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Old 03-06-2013   #16
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Re: Fuel...supermarket or brand

I haven't done a Shell all round - the Shell garage in Crawley is considerably more expensive than anywhere else.

I have done Shell down, Sainsbury's up with similar results (traffic density was broadly similar and weather was absolute crap each way).

Cross-Pennine runs:

East-west on Shell compared to Sainsbury's - again, broadly similar

West-east on Morrisons is about half a tank, Shell about a third. Again, pretty similar conditions...maybe a tad more rain on the last Morrisons run

The recommended fuel for the car is BP (not Ultimate). Yet to put BP in myself.
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Old 03-06-2013   #17
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Re: Fuel...supermarket or brand

Quote Originally Posted by jrkitching View Post
The only difference between brands is the additive pack, which is usually added at the point of delivery.
Any idea how they ensure that the additive pack is evenly distributed and stays that way? Unevenly distributed additives may give interesting results from one tankful to the next.
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Old 03-06-2013   #18
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Re: Fuel...supermarket or brand

Quote Originally Posted by portland_bill View Post
Any idea how they ensure that the additive pack is evenly distributed and stays that way? Unevenly distributed additives may give interesting results from one tankful to the next.
Provided everything is mutually soluble all should be well, in the same way that the alcohol in a bottle of spirits stays uniformly mixed.
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Old 04-06-2013   #19
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Re: Fuel...supermarket or brand

Quote Originally Posted by Watermann View Post
... Tesco did a test last year with their Momentum 99 fuel and one of the cars they used in the test was a Panda 1.2. Full tech report with results is here:

http://www.tescopfs.com/content/down..._12_0311_2.pdf
Interesting data & a much `preferred supplier’ over the big bold opinion style.
I’ve not read into it much yet – but noticed (re Panda) there’s no significant mpg difference between Tesco 95 & the other 95, which maybe confirms that the base 95 is much the same whoever you draw-off.

My understanding (from a tanker driver) is that the base fuel is 95 & that is raised to 95+ by additives. So a tanker takes 95 from the rack (loading rig) & injects the additives called for by the customer. That suggests that each customers additive recipe is well known throughout the business. This makes sense given the `exchange agreement’ between the suppliers to draw-off their requirements from the nearest refinery irrespective of the oil company operating the refinery.

How many suppliers use common additives I don’t know – but obviously some can be distinguished. (We know from the Philpott trial that the prosecution was able to distinguish from BP, Shell & Total fuel on Philpott’s clothing). My fuel is Total from ASDA, & the tanker driver assured me that the additives were Total & there was no `ASDA’ additives – although confirmation by management would be nice.

It seems to me that some have a `housekeeping’ problem when it comes to storage. Tesco seem to figure more often in contamination claims.
Water & dirt & microbes get into the fuel. For around 5 you can buy an aviation fuel tester tube to check for water etc contamination - but I’ve never tried it with a car (as the sample is drawn from bottom of the tank).
See youtube.com/watch?v=sk6FhxRmbOs

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Last edited by Caravadossi; 04-06-2013 at 15:00. Reason: +
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Old 04-06-2013   #20
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Re: Fuel...supermarket or brand

Most light aircraft STC's for MOGAS specify alcohol free fuel only, which is primarily why you need to test as ethanol-free UL95 is now increasingly hard to find off-airport.

The two biggest problems with ethanol are that it attracts water into the fuel & can damage seals & gaskets in the fuel system & carburettor.
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Last edited by jrkitching; 04-06-2013 at 16:29.
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Old 04-06-2013   #21
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Re: Fuel...supermarket or brand

Well I know a guy who's delivered fuel for over 15 years, and he doesn't add anything, no 'additives.' It comes out of the suppliers terminals and gets delivered to garages as it is. It is a bonded item and once in the tanker, it is illegal for anyone to access the fuel. Also illegal at a petrol station to access the fuel tanks for whatever reason, except to take a manual 'dip' reading if the gauges are suspect.
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Last edited by tommo1; 04-06-2013 at 22:39.
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Old 05-06-2013   #22
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Re: Fuel...supermarket or brand

Quote Originally Posted by tommo1 View Post
Well I know a guy who's delivered fuel [haulier/fuel?] for over 15 years, and he doesn't add anything, no 'additives.' [?] It comes out of the suppliers [refinery/wholesaler?] terminals and gets delivered to garages [whose?] as it is ...
Any chance of something evidence based?

Evidence from the Philpott trial
Rebecca Jewell, who specialises in fire investigations, told Nottingham Crown Court low level traces of Total and BP petrol additives were found on Mick Philpott's tracksuit bottoms, traces of Total petrol were detected on his socks, slippers and left trainer, and traces of Shell petrol additives were found on his boxer shorts and right trainer.

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Old 05-06-2013   #23
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Re: Fuel...supermarket or brand

Well, he knows this guy, so must be true ....
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Old 05-06-2013   #24
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Re: Fuel...supermarket or brand

Quote Originally Posted by jrkitching View Post

The only difference between brands is the additive pack, which is usually added at the point of delivery.
No it's added at the refinery

Had this confirmed by Shell wheni asked why they didn't have Shell fuel save in east Anglia and the answer is because for technical reasons the additive can't be added at the refinery.
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Old 05-06-2013   #25
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Re: Fuel...supermarket or brand

Quote Originally Posted by tommo1 View Post
Also illegal at a petrol station to access the fuel tanks for whatever reason, except to take a manual 'dip' reading if the gauges are suspect.
Not sure where you got this from but it's incorrect

Or it's come in since I left the industry, which wasn't all that long ago.
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