Technical What's the damage? Panda 100hp
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Technical What's the damage? Panda 100hp
ricky the ginger
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Fiat UK answered...not good!
Not sure exactly what I hope for but heres what I got;
"...As a manufacturer we are proud of our products. They are constantly undergoing stringent testing procedures to ensure that each individual item is manufactured to the highest possible standard. Our Technical team also continually monitor technical issues reported to us by customers and our dealer network to highlight any potential issues with the durability of our products.
We make every attempt to ensure the reliability and durability of all the components and we offer a three year manufacturer’s warranty should any part fail during this period. Outside of the warranty period, and as vehicles age, repairs may be required.
When a vehicle is outside of the warranty period, and wherever possible, we endeavour to support our customers on a goodwill basis. Nevertheless, any such requests must meet certain criteria in order for us to be able to assist. These include, but are not limited to, the age of the vehicle (a vehicle must be under 4 years old), ownership of the vehicle from new, mileage and the vehicles’ service history within our network of authorised Fiat dealers. As your vehicle falls outside of these parameters, as it is nine years old, regrettably, we are unable to assist you.
I also note that you have mentioned the cost of the repair. I am sorry that I cannot help you with this for the reasons detailed above.
I am sorry that I am unable to assist you but I hope you will understand the reasons.
Kind regards,..."
:bang:
Not sure exactly what I hope for but heres what I got;
"...As a manufacturer we are proud of our products. They are constantly undergoing stringent testing procedures to ensure that each individual item is manufactured to the highest possible standard. Our Technical team also continually monitor technical issues reported to us by customers and our dealer network to highlight any potential issues with the durability of our products.
We make every attempt to ensure the reliability and durability of all the components and we offer a three year manufacturer’s warranty should any part fail during this period. Outside of the warranty period, and as vehicles age, repairs may be required.
When a vehicle is outside of the warranty period, and wherever possible, we endeavour to support our customers on a goodwill basis. Nevertheless, any such requests must meet certain criteria in order for us to be able to assist. These include, but are not limited to, the age of the vehicle (a vehicle must be under 4 years old), ownership of the vehicle from new, mileage and the vehicles’ service history within our network of authorised Fiat dealers. As your vehicle falls outside of these parameters, as it is nine years old, regrettably, we are unable to assist you.
I also note that you have mentioned the cost of the repair. I am sorry that I cannot help you with this for the reasons detailed above.
I am sorry that I am unable to assist you but I hope you will understand the reasons.
Kind regards,..."
:bang:
Re: Fiat UK answered...not good!
I can understand Fiat refusing to make a contribution toward a repair on a 9yr old car. At that age, they'll likely regard it as being end of life. And in fairness, its current value if sold as salvage + the cost of a repair using new OEM parts will likely be more than the book value of the car once repaired, which makes this the mechanical equivalent of a Cat D writeoff. Personally I'd be looking at ways to fix this which don't involve buying a new OEM subframe. Out of interest, what state is the other cup in?
However, the criteria Fiat have given you for a goodwill contribution are much more worrying - if I've read what you've posted correctly, they're saying that they will only even consider this if:
1. the car is less than four years old and
2. you are the original owner from new (note this would seem to disqualify all prereg vehicles) and
3. the car has a full service history with all servicing being done by the franchised dealer network.
If Fiat really are taking this stance in all cases, it's going to leave quite a few folks who are currently negotiating goodwill contributions in respect of much newer cars well and truly up the proverbial without a wotsit. IMO this would be an extremely harsh policy.
I can understand Fiat refusing to make a contribution toward a repair on a 9yr old car. At that age, they'll likely regard it as being end of life. And in fairness, its current value if sold as salvage + the cost of a repair using new OEM parts will likely be more than the book value of the car once repaired, which makes this the mechanical equivalent of a Cat D writeoff. Personally I'd be looking at ways to fix this which don't involve buying a new OEM subframe. Out of interest, what state is the other cup in?
However, the criteria Fiat have given you for a goodwill contribution are much more worrying - if I've read what you've posted correctly, they're saying that they will only even consider this if:
1. the car is less than four years old and
2. you are the original owner from new (note this would seem to disqualify all prereg vehicles) and
3. the car has a full service history with all servicing being done by the franchised dealer network.
