Pugglt Auld Jock said:

Exactly the sets I bought. At the time I thought they were a wee luxury which I would only use when conditions demanded it - that I would still do most of the "heavy lifting" with my traditional sets. To quite an extent that is true but I use them more than I'd thought because of the slimline nature of them and the fine ratchet action. It's a pity they don't have a "t" handle/power bar as I have had to "lean" on the ratchet quite hard once or twice. So far though, the ratchet has stood up to it. I'm going to see if Gearwrench do one and if they do I'll get my sister to buy one and bring it over with her this summer (their year to come over to us!) - that might give the security guys at the airport something new to look at on their screens!

Click to expand...

I didn't even know that tool ever existed before, but when I read your post with the photos and explanation, I knew exactly what you meant, and what they could be useful for.

I did some search on them, and found the 50% sale on them from Halfords, so I couldn't resist ordering them. Thank you.

It is good to have tools that can do the job, and good quality ones, or do the jobs but good bargain, they are all good value for money I feel.

It is pleasure owning them, and take them out when they are needed, and get the job done to satisfaction. It is not just about saving money, but there must be also psychological side to it

koalar said:

I normally buy tools on a as needed bases.
if I am then going to use it often I buy quality
if its a one off. Then cheap and cheerful is good enough.

Click to expand...

I favour this approach too. I inherited an old incomplete set of driver with selection of sockets and spanners, basic but seems strong British-made stuff (apparently that used to be a thing... Tipco, don't know if anyone has experience of them?). I find I use the same sizes over and over, 8, 10, 14, 17, 19 so I have a selection of these in 6&12-point, long & short and I get an individual socket or spanner when I need it.

A well-meaning relative got me a full set of cheap sockets & combination spanners in metric & imperial as a present. I never use it. Maybe one or two a couple of times early on, but I can feel the difference in quality & don't like using it.

There used to be a great shop near me selling top-quality stuff from the engineering businesses that were closing down on Slough Trading Estate in the 80's & 90's. Who knows, maybe something in my toolbox once saw service on a Williams, Wolf, McLaren, Lola/GT40..? It's nice to imagine anyway And now that shop has gone too, I wish I'd used it more.

One thing I have found useful is a ratchet spanner for those times when there's a nut on a long thread and limited space:

I know what you mean about cheap spanners but saying that I have a 10mm Halfords which looks the dog's bits but it's too thin and the edge feels quite "sharp" even at the forces needed for an M6 screw.

My favourites still are those old Kamasa spanners which have not bee made ever since the original company packed up in the early 1980s.

I also have a some Aldi ratchet ring/open spanners (10, 11, 13, 15, 17) given as a gift. They must be rubbish - right? Actually, they are nicer to use than that posh jobbie. Ive added a 12 and 14 to the range from Halfords.

Why does that supplier get so much use from me? They sell individual spanners. I have more than enough sets.

Would this tool be useful for working on brakes? They are for bleeding bolts of brake fluids I think.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pagid-5-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

Theleman said:

Would this tool be useful for working on brakes? They are for bleeding bolts of brake fluids I think.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pagid-5-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

Click to expand...

They seem to be made in this unusual shape specifically to make accessing brake cylinder/caliper bleed nipples easier without removing the wheels. Maybe they do but why would you want to? Perhaps in a garage where the vehicle is up on a 4 poster lift? I have always removed wheels when bleeding and managed just fine with ordinary spanners.

DaveMcT said:

I know what you mean about cheap spanners but saying that I have a 10mm Halfords which looks the dog's bits but it's too thin and the edge feels quite "sharp" even at the forces needed for an M6 screw.

My favourites still are those old Kamasa spanners which have not bee made ever since the original company packed up in the early 1980s.

I also have a some Aldi ratchet ring/open spanners (10, 11, 13, 15, 17) given as a gift. They must be rubbish - right? Actually, they are nicer to use than that posh jobbie. Ive added a 12 and 14 to the range from Halfords.

Why does that supplier get so much use from me? They sell individual spanners. I have more than enough sets.

Click to expand...

I have an early set of Aldi ratchet spanners. There were rubbish. The angle between each click is too big. I noticed the latest ones were much better but you still need about 30 degrees for it to latch. I decided to wait for version 3 to come out


I have hammered a set of there combo spanners. But the fit is not as good as some laser spanners I have. Using a better fitting spanner / socket your less likely to damage a bolt / nut

I probably got lucky but generally the stuff in Aldi is a lot better quality than it has any right to be. Rgds those ratchet ring spanners the Halfords items are better but really not very much. To get a genuinely small ratchet steps we have to get into the professional grades like Snap-On. They are too posh for my DIY needs but I'd not think twice of buying for my work.

For brake pipes you need proper flare nut spanners. The Panda uses 11mm nuts though my equivalent imperial spanner is a slightly better fit.

