

Unfortunately the principal of driving at a speed where you can stop in your visible distance didn't apply here.

I would probably remove the glow plugs and put the car in a high gear and gently push it forward to get the worst major slug of water out before using the starter motor, then use the other advice here.

i hope it works out for you

Tim

timmycm850 said:

Unfortunately the principal of driving at a speed where you can stop in your visible distance didn't apply here.

I would probably remove the glow plugs and put the car in a high gear and gently push it forward to get the worst major slug of water out before using the starter motor, then use the other advice here.

i hope it works out for you

Tim

Click to expand...

Yes, unfortunately that was the case.

I already slowed down to 30, although up until that point the road was completely clear. Went round the bend, and in the second or so it took me to realise the road was flooded, it was too late.

Yes, tomorrow I'll disconnect the intake pipework and make sure that's all drained, pop out the glow plugs, stick it in 5th and give it a push.

Worst case, I'll buy a second hand engine, change the clutch and chain while it's on a pallet, and strip the old engine down ready to swap it over.

Book time for an engine swap is 6.5 hours....but if I get as much removed as possible beforehand (bumper, radiator, exhaust, wiring/pipework), should be a bit quicker.

But here's to hoping it fires up tomorrow!

koalar said:

First to get hit by water would be the MAF. if it turns over by hand I would disconnect and try

Click to expand...

As I understand the MAF would kill the engine as soon as water hits it, hopefully preventing any internal damage.

Is there water in the intake / turbo?

@Dragon Man rescued a flooded & scrapped MJ Panda by disconnecting the MAF and cranking it over until it started. Report here

Fingers crossed it's this easy for you.

rmjbn1 said:

As I understand the MAF would kill the engine as soon as water hits it, hopefully preventing any internal damage.

@Dragon Man rescued a flooded & scrapped MJ Panda by disconnecting the MAF and cranking it over until it started. Report here

Fingers crossed it's this easy for you.

Click to expand...

Interesting thread.

Mine has got water in the intake pipework however.

Although the AA man did remove the (sensor??) in the top of the head to look at the camshaft, and when in gear, the camshaft was turning.

It started off "locked" up, then with a shove it suddenly freed with a slight gurgle.

It locked up again when we had pushed it around 6ft, but AA man said if I'm lucky, it could be because the pipework/turbo is full of water, causing an airlock. But the cam was turning, so not completely locked up.

Will have a go tomorrow lunchtime, and will update.

Cinq999 said:

Ithe AA man did remove the (sensor??) in the top of the head to look at the camshaft, and when in gear, the camshaft was turning.

It started off "locked" up, then with a shove it suddenly freed with a slight gurgle.

Click to expand...

Sounds encouraging. Not sure about the sensor in the head, the MAF is here:


If it's still connected and still wet it would be cutting out the engine

These engines are designed with rockers that break preventing the valves from getting bent, this means the cam shaft could happily rotate but everything else has been smashed to bits.

The intake is very high up in the engine bay on the 1.3 multijet, the airfilter on top of the engine and has drain holes in the bottom. The pipework to the engine is fairly lengthy to the intake manifold via the intercooler. Its not impossible and if you go barrelling into very deep water then yes you could lock the engine, but if you stopped quickly or the water was not at high at the top of the headlights, i'd suspect the engine might be ok.

Cinq999 said:

Yes, unfortunately that was the case.

I already slowed down to 30, although up until that point the road was completely clear. Went round the bend, and in the second or so it took me to realise the road was flooded, it was too late.

Yes, tomorrow I'll disconnect the intake pipework and make sure that's all drained, pop out the glow plugs, stick it in 5th and give it a push.

Worst case, I'll buy a second hand engine, change the clutch and chain while it's on a pallet, and strip the old engine down ready to swap it over.

Book time for an engine swap is 6.5 hours....but if I get as much removed as possible beforehand (bumper, radiator, exhaust, wiring/pipework), should be a bit quicker.

But here's to hoping it fires up tomorrow!

Click to expand...

Mainly I'm glad your safe and you have the interest and ability to resolve it especially with the help from everyone here.

Tim

ahhh damn AA guy. first things first, remove the main intake pipe going into the intake manifold. sadly the engine did free up but it sounds like its now sucked in all the water from inside all of the pipework and intercooler and locked it up again. guhh

an option you have is undoing the glow plugs and taking them out. then hoping that you can then spin the engine over via cranking or pushing the car in top gear.

the AA mans worry there was to see if the cam chain had snapped. the fact things did turn tell me its not.

so in short, air filter box off, air filter removed, glow plugs or injectors removed or lifted enough to let water pass by them,
disconnect the high pressure charge air from intercooler pipe from intake manifold make sure that this pipe is directed well away from the newly opened hole the pipe should connect to so that no water inside the intercooler or turbo gets back in the engine, push or crank engine. hopefully water pistol time.. stand clear, when water stops firing from engine, re-tighten injectors or glow plugs, leave the intake pipe disconnected from the intake manifold, unplug the MAF sensor, crank the engine. keep cranking the engine.. given nothing is bent, the engine should start to fire you will have to crank the engine for ages..., when you get it firing on 1 keep it cranking as it will just cut out, when 2 kick in it will run on its own depending which cylinders are firing but wont rev, any more than 2 firing the engine will rev but i advise to not rev it. leave the engine idling its going to lumpy as hell but should be ok to leave it.. hopefully all 4 will start to fire eventually.
now if you have the engine running smoothish, make sure that air intake pipe is still being held well away from the intake manifold where the engine is now taking in air, bring the engine off idle to start spooling the turbo, listen out for any "bad" sounds (metal on metal)if you get this, stop the engine it needs repairs, using the turbo you are able to blow out any water in the intercooler and intake pipework. its very lazy but it sure beats taking pipework from off the intercooler. dry off the MAF and air filter with a hair dryer.

you will get lots of white smoke from the exhaust for quite some time. this is the diesel the injectors have been firing while all that cranking was being done. all the diesel is now sitting in the exhaust. when the engine runs, the exhaust will get hot and start to vaporise the diesel into white smoke. this will clear eventually. take it on some back roads get the engine to full working temperature.

some may say that i speak from experience..

hope this helps.

i spend the whole sunday driving around local flooded lanes in my old panda with nothing but a halfords socket set and a tin of wd-40 putting breakdown recovery people to shame.
i managed to get 17 out of 22 cars running again and ended the day with pockets heavy with gratitude even though i never asked for it once!
i also managed to sell 4 dehumidifiers i just so happened to be carrying in the car with me for people wanting to find a way to dry out a wet car. they all came from the scrap but i got them running and saved them for this occasion.

been one of the best sundays ive had in a long time. i just love making dead stuff live again.

I'm really pleased to say, ITS ALIVE!

I followed Dragon Man's advice above, and it worked.

A tiny bit of water came out of one cylinder, but as above, probably when AA man sucked water in.

Now been running 1/2 hour, smooth as ever, turbo spools up and sounds fine.

Will be changing the oil and filter this afternoon.... although oil on dipstick looks fine, better safe than sorry.

Thanks everyone for your help....it's a massive relief.

timmycm850 said:

Unfortunately the principal of driving at a speed where you can stop in your visible distance didn't apply here.

I would probably remove the glow plugs and put the car in a high gear and gently push it forward to get the worst major slug of water out before using the starter motor, then use the other advice here.

i hope it works out for you

Tim

Click to expand...

On Saturday night, I had about three areas of 12" deep water to get through. One was such that, had it not been for other cars on the road, I would have not seen the water until too late to slow significantly. The one in question was not enough to cause more than a big splash but surprisingly invisible.

My brother in law hit a flood in a 1980's Vauxhaul Carlton. It stopped with a bang and bent the crankshaft. In fairness, the car was new to him and the air intake was behind the front bumper. Perfectly placed to syphon the whole river.

Hi

great news then.

It might be a good idea to consider the gearbox oil being changed sometime over the next couple of weeks, If you've arrived in the water with a warm gearbox it may suck in water through the oil seals on the drive shafts as it cools.

good to hear of a survivor as i guess insurance would have written it off.

Tim