If Fiat really are taking this stance in all cases, it's going to leave quite a few folks who are currently negotiating goodwill contributions in respect of much newer cars well and truly up the proverbial without a wotsit. IMO this would be an extremely harsh policy.
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FYI I've seen goodwill on giulietta tailgate looms up to six years old, a well known and costly repair.
Does anybody know if all the axle beams are the same on all models ?
I have a 100hp but it does look the same as all models of panda
I have a 100hp but it does look the same as all models of panda
100hp has a different part number, 51856918
1.1/1.2 and Diesel uses 51856917
So you're looking for one form the internet specifically for 100hp, or a used one form a scrap 100hp.
There are two 100hp's near here, both driven by older people, never very quickly. A criminal waste of a car. Perhaps a 'crash for cash' exercise might yield a donor vehicle. (Just joking!)
1.1/1.2 and Diesel uses 51856917
So you're looking for one form the internet specifically for 100hp, or a used one form a scrap 100hp.
There are two 100hp's near here, both driven by older people, never very quickly. A criminal waste of a car. Perhaps a 'crash for cash' exercise might yield a donor vehicle. (Just joking!)
OK thanks for the info
Think I might be taking a look at cleaning mine up properly and seeing how much metal is left.
Think I might be taking a look at cleaning mine up properly and seeing how much metal is left.
If caught early and treated appropriately, this will be a non-issue. Left untreated, this could see the premature demise of a lot of 100HP's. As the rear beam is specific to that car, they're not going to get either any cheaper or any easier to find.
ricky the ginger
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Other cup is not looking too healthy so I'm looking at fabricating a modification that will run around the old one and beef it up alongside repairing the original.
If I can make something up that works I wonder how many 100HP owners would be interested. Would either mean cleaning and welding or drilling and bolting on an additional part to the axle. Not worked out what is doable yet.
If I can make something up that works I wonder how many 100HP owners would be interested. Would either mean cleaning and welding or drilling and bolting on an additional part to the axle. Not worked out what is doable yet.
Anybody think this might be a flaw with the 100HP?
It does use unique suspension components compared to the rest of the range right?
It does use unique suspension components compared to the rest of the range right?
Never understand why those parts are not Galvanized instead of painted/powder-coated.
Money.
Unfortunately a car is only as strong as its weakest link, and if a significant structural part costing £700+ to repair is vulnerable to corrosion after 8-10yrs, IMO the car is still a rustbucket, irrespective of whether the bodyshell is galvanized.
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Biggest issue is the rest of the car. If it's tip top except for the axle then go for it. If there is rust elsewhere or other wonky stuff you may well be looking at a scrap car.
Assuming the car is otherwise good.
This 100bhp axle has mentions callipers so the normal Panda back axle will fit but brakes probably wont fit
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FIAT-PAND...370198?hash=item3f5f832656:g:ENIAAOSwZ8ZW9Bp5
The OP's axle is fecked. As others have said you can't weld onto rust. Get a used axle and replace the whole lot but properly protect it from rust. A 6mm drain hole in each spring pan would help avoid them filling with water.
Galvanising would be good but expensive. Products from Frost.co.uk and some elbow grease will get it better than factory new.
Panda rear axles are £200 on eBay add another £100 for buggeration factors and some time & trouble. It wont be the same as the 100bhp but really how different are the two parts?
Even at 50% of the car's value what will it cost in loan premiums to replace the car? Let's say £200 a month. If the repair costs £1000 (very unlikely with used parts) you will have it paid for in 5 months where the new car costs will be continuing at £200 month.
If you need an excuse to get a new car then you have one. If not then replace the back axle.
Assuming the car is otherwise good.
This 100bhp axle has mentions callipers so the normal Panda back axle will fit but brakes probably wont fit
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FIAT-PAND...370198?hash=item3f5f832656:g:ENIAAOSwZ8ZW9Bp5
The OP's axle is fecked. As others have said you can't weld onto rust. Get a used axle and replace the whole lot but properly protect it from rust. A 6mm drain hole in each spring pan would help avoid them filling with water.
Galvanising would be good but expensive. Products from Frost.co.uk and some elbow grease will get it better than factory new.