You can get crow's foot fittings to use with a socket handle but brake pipes are often in tight corners making an ordinary spanner a better bet.

Modern cars have plastic coated aluminium "bundy" pipes. Flaring the pipe end unavoidably compromises the plastic, so over time there will be a build up of corrosion oxide under the flare nut. DO NOT attempt to turn the nut as all you will do is twist the pipe and give yourself a much bigger headache. The least cost option is to cut the rubber hose and spin the fragment off the flare nut. The nut can then be warmed enough to soften the plastic coating (a gas hob lighter is ample) so it can be free'd off and cleaned up. I smear a high solids anti seize paste on the newly cleaned metal.

the open end of a aldi 14 mm spanner is 14.4 mm where as a Laser is 14.2 mm
also the Laser is of the AS954 design which moves the forces slightly further away from the corner

I have a set of Aldi spanners which I use regularly. You just have to know there limitations before you damage a bolt or nut. 90% of the time they are fine.

koalar said:

the open end of a aldi 14 mm spanner is 14.4 mm where as a Laser is 14.2 mm
also the Laser is of the AS954 design which moves the forces slightly further away from the corner

I have a set of Aldi spanners which I use regularly. You just have to know there limitations before you damage a bolt or nut. 90% of the time they are fine.

Click to expand...

Exactly why the top stuff costs more money - often a lot more. Precision stuff isnt cheap.

To be honest I avoid using open end spanners if at all possible. Ive had top quality stuff slip and chew a nut only slightly less easily than cheap stuff. Anything well stuck should be moved with 6 point sockets.. However anything under 14mm AF will almost certainly shear the bolt stem long before even a weak spanner loses its grip.

By the way I've just been down to Halfords for some WD40. They have a set of stepless ratchet ring spanners for £30. As ever, the ring end ratchet can be a bit fat for some jobs but they should help when working in tight corners.

Picked up the Halfords Go-Thru Socket sets. They are really fantastic tools. Well made, and look very useful.

The sockets are all 6 points stuff, and there are extension bits, and really cover all sizes. Hardcase is nice too.

Works just like normal sockets too, but with added versatility of pass thru capability.

DaveMcT said:

For brake pipes you need proper flare nut spanners. The Panda uses 11mm nuts though my equivalent imperial spanner is a slightly better fit.

You can get crow's foot fittings to use with a socket handle but brake pipes are often in tight corners making an ordinary spanner a better bet.

Modern cars have plastic coated aluminium "bundy" pipes. Flaring the pipe end unavoidably compromises the plastic, so over time there will be a build up of corrosion oxide under the flare nut. DO NOT attempt to turn the nut as all you will do is twist the pipe and give yourself a much bigger headache. The least cost option is to cut the rubber hose and spin the fragment off the flare nut. The nut can then be warmed enough to soften the plastic coating (a gas hob lighter is ample) so it can be free'd off and cleaned up. I smear a high solids anti seize paste on the newly cleaned metal.

Click to expand...

Got this Flare Nut spanner set for 11£. So these are the proper tools for working on brakes then? I m just keep collecting tools to work on my Panda.

I have the imperial equivalent of 11mm. I'd have to dig around in garage to tell exactly what size it is but it works fine on older cars and fits snugly on Fiat 11mm AF flare nuts. I've never needed any other sizes though I suspect a Citroen DS/BX/CX owner would need a full set.

The most important feature is a thick base around the spanner sides so they can't spread apart in use. A ring spanner with a piece chopped out would not do the job.

This vid seems explain well about usage of the flare nut spanners.



Are the space off the rings not for going over the tube or pipes when grabbing the bolts?

Here is another vid for flare nut spanner use.



I know what you mean, they are a lot thicker on the spanner side.
Maybe these sets would be better one?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/6-PIECE-METRIC-FLARE-NUT-WRENCH-SPANNER-SET-CHROME-PLATED-WITH-STORAGE-CLIP/332693873684?hash=item4d7619a414:g:Gz8AAOSwvApbrQIm



https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/6pc-Flare-Nut-Brake-Spanner-Wrench-Set-Brake-Fuel-Gas-Pipes-Tool-6-24mm/282827889757?_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIM.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140122125356%26meid%3D829b9b5ff2704cda9d83263c343e4dd3%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D6%26rkt%3D12%26mehot%3Dlo%26sd%3D332693873684%26itm%3D282827889757&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851


Or even this one? The shape is more like 6 points in the spanner, and it has 11mm in there, and slightly cheaper too

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Flare-Wr...m=273128735918&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851

At that price if they only do one job it wont matter too much.

The extended tips are to keep the nut tucked tight into the spanner to minimise leverage that spreads the jaws. But they will spread if really abused so need to be well buttressed.

Personally I would just get a really good quality 10/11mm and perhaps a 3/8" x 7/16" if you ever get that classic Mini or MG Midget.

