Hi, just wondering, my daughter had ran her 56 plate Panda with the oil light on for a while, then I get a phone call to say that the "car just stopped working". I went to the rescue only to find the engine had seized!(in the middle of a shopping centre car park) I topped up the oil and rocked it back and forth in gear to get it turning again. It started ticking over nicely, but on the SLOW drive home it made a loud knocking noise when in higher revs. I have seen another engine from a 2011 Panda, but the camshaft sensor is on the side of the cover rather than on the top next to the pulley. The plugs on her ecu are in line, whereas the other engine has them side by side. Will the eletric plugs(sensors) from that still fit hers?

The 2010+ 1.2 Pandas have the FIAT 500 Euro 5 spec engine, which is different to yours as it has the VVT 'interference' head.

You don't say if yours is the 1.2 or 1.2 engine though you'd be wiser getting a pre-2010 engine. Should be a few about in the scrapyards.

bobbymitchell said:

Hi, just wondering, my daughter had ran her 56 plate Panda with the oil light on for a while, then I get a phone call to say that the "car just stopped working". I went to the rescue only to find the engine had seized!(in the middle of a shopping centre car park) I topped up the oil and rocked it back and forth in gear to get it turning again. It started ticking over nicely, but on the SLOW drive home it made a loud knocking noise when in higher revs. I have seen another engine from a 2011 Panda, but the camshaft sensor is on the side of the cover rather than on the top next to the pulley. The plugs on her ecu are in line, whereas the other engine has them side by side. Will the eletric plugs(sensors) from that still fit hers?

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The 1.2 Panda engine was changed substantially in late 2010 with the introduction of the euro5 variant; one telltale is the VVT sensor & wiring on the cam cover. I doubt the later engine would be an easy swap as you'd need to change the ECU & wiring; getting the new ecu to work with the existing body computer would likely be extremely frustrating even if technically possible. The Euro5, despite being nominally more powerful (69HP vs 60HP) is actually a worse engine and you'd be wise to avoid it.

Using a different engine from that originally specified would also introduce insurance notification issues.

Unless you're doing all the work yourself, putting a 10yr old Panda with a blown engine back on the road will be a labour of love rather than an economically viable project, but I hope you do so; these are underrated cars which deserve better than they often get.

Thanks for the quick responses. This one has a screw on oil cap, but any other panda engines before this have the rubber bung type. Will the ecu plugs from this fit the older engine?

bobbymitchell said:

Thanks for the quick responses. This one has a screw on oil cap, but any other panda engines before this have the rubber bung type. Will the ecu plugs from this fit the older engine?

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Not sure, but as the later engine has the Euro 5 cylinder head and associated electronics, the ECU plugs might differ.


Still think a 2003-2009 60hp 1.2 engine would be easier.

This Job IMO will already be verging on car write off territory even if you do all the labour yourself. If I were you find the engine number and code, from (I think the boot) and get a scrappie one that's basically exactly the same, If not it will surely cause massive headaches when you start connecting things up. All the FIRE 1.2 engines consume oil so hopefully she knows where the dipstick is now.

Good luck and hope it goes well for you.

daveofkent said:

This Job IMO will already be verging on car write off territory even if you do all the labour yourself. If I were you find the engine number and code, from (I think the boot) and get a scrappie one that's basically exactly the same, If not it will surely cause massive headaches when you start connecting things up.

Good luck and hope it goes well for you.

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:yeahthat:

IMO finding an engine that's exactly the same as the one currently installed should be a prerequisite to even considering taking this job on. Personally I'd be looking at buying a crashed but driveable car so that I could test it before doing all the work.

Even at independent garage rates, the labour and consumables cost alone is probably more than the car's worth.

daveofkent said:

All the FIRE 1.2 engines consume oil so hopefully she knows where the dipstick is now.

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Interestingly, mine doesn't - I can run between oil changes without needing to top up. But that's no excuse not to check at least each time you fill up.

Some will throw up their hands in horror to read that anyone would keep driving a car with the oil light on, without at least checking for oil in the sump.
But not everybody is tech savvy, and that has to be accepted.
What a hard way to learn a simple lesson though.
Feel for both you and your daughter, because you both now have what should have been an avoidable problem.
Hope you get sorted soon.

There were three flavours of 1.2 in the Panda.
The first, with the square oil cap, 2003-6
The second with the round cap, EuroIV I think, early 2006-10
And the third, 2010 onwards, round cap, but VVT 69hp.