Panda rear axles are £200 on eBay add another £100 for buggeration factors and some time & trouble. It wont be the same as the 100bhp but really how different are the two parts?
Even at 50% of the car's value what will it cost in loan premiums to replace the car? Let's say £200 a month. If the repair costs £1000 (very unlikely with used parts) you will have it paid for in 5 months where the new car costs will be continuing at £200 month.
If you need an excuse to get a new car then you have one. If not then replace the back axle.
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While it's probably just cost, some grades of high strength steel are not suitable for galvanising as the heat affects the strength. They wight also be concerned the the heat could distort a complex shape like a rear axle. There are other options for rotection, but they are higher cost.
Robert G8RPI.
Update.... went and bought a second hand axle from eBay. Managed to get the breaker down a few quid so always worth phoning. It's cleaned up a treat and ive had it coated.
It's cleaned up pretty nice but I'm now looking at replacing the bushing mounting bolts. The parts online don't seem to come with the bolts as a kit. Anyone point me in the direction of any. Fiat want 25 quid a pop...nope.
I'm also having to replace the bump stops. I know this is a common thing but pretty confused at what one to get. Read that the 500 abarth ones are better. Is that still the case, do I need to change the shocks if I'm doing this? Fiat again wanting stupid money for what seems like a cheap part online.
Cheers
Freddie
It's cleaned up pretty nice but I'm now looking at replacing the bushing mounting bolts. The parts online don't seem to come with the bolts as a kit. Anyone point me in the direction of any. Fiat want 25 quid a pop...nope.
I'm also having to replace the bump stops. I know this is a common thing but pretty confused at what one to get. Read that the 500 abarth ones are better. Is that still the case, do I need to change the shocks if I'm doing this? Fiat again wanting stupid money for what seems like a cheap part online.
Cheers
Freddie
Attachments
So, wife calls me....loud clunk and big spring lying on road!
Sound familiar???
Anyone had a full price for getting it all fixed?
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For new bolts etc go on eBay and buy what you need off the shelf.
DON'T get stainless as they wont have the necessary strength and can easily shake loose. Socket heads can be good (and usually high tensile) but slather them in anti seize to keep rust at bay.
For bump stops look at suppliers for poly bushes.
There's a 500 on eBay being broken. They might have the rear bump stops.
DON'T get stainless as they wont have the necessary strength and can easily shake loose. Socket heads can be good (and usually high tensile) but slather them in anti seize to keep rust at bay.
For bump stops look at suppliers for poly bushes.
There's a 500 on eBay being broken. They might have the rear bump stops.
Any chance you could point me to a link for the correct bolts? I'm a complete gonk when it comes to stuff like this.
Cheers
Freddie
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Unfortunately not - I don't know to the bolt sizes.
Measure your old bolts they are likely to be standard metric but counting threads per 10 or 20mm will tell you the pitch. M10 x 1.5 means 10mm diameter and 1.5mm pitch. 6.6 threads cover 10mm bolt length. 10 threads will cover 15mm of bolt length. A thread pitch gauge is handy to have.
eBay can help. Search "m10 socket head -stainless" They wont all be M10 so check out M6, M8 and M12 as necessary.
You could also call Pugh & Sanders in Burton on Trent. They do mail order on stainless and ferrous fasteners. http://www.pughandsanders.co.uk
These are likely to be ordinary strength
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/M10-10mm-...hash=item2c8d8d14df:m:mIBigfp3kJIJdRwTHdfUvQQ
These are high tensile
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/M3-M4-M5-...hash=item2c9e21f385:m:m8VyR8EbeO4I3wbrrUiIbyA
-stainless should avoid stainless coming up but they still appear in the list.
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Measure the old bolts, carefully.
Also look at the head, see what tensile strength they are. I'd expect 10, not 8.8. Don't underspec them. If they are 10 (more correctly 10.9) no stainless will reach that.
Try these guys.
http://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/ScrewBolt_M.html
Also look at the head, see what tensile strength they are. I'd expect 10, not 8.8. Don't underspec them. If they are 10 (more correctly 10.9) no stainless will reach that.
Try these guys.
http://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/ScrewBolt_M.html
