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General My new (to me) TA 4x4...

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General My new (to me) TA 4x4...

lunchbeers

lunchbeers

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So I set up an intro thread last week before taking delivery of my new (to me) Panda 4x4 TA - I'd done quite a bit of research so knew what I wanted, Twinair, in Tuscany Green ideally with the winter pack.

This would my first fiat, but have had Alfas for the last 10 years

So imagine my delight, when a 13 plate (Euro 5... think no DMF?) turned up, in the correct colour, correct interior colour, and with a winter pack with 10k miles - bit more than I wanted to spend, but worthwhile.

Long story short, it turned up last week... and it's pretty much immaculate, it needed a good scrub as think it's largely been through car washes throughout it's life, so after a good in depth clean inside and out, a full claying, paintwork correction and glaze and waxing, here it is.

It's in no means perfect however, It has a bit of kerbing to the front wheels, and has a light scuff to one of the corners - in addition, I am looking to make some modifications, i've never had a 'standard' car and am a bit of a tinkerer.

So far, I've treated it to a set of OEM 4x4 mats and bootliner, the big old aerial has been replaced with the fiat short one, and a set of the sill protectors will be waiting for me when I get home, also my Nextbase dashcam has been fitted.

The mods I'm looking to make are:

  • Install the sunglasses holder - my shades are being bashed about for now - parts on order from the dealer - happy to give p/no.s for those wanting to make the mod - may stick up a how-to thread if any interest?
  • Retrofit the height-adjustable driver's seat - the driving position isn't that great, nor that customisable - I'm not overly tall, but I have pretty long legs and haven't found a comfortable position yet.
  • Fit a suitable cruise control system
  • Replace the dated stereo and Blue&me with a touchscreen - likely the Alpine Halo9, I had a double-din in my last car with Android Auto and want it in my new one - will be trying to find a method to get steering wheel controls compatible too - apparently no call for these so connects2 who manufacture these devices haven't even tried to make one or tested any existing products apparently.
  • Swap the climate control for automatic climate control - don't know how likely this is... seen a similar thread on it being done in a 500, by changing the control units and some of the manual controls for actuators - if it's going to be a ballache or cost a fortune, then won't be happening.
  • Coming from a 280bhp Alfa to a 85bhp Panda is taking a lot of getting used to, I will give the engine some miles to loosen up, (having read up on the 20k threshold) but possibly a future conversion to 105hp may be on the cards - but who knows.

That's about it for now, I'm just enjoying the more sedate pace of driving, and most of all, that TA engine noise!
 

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Welcome.

Just a couple of quick thoughts about your mods.
The auto climate control is far less reliable than the manual air con system (search the forum, it goes wrong a lot)

105hp through the 4x4 system will give it a hard time. The propshaft centre bearing is already prone to wear. It's not a rugged 4x4 system make of large lumps of iron like an old Defender, it's peared down and light, just like the rest of the car.

The 105 hp isn't a massive difference, I think is produces the same torque (145Nm) as the 85hp anyway and the 4x4 TA's gearbox is so short in it's first couple of gears you ain't going to pedel it much faster.

I wouldn't count on the height adjustable seat making a big difference either, my 4x4 had it and it was still pretty uncomfortable after an hour or so, I also found the seat squab far too short (and a bit too flat) under my thighs as well and I ain't that tall.
 
There's a quick(ish) fix for the lack of under-thigh support in the driver's seat, which is to insert some washers in the front seat fixings, which tilts the seat back slightly, thereby raising the front of the squab. It's still not perfect by any means (and worse for people with long legs - I'm a short-legged Welshman, but I still find the seat squab too short), but it helps.

(My Cross has the height-adjustable seats - make sure you try them for size before swapping yours over, as you may find them no better, comfort-wise)
 
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Thanks, I've seen the practice of shimming the rails, just a bit concerned should that I have an accident then it's introducing a failure point. Definitely worth trying initially, it's only the cost of a few washers.

It's only been 6 days or so,so perhaps I'll find a comfortable position in time.

Could I ask you a question about your seats? I gather it only really tilts the seat base backwards and downwards? Does it go lower than the fixed height of the passenger seat, as some have mentioned it only raises the height from standard.

Like you I find the squab too short by about 2-3in.
 
Goudrons said:
Welcome.

Just a couple of quick thoughts about your mods.
The auto climate control is far less reliable than the manual air con system (search the forum, it goes wrong a lot)

105hp through the 4x4 system will give it a hard time. The propshaft centre bearing is already prone to wear. It's not a rugged 4x4 system make of large lumps of iron like an old Defender, it's peared down and light, just like the rest of the car.

The 105 hp isn't a massive difference, I think is produces the same torque (145Nm) as the 85hp anyway and the 4x4 TA's gearbox is so short in it's first couple of gears you ain't going to pedel it much faster.

I wouldn't count on the height adjustable seat making a big difference either, my 4x4 had it and it was still pretty uncomfortable after an hour or so, I also found the seat squab far too short (and a bit too flat) under my thighs as well and I ain't that tall.
Click to expand...

Duly noted on the Auto CC mod, I'm sure I'll manage with the existing system, at least the fan won't have a mind of its own as it did in my last car!

Thanks for your input, I'd read, but obviously forgotten that the peak torque output on these is the same, not wanting to stress the 4x4 gear anymore than my usual clumsy driving! I've had a centre prop bearing go on a Touareg before and it makes for an uncomfortable drive.

As many have mentioned their TA seems to loosen up after a few thousand miles so I'm sure that, and combined with getting used to driving a sprightly petrol engine again will see me getting the best of this engine and box before too long.

I'll keep experimenting with the driving position, sadly the only way it's not too uncomfortable on the ankles for now is if I'm pretty much sat in the back seat, and I can't fully depress the clutch without stretching.

Looking at ePer, it only lists one seat base, so wonder if it's something as daft as not having the control fitted and another cover panel?
 
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I have the adjustable driver’s seat in my 4x4 and have tried every combination of height and tilt to find a comfortable position. It’s fine for short journeys, but anything over an hour gives me the worst lower back ache I’ve ever endured in a car.

The position of the footrest doesn’t help, either.
 
A couple of observations regarding your original post (I have a '63 plate 4x4 TA).

Not sure the "no DMF" flywheel assumption is correct, certainly mine does have one?

Not sure that if the seat belt restraint system is functioning (and you are wearing it!) then your seat seems unlikely to be pinging around due to a failure of restraining bolts (obviously the bolts need a sensible amount of thread to remain engaged)

If you have had a long line of Alfas then you should be used to the long arm short legged ergonomics assumption!!?

Enjoy the car and keep the oil clean for the Uniair module...

Enjoy
 
Panda IIs said:
A couple of observations regarding your original post (I have a '63 plate 4x4 TA).

Not sure the "no DMF" flywheel assumption is correct, certainly mine does have one?

Not sure that if the seat belt restraint system is functioning (and you are wearing it!) then your seat seems unlikely to be pinging around due to a failure of restraining bolts (obviously the bolts need a sensible amount of thread to remain engaged)

If you have had a long line of Alfas then you should be used to the long arm short legged ergonomics assumption!!?

Enjoy the car and keep the oil clean for the Uniair module...

Enjoy
Click to expand...

Mine's definitely a Euro5, had it confirmed on spec sheet, engine control module (as scanned on MES) states it's Euro5, and whilst I'm led to believe the Euro6 ones had the DMF, I can't find a definite answer to this, although I have searched on ePer via chassis number and the part number definitely relates to a solid flywheel, I have looked at fiat workshop's parts list and it shows a remanufactured solid flywheel for the twinair until a certain date.

Anyway, if it has, it has, not much I can do about it, it'll certainly be cheaper and easier to replace than that on the 159, being a trained tech, I can do the job myself if needs be.

The seatbelt would be worn of course, I'm not daft, just don't want to make things worse.

My line of Alfas isn't that long, it's a 147 and 159, both which had seat base adjustment, and reach adjustment on the steering wheel, actually both very comfortable to drive.

One thing Alfas have taught me, is be on top of the oil!
 
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In regards to driving, I found the TA likes to chug around as the torque is produced fairly low in the rpm range, at around 1900rpm.

It takes some getting used to, you always feel like your flogging the engine in a much higher gear than your ears think it should be pulling, but it tick tocks along fairly happily at low rpm, you can almost count the piston strokes. Though that does mean plenty of gear changes to keep it in that rpm range.

Trouble is the engine does tend to beg to be reved as it spins up really quick, particularly in lower gears that are really short. It's fair to easy to slam into the rev limiter pulling away from the lights fairly eagerly.

First gear it a crawler gear but second isn't quite up to pulling off without flogging the clutch, I found pulling away in first with little revs so it just crept off, then short swift into second before trying to accelerate worked best.

It also saves the 4x4 system locking up the rear axle everytime you pull away, which doesn't take much effort really, the system is quite eager.
Being gentle like this will increase the mpg a little and help with the gear change, I found mine baulked a bit changing in to second when the coupling was sending power to the rear.
I did take mine back to the dealers for this baulky gear change and the service manager took me out and demonstrated it, under harder accleration the coupling shuffled power to the rear and it was hard to shift, gentle and stayed in FWD and was pretty smooth.
 
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I got it out for the first proper run last night, short bit of motorway, some city and a few quicker B roads, and it's either me getting used to driving it, or it's loosened up a bit almost like having an Italian tune up, but it seemed to enjoy it, as did I.

Think the driving position can be overcome with some more sensible trainers as it had about an hour's run yesterday and wasn't a problem.

Do think a trip to the dealers is in order to ensure all relevant software and/or recalls have been carried out, as don't think it's seen a dealer since new.
 
I got it out for the first proper run last night, short bit of motorway, some city and a few quicker B roads, and it's either me getting used to driving it, or it's loosened up a bit almost like having an Italian tune up, but it seemed to enjoy it, as did I.

Think the driving position can be overcome with some more sensible trainers as it had about an hour's run yesterday and wasn't a problem.

Do think a trip to the dealers is in order to ensure all relevant software and/or recalls have been carried out, as don't think it's seen a dealer since new.
 
Beautiful car. The spec and colour [emoji7]

The seat . Is that an extra level of adjustment over the normal height adjustable or did the 4x4 not come with it as standard?

I have a standard lounge and the height adjustable seat makes a HUGE difference on my lower back .
 
From what I've seen, apparently the height adjustable seat is standard in later cars, on my 4x4 it was available separately, or as part of the 'comfort pack', which would have been nice to have had.

I can't say that I have issues with my back as is, and I can reach the wheel well enough, but my issue lies with the angle I have to keep my ankles at to operate the pedals, I'm either too close and bending my ankles up further than they can go, or too far away and over-stretching to fully depress the clutch.

Might grab a bag of penny washers the weekend and see what can be done.
 
Goudrons said:
In regards to driving, I found the TA likes to chug around as the torque is produced fairly low in the rpm range, at around 1900rpm.

It takes some getting used to, you always feel like your flogging the engine in a much higher gear than your ears think it should be pulling, but it tick tocks along fairly happily at low rpm, you can almost count the piston strokes. Though that does mean plenty of gear changes to keep it in that rpm range.

Trouble is the engine does tend to beg to be reved as it spins up really quick, particularly in lower gears that are really short. It's fair to easy to slam into the rev limiter pulling away from the lights fairly eagerly.

First gear it a crawler gear but second isn't quite up to pulling off without flogging the clutch, I found pulling away in first with little revs so it just crept off, then short swift into second before trying to accelerate worked best.

It also saves the 4x4 system locking up the rear axle everytime you pull away, which doesn't take much effort really, the system is quite eager.
Being gentle like this will increase the mpg a little and help with the gear change, I found mine baulked a bit changing in to second when the coupling was sending power to the rear.
I did take mine back to the dealers for this baulky gear change and the service manager took me out and demonstrated it, under harder accleration the coupling shuffled power to the rear and it was hard to shift, gentle and stayed in FWD and was pretty smooth.
Click to expand...

I could not agree with this more, exactly mirrors my experience,especially the swift change from 1st to second gear. I hit the rev limiter a couple of times before I learned. A very novel but great little engine,especially in the 4x4. ENJOY
 
I'd be interested to hear how you get on with fitting cruise control as it's something I really miss. There have been a couple of aftermarket solutions posted on here before but they don't come cheap.
 
Yeah, I've looked at a couple of systems, the Conrad Anderson one is a bit steep at £360, seen another from NCS for £185, but no idea if it's any good or not.

Might end up being a bit of a pipe dream....
 
Always put me off..... Without using it yourself how can you really trust the word of others.

Cruise control in my 10 yr old golf for example is so much smoother than cruise control in a 2 year old Dacia duster my friend owns.
lunchbeers said:
Yeah, I've looked at a couple of systems, the Conrad Anderson one is a bit steep at £360, seen another from NCS for £185, but no idea if it's any good or not.

Might end up being a bit of a pipe dream....
Click to expand...
 
Both my last cars had it as standard and was a good system, on the 147, if you didn't have it, you could just buy a stalk and the appropriate steering cowl and fit it, all the wiring and other bits was pre-installed.

The biggest issue putting me off is that I like my cars to look and feel OEM, if I could find appropriate fiat parts which worked, I wouldn't care if it had an aftermarket control unit.

I'll likely do some digging, seems cruise control wasn't offered on any variants of the Panda, so unlikely any OEM parts will work.
 
lunchbeers said:
Both my last cars had it as standard and was a good system, on the 147, if you didn't have it, you could just buy a stalk and the appropriate steering cowl and fit it, all the wiring and other bits was pre-installed.
Click to expand...

I owned a z4 which was the same although you didn't need to change the cowl as BMW printed an outline for the cutout on the inside of the original cowl.
 
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