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Technical Oil

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Technical Oil

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Motorcyclist Colin

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I bought a 1ltr can of top up oil in December 2019 from the dealer from whom I bought the car( new in June 2018) I told the Spares Dept what the car was (2018 Panda 4x4 TA) and they sold me the 1ltr can of Castrol Magnatec 0W-30 C2 (Incidentally I have just been checking the price on the invoice and although I was DEFINITELY sold Castrol Magnatec the invoice says" HELIX ULTRA ECT C2/C3 0W3... " I did not notice this at the time) I was charged £21.05 for 1ltr.

My local Halfords today has 4ltr cans of Castrol Magnatec 0W30 C2 at 30% discount ie £24.50, so I bought a can.

Two questions here,
1 Is there more than one type of Castrol Magnatec 0W.30 C2? Halfords assured me if it was C2 0W30 then it was OK despite having different coding after the "C2" on my "dealers" can?
2 If they are the same how can dealers justify £21.05 for ONE ltr and Halfords sell it, ata profit for £24.50 for FOUR ltrs?:bang:
 
To clarify the above the designation of both the "dealer" oil and the "Halfords" oil are ;
SAE 0W-30 ACEA C2; PSA B71 2312
The dealer oil is called " Magnatec Professional"
Halfords oil is called "Magnatec Stop-start"

Confusing enough without changing the name
 
Best place for oil specs and recommendations and comparisons would be to look at Castrol's own website. They will explain if there are different oils. Most major oil companies will have an oil finder facility on the site, so see what they say for your car. Likely this is what Halfords have used. Your handbook will show the specs recommended by Fiat.

Whilst any product may have a recommended retial price, any retailer is free to charge whatever they can get away with. Halford have to compete with other retail outlets. Dealers tend to have captive customers. With service and repair work diminishing, dealers will maximise profit wherever they can.
Dealer workshops will often have bulk tanks of oil. The parts department will carry retail pots. Sources may be different. Parts may dual source, and invoice as one description, to avoid doubling up on inventory. I thought this had stopped many years ago, but apparently not. Strictly they have contravened the trade descriptions act, so if the container is still sealed, you could return and demand a refund. If they quibble, calmy suggest you will enquire at your local trading standards office instead, and start to walk away with pot and receipt. They'll probably stop you before you get to the door.

When needing more oil, research what is available from local factors, EuroCarParts, GSF, and CarParts4Less (mail order branch of Euro). See what they have, research the oil manufacturer website to determine correct one for your car, then comapre prices. Register on their sites and await frequent offer emails. They regularly have special offers, in fact CarParts4Less are currently offering 20% off engine oils. (Sorry) https://www.carparts4less.co.uk/?ut...913639307368069175298406860850941870242048344

(I have about 2 years worth of oil for the Panda, grabbed a few offers. Might be a bit over the top)
 
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portland_bill said:
Best place for oil specs and recommendations and comparisons would be to look at Castrol's own website. They will explain if there are different oils. Most major oil companies will have an oil finder facility on the site, so see what they say for your car. Likely this is what Halfords have used. Your handbook will show the specs recommended by Fiat.

Whilst any product may have a recommended retial price, any retailer is free to charge whatever they can get away with. Halford have to compete with other retail outlets. Dealers tend to have captive customers. With service and repair work diminishing, dealers will maximise profit wherever they can.
Dealer workshops will often have bulk tanks of oil. The parts department will carry retail pots. Sources may be different. Parts may dual source, and invoice as one description, to avoid doubling up on inventory. I thought this had stopped many years ago, but apparently not. Strictly they have contravened the trade descriptions act, so if the container is still sealed, you could return and demand a refund. If they quibble, calmy suggest you will enquire at your local trading standards office instead, and start to walk away with pot and receipt. They'll probably stop you before you get to the door.

When needing more oil, research what is available from local factors, EuroCarParts, GSF, and CarParts4Less (mail order branch of Euro). See what they have, research the oil manufacturer website to determine correct one for your car, then comapre prices. Register on their sites and await frequent offer emails. They regularly have special offers, in fact CarParts4Less are currently offering 20% off engine oils. (Sorry) https://www.carparts4less.co.uk/?ut...913639307368069175298406860850941870242048344

(I have about 2 years worth of oil for the Panda, grabbed a few offers. Might be a bit over the top)
Click to expand...
Interestingly Castrol website cannot recommend an oil for my 2018 TA 4x4, but thanks for the advice
 
Learnt the hard way from not using Petronas/Selenia oil in my twinair, including MOT failure for emissions (high Lambda due inlet valves not closing qiick enough) and Lambda sensor failure.

The Uniair unit is very sensitive to oil brand it seems. Hydraulic actuation of its components is quite precise in nature.

I guess another make for topups wouldn't be such a problem compared to a full change.
 
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Motorcyclist Colin said:
Interestingly Castrol website cannot recommend an oil for my 2018 TA 4x4, but thanks for the advice
Click to expand...

Perhaps that means they do not have an oil that they consider suitable. A very good reason to return for a refund.

Presumably you've had the car serviced, at that dealer? Check the invoices for what they say they used at the service. If as said above, this engine is critical with its oil, keeping those service receipts will be good ammo in case of failure, even out of warranty.
 