Unless you want more hassle than you've already got, you need an identical engine. Look for one with the sensors and cap the same as you've got. Likely to be the most plentiful.

No real reason why it couldn't be repaired with some new big end shells etc rather than a complete engine swap. But there are specialist breakers nationwide who might well have a decent matching engine available.

Personally I don't see why this has to become your problem.. someone really needs to be taught that all problems and issues in modern life are not fixed by simply using a mobile phone to make it someone else's responsibility...

bobbymitchell said:

Hi, just wondering, my daughter had ran her 56 plate Panda with the oil light on for a while, then I get a phone call to say that the "car just stopped working". I went to the rescue only to find the engine had seized!(in the middle of a shopping centre car park) I topped up the oil and rocked it back and forth in gear to get it turning again. It started ticking over nicely, but on the SLOW drive home it made a loud knocking noise when in higher revs. I have seen another engine from a 2011 Panda, but the camshaft sensor is on the side of the cover rather than on the top next to the pulley. The plugs on her ecu are in line, whereas the other engine has them side by side. Will the eletric plugs(sensors) from that still fit hers?

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As your daughter’s car is a 56 plate, it will have round oil filler cap but it will be the 60BHP EURO 4 variant.

Contrary to popular belief, earlier models with the round filler cap are in fact 60BHP, simpler and non-interference.

EURO 5 models came in with the “ECO” variants.

As such any 60BHP one will fit, although if you want to keep things the same, just get one with the round filler cap.

As mentioned above the 69BHP EURO 5 would not be suitable.

There are ones on eBay to be had like yours with the round cap for no more than £200, with a fitting service available on some of the engines (eBay item number: 262197850730 for example, only 35,000 miles).

AAB1992 said:

EURO 5 models came in with the “ECO” variants.

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Euro5 came after that; the early 'ECO' 1.2 variants have the 60hp Euro4 engine and £30 RFL. There was also (briefly) an 'ECO' version of the 1.1, but that engine never made it into Euro5 form and all Euro5 MK3 Pandas are 1.2's.

Interestingly all these early 'ECO' cars came with 13" steel wheels & 155 tyres; it needed the Euro5 engine to get the 1.2 Panda into the £30 RFL band with alloys.

1.2 Eleganzas of similar vintage used the same Euro4 engine but couldn't make the tax cut due to the bigger wheels. IIRC the Eleganza was also dropped after the Euro5 engine was introduced.

OK so the earlier 1.1 and 1.2 engines were the same basic 8V FIRE motors as the Puntos had since the mid-90s.

That business about the ECO wheels is ridiculous... how much fuel and emissions could be saved these days if everyone abandoned the modern obsession with big alloys and wide low-profile tyres? It's amazing to feel the weight difference between a 175/65 x 14 on a steel rim and an equivalent 185/55 x 15 on an alloy...

jrkitching said:

Euro5 came after that; the early 'ECO' 1.2 variants have the 60hp Euro4 engine and £30 RFL. There was also (briefly) an 'ECO' version of the 1.1, but that engine never made it into Euro5 form and all Euro5 MK3 Pandas are 1.2's.

Interestingly all these early 'ECO' cars came with 13" steel wheels & 155 tyres; it needed the Euro5 engine to get the 1.2 Panda into the £30 RFL band with alloys.

1.2 Eleganzas of similar vintage used the same Euro4 engine but couldn't make the tax cut due to the bigger wheels. IIRC the Eleganza was also dropped after the Euro5 engine was introduced.

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Yes the Eleganza was dropped then and so was the Multijet and 1.4, followed by the 1.1. The last run of Ecos was just 1.2s.

I'd stick with an 1.2 engine from the same Euro 4 era as it'll be a direct swap.

I hope that you have suitably chastised your daughter for driving on with warning lights on. Silly and costly thing to do!

portland_bill said:

There were three flavours of 1.2 in the Panda.
The first, with the square oil cap, 2003-6
The second with the round cap, EuroIV I think, early 2006-10
And the third, 2010 onwards, round cap, but VVT 69hp.

Unless you want more hassle than you've already got, you need an identical engine. Look for one with the sensors and cap the same as you've got. Likely to be the most plentiful.

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Or the budget option.
buy a running @(150 quid ) punto with the right engine. Change manifolds. Drive..

I seem to think the engine looms between the 1.2 (60hp) and the 1.1 (54hp) are different too, which might mean some connections/sensor might be different.

So like everyone else, stick with a 1.2 60hp replacement.
I'd go as far as saying one from a Panda too, as it wouldn't have dragged a Punto body around!