Theleman said:

Got this Flare Nut spanner set for 11£. So these are the proper tools for working on brakes then? I m just keep collecting tools to work on my Panda.

Click to expand...

At that price they're worth having in your tool kit. As Dave says, at that price if one breaks then you aren't going to be too upset! Personally I would have gone for single hex (6 point). The big problem with tube nuts is that they are often seized/corroded and take a lot of effort to undo. Bi hex (12 point), especially on smaller sizes, tend to round off the nuts really easily. The other big problem is that, being of an open ended design, the jaws tend to spread which just increases the chances of rounding off the nuts! The trouble with "cheap" spanners is often that the metal is of poor quality, the forming process poorly controlled and the design inadequate. The examples you link to look not too bad but, whilst I would want to see the jaws well buttressed, the smaller sizes look just a bit too bulky and I can imagine might give problems of access in some situations.

Here's my wee collection:



The ones on the left are my "old pals":



At the top is an imperial size bihex (12 point) Britool. I had a set of 3 of these back in the day when cars like the Morris Minor were our bread and butter. Then the Marina, Allegro, Princess etc came on the scene and, Yikes, metric fittings started appearing! The Allegro was often good fun with imperial fittings on the front calipers and metric on the rear (or was it t'other way round? - see, I'm still confused!) I bought a set of Williams Superslim to get over this. The bottom two are the ones which have survived - and I still use. The spanner second from top is a "cheapie" I bought (I think to do Hydrolastic pipes if I remember?) As you can see It's broken



Didn't survive it's first encounter, due to being just really poor quality. Look at The difference compared to the Britool in the picture above and how poorly the driving faces are formed and how little actual metal there is compared to the Clarke in the next picture:



Going back to the first picture the three on the right are a Clarke set I bought from Machine Mart because I lost my Williams 13mm (Sob, sob).




Generally modern male tube nuts need an 11mm tool and females take a 13mm. I was surprised to find the Clarke set didn't have an 11mm? But as both of the Williams have 11mm ends, I needed the 13mm and there were other sizes I didn't have which might be useful on diesel injectors, I decided to buy anyway.

Thinking about quality and design. Quality of material is difficult to asses but very cheap tools are probably cheap for a reason? design is something you can see with your eyes. Look for a tool with a bit of "meat" on it but not so bulky that it's going to make access awkward:



The Britool (top left) Clarke (top right) and Williams (bottom right) Whilst being different in some respects, are all well made. The cheap unbranded tool (bottom left) proved to be brittle - it snapped almost as soon as I started to "lean" on it. It was "thin" and, if you look closely, the driving faces are very poorly formed. I wasted my money!

Having said all this though, there are going to be times when a spanner like this is just not going to get the job done! It's very likely that in this sort of situation, cutting the pipe off at the nut and using a hex (6 point) socket will be a better bet. Of course you'll then be into making a new pipe - but sometimes that's just the way it goes?

Yes, the BritTool one seem really well built, and it seems proved with its performance and length of life it is lasting, when other tools break during use.

I got my cheap flare nut set due its low price, but also number of people who bought them. It was well over 1000 sets were sold, while other sets were sold in meager amount.

I thought well, if it sells over 1000s, and no many bad reviews, then it must be OK. When it arrived it seems OK, in that it covers wide range of size, and feel solid.

But as you say, it was £11.98 for the set, so if it breaks, I wouldn't feel bad about it. Just will buy another set.

I have not done any work on brake before, but from my Panda's last MOT advisory it states, brakes and suspension, ball joints etc, so I will be doing work on them after next MOT test, which is September a wee while yet, but am expecting something if not all will fail on the test.

I think Halford sells one Flare Nut Spanner 11mm one, and that had hexa shape. It is something like a fiver, so it will be the one I will get next time passing there just for back up.

I know what you mean cheap tools tend to break. It happened to me yesterday, when I was sharpening my vintage Qualcast hand push lawnmower. It has this chained gear connected to the rotary blade, and to sharpen it I had to lower the blade so it will be in contact with the cutting base plate, and then I put a socket on the nut of the gear, and rotated with rachet spanner, so the blade will turn backwards while while touching the base plate. With the friction, the edge gets sharpened. It was a bit stiff, and my cheap chinese made 3/8 rachet spanner snapped in 5 minutes. It was just spinning itself not moving the socket at all.

I had to get my rachet spanner out from the Craftsman socket set, and had to finish off the sharpening. And cut the grass first time this year. The Qualcast hand pushmower from 1950s were cutting grass like razor with sharpened blade Sorry for hijacking the track, but just to tell you that cheap tools are more prone to break when subjected to demanding tasks

Just found out, that my flare nut spanner set comes with LIFE time warranty, and over 1880 of them have been sold, not just 1000. I think everyday 10s of them seem being sold :hm:

So if any of it breaks, then maybe they will replace with a new set? :idea: