General 100HP Rear anti roll bar

jakelleo · Jul 2, 2009

chauspain said:
Just read in autocar that the 500C has gained a rear anti-roll bar and all 500's moving forward will get one. Supposed to improve the ride so I wonder if this actually is something the 100HP would benefit from?

Ah Ha. Just as I thought.. Someone must give this a go. From the Fords parts bit might be a start might be/almost certain to be cheaper than Fiats parts bin, would be a quicker option anyway.

Whos going to give it a go ?..

I would love to, but just dont have a garage to
fit it.. Probably just a bolt on, same as the Skoda Fabia item..

Jake.

Murano16v · Jul 2, 2009

You have to love the 100HP. I was moving along on the A303 yesterday and I'll swear at least 2 or more wheels left the ground. I could see a sort of double undulation coming up so I just gripped the wheel and waited to see what would happen. Must have looked hilarious from behind.

johnbethell4@tiscali.co.u · Jul 3, 2009

Claude,
I,m in suffolk (just) if you haven't yet managed a test in a 100hp, welcome to have a go if you wish. John B

306maxi · Jul 4, 2009

trackdayqueen said:
Agreed. You'd need to revise the dampers and springs to work properly with an ARB.

If you just put an ARB on with the stock setup reckon it'd make for some interesting handling, might even be more oversteery than my integra!

It's a pity Ford don't do a 100hp equivalent because you could just fit a kit meant for a 1.4 Ka. I'm thinking that when the dampers go on the 500 (which will be surprising soon going on what some Panda owners have seen) I should be getting next week I might see about getting the ARB fitted if people have done it successfully and if there's a decent kit out there for the Ka 1.2 as I think by the sounds of it it would be a decent upgrade.

babbo umbro · Jul 6, 2009

OK.
Can anyone come up with the following part numbers, please?

500 1.4 rear spring
500 1.4 rear shock absorber
100HP rear spring
100HP rear shock absorber
500 1.4 torsion beam (also if different fro other 500s)
100HP torsion beam (also useful to know if different from other Pandas)

These to establish commonality.

Then

500C torsion beam
500C anti-roll bar - if separate from torsion beam
500 Abarth torsion beam
500 Abarth arb
500 Abarth rear springs
500 Abarth rear shockers

With that info it should be possible to work out what could be slotted in to 100HP with minimum hassle to give softer rear with arb and with sensible ride height.

306maxi · Jul 10, 2009

babbo umbro said:
OK.
Can anyone come up with the following part numbers, please?

500 1.4 rear spring
500 1.4 rear shock absorber
100HP rear spring
100HP rear shock absorber
500 1.4 torsion beam (also if different fro other 500s)
100HP torsion beam (also useful to know if different from other Pandas)

These to establish commonality.

Then

500C torsion beam
500C anti-roll bar - if separate from torsion beam
500 Abarth torsion beam
500 Abarth arb
500 Abarth rear springs
500 Abarth rear shockers

With that info it should be possible to work out what could be slotted in to 100HP with minimum hassle to give softer rear with arb and with sensible ride height.

Stuck my head under a Ka yesterday and saw the ARB as described, the only thing that would concern me is how you'd get the ARB inside the beam. To my mind it looked like the torsion beam was assembled around the ARB but you can only tell so much from looking under the back of a car of course.

babbo umbro · Jul 10, 2009

306maxi said:
Stuck my head under a Ka yesterday and saw the ARB as described, the only thing that would concern me is how you'd get the ARB inside the beam. To my mind it looked like the torsion beam was assembled around the ARB but you can only tell so much from looking under the back of a car of course.

Interesting - that's why the part numbers would tell the story - if the arb's a separate part it could be added to an existing rear suspension; then, if the torsion beam is common to, say, any 500/Panda with rear discs - then adding the arb to a 100HP along with, say, 500 Abarth rear springs and dampers, would be feasible and relatively simple to do.

tarbyonline · Jul 11, 2009

Read somewhere that the Ka is set up 30% softer at the back than the panda as a result of the ARB

306maxi · Jul 11, 2009

babbo umbro said:
Interesting - that's why the part numbers would tell the story - if the arb's a separate part it could be added to an existing rear suspension; then, if the torsion beam is common to, say, any 500/Panda with rear discs - then adding the arb to a 100HP along with, say, 500 Abarth rear springs and dampers, would be feasible and relatively simple to do.

Of course

Until anyone finds out for sure we're merely just speculating.

306maxi · Jul 11, 2009

tarbyonline said:
Read somewhere that the Ka is set up 30% softer at the back than the panda as a result of the ARB

Yes and no. The ARB has the effect of a spring as well so while the springs on each wheel may be 30% softer the ARB will cancel some of that out.

edwell · Jul 13, 2009

I did post some pics of the KA arb on here a few months ago, I'm sure a quick search will find them.
My 100hp is a lot better than it was when it was new with regards to rear suspension harshness. Here in Shropshire we have some very rough roads, and 8k of driving over these has "softened" the initial harshness to a more than acceptable level, the only time the ride is "bad" is when braking or slowing down over rough surfaces (the front end tends to "crash". (the answer to this seems to be to keep your foot in!).
I'm not sure it would be worth changing the rear beam unless you had a very good reason to do so and you would defo need softer springs and get rid of the long bump stops to have the desired effect. (better ride same (or better) roll stiffness. I seems to me that fiat have used the bump stops as a cheaper arb substitute, the problem being that they stiffen the rear suspension when both wheels are moving upwards (ie going over a speed bump) which a arb wont do.

trackdayqueen · Jul 13, 2009

306maxi said:
Yes and no. The ARB has the effect of a spring as well so while the springs on each wheel may be 30% softer the ARB will cancel some of that out.

Though it might be worth adding that an ARB will not affect spring stiffness when travelling in a straight line. This is why with an ARB you can have your cake and eat it, ie more comfortable in a straight line whilst reducing roll in the corners.

babbo umbro · Jul 13, 2009

edwell said:
I did post some pics of the KA arb on here a few months ago, I'm sure a quick search will find them.
My 100hp is a lot better than it was when it was new with regards to rear suspension harshness. Here in Shropshire we have some very rough roads, and 8k of driving over these has "softened" the initial harshness to a more than acceptable level, the only time the ride is "bad" is when braking or slowing down over rough surfaces (the front end tends to "crash". (the answer to this seems to be to keep your foot in!).
I'm not sure it would be worth changing the rear beam unless you had a very good reason to do so and you would defo need softer springs and get rid of the long bump stops to have the desired effect. (better ride same (or better) roll stiffness. I seems to me that fiat have used the bump stops as a cheaper arb substitute, the problem being that they stiffen the rear suspension when both wheels are moving upwards (ie going over a speed bump) which a arb wont do.

Spot on.

babbo umbro · Jul 13, 2009

trackdayqueen said:
Though it might be worth adding that an ARB will not affect spring stiffness when travelling in a straight line. This is why with an ARB you can have your cake and eat it, ie more comfortable in a straight line whilst reducing roll in the corners.

Nearly agree - you still get the stiffness of the spring on the other side from the bump mitigated by the twist on the arb, and the only possible other downside would be with squat on acceleration.

306maxi · Jul 13, 2009

babbo umbro said:
Nearly agree - you still get the stiffness of the spring on the other side from the bump mitigated by the twist on the arb, and the only possible other downside would be with squat on acceleration.

Yup. But of course what TDQ says still stands

I think a combination of what you're both saying would be about right

306maxi · Jul 16, 2009

Having looked under a Ka the other day and my 500 tonight methinks the torsion beams are different. Part numbers would of course confirm this....

HP · Jul 17, 2009

I very much doubt Ford and Fiat would use the same part numbering system.

306maxi · Jul 18, 2009

HP. said:
I very much doubt Ford and Fiat would use the same part numbering system.

Hence why you'd want to be comparing the 500c p/n's to the 500 ones

HP · Jul 19, 2009

Point conceded!

306maxi · Jul 19, 2009

HP. said:
Point conceded!

Woohoo I win at the internets!

I love the Panda forum.... you guys are so much more chilled out than the 500 guys

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