Thanks Bill
Car has not yet been "serviced" as such, as it is less than 2 years old and has only done 6000 odd miles. It did go back to the dealer for the £95 wash and tyre kicking exercise!
It is still running on the dealer fill of oil at delivery, with about 1/2 ltr of top-up oil subsequently.
What is interesting is that the dealer who sold me the car, is the same dealer that sold me the bottle of Castrol Magnatec "Professional".
If I had not enquired of the Forum I would have (very reasonably surely) assumed Dealer used that oil ie Castrol Magnatec
Dealer is some distance away from me and I am off to Switzerland shortly (by train) but when I am back I think a visit and a long face to face conversation is required
 
Back in @2005 our local'ish
multifranchise place ( who were actually fine for warranty work) always charged for Castrol..
in a non.fussy 1.1 panda I wasnt over concerned.. but summised if they used 'cheap local alternatives'

I may as well find a
cheap local alternative garage :)
 
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Motorcyclist Colin said:
Car has not yet been "serviced" as such, as it is less than 2 years old and has only done 6000 odd miles. It did go back to the dealer for the £95 wash and tyre kicking exercise!
It is still running on the dealer fill of oil at delivery,
Dealer is some distance away from me

I am off to Switzerland shortly (by train) but when I am back I think a visit and a long face to face conversation is required
Click to expand...

Couple of points there:

Unlike a bike.. which is shipped in a crate..and assembled locally :)

The panda will have driven 5 to 150 miles before sale
'odometer reset at point of sale' legally!

And all those 'performance gains' you will have noticed are the result of 'break.in'

All that shaved metal is either circulating.. or slowing up your filtration :eek:

My last bike (Italian) had mesh screen filters you removed and washed in fuel before re.use
They caught a LOT of 'build junk'.

Sealant..filings etc

With this in mind my TA had regular oil and filter changes up to 20k.
Nowadays its 12k apart :) its completely oiltight :)

You can choose ANY fiat approved workshop for servicing..

My old diesel used a fantastic Alfa dealer specialist.

The TA went to a small workshop run by the mechanics of Oxfords FIAT dealer that closed..

These have since all closed :(



Do have a great trip.. :)

Weve flown into Italy for a couple of self.organised rail tours..excellent

And having had my family fly into the 'french end' of Switzerland while working out there
We are jealous.. ;)

Charlie
 
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Thanks Charlie, we are hoping for plenty of snow, but it looks a bit unlikely at the moment
Guzzi, Morini, Ducati, ? What's your obsession?
 
varesecrazy said:
The panda will have driven 5 to 150 miles before sale
'odometer reset at point of sale' legally!
Click to expand...

are you sure about that?

I've not bought a brand new Fiat, but other New cars I have had never have 0 miles. My golf had 17 and the Minis have around 20 on them.

My golf was made in Osnabruck in germany (at the Karma Ghia factory) its then driven onto a train and moved to the german coast (emden) for shipping to the UK they move the cars around massive car parks there, they also drive them onto the ship and off again at the other end. they come into different UK ports but they are again stored in huge car parks, moved around as required and eventualy put on a truck to deliver to the local dealership.

All in all 17 miles on my golf when I got it, very likely coincides with the mileage you'd expect to see from the moment it left the production line.

As I said I have no experiance with brand new fiats, do they really come with zero on the clock?
 
Back when speedometers were occasionally unreliable, I've seen new replacements, straight from the parts box, with 3-5 miles showing. Shows its been tested. So likely to have some miles before fitting to the vehicle.

I understand that from the factory, there is a 'T' on the display. The dealer resets it to zero, and the 'T' disappears.
Whilst moved around storage facilities, miles will be low, as the Golf mentioned. Mileages higher than 20 suggest a vehicle driven between dealers.
 
portland_bill said:
Mileages higher than 20 suggest a vehicle driven between dealers.
Click to expand...

Normally I’d agree in the midlands or up north maybe, round here in the rural east it’s generally much more than 20 miles between dealerships, also brand new unregistered cars are not legal to be used on the road even on trade plates, so in the instance of the mini I have no problem believing it’s what it done in various depots and on its way out of the factory, as it was a group stock car and not a ordered car the build date is a couple of months before it was registered.
 
AndyRKett said:
are you sure about that?

I've not bought a brand new Fiat, but other New cars I have had never have 0 miles. My golf had 17 and the Minis have around 20 on them. ...

As I said I have no experiance with brand new fiats, do they really come with zero on the clock?
Click to expand...
When the dealer receives a 'new' Fiat from the factory, the odometer will indeed show some miles accumulated by being moved around between the factory, transporters, dealer sites etc. But, there is a capital 'H' before the numbers that shows it to be in 'factory mode' (not sure what 'H' actually stands for...). During the PDI inspection, the dealer will cancel the 'H' mode, which will reset the odometer to zero.
Often, as was the case with my car, this then results in the value shown on 'Trip A' as being more than the total shown by the odometer, as cancelling the 'H" mode doesn't reset the separate trip counter. Mine differed by about 12 miles.
 
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The oil saga continues. As previously mentioned another branch of the dealer who sold me the car (New Panda 4x4 TA) sold me Helix Ultra as a top up oil, in June 2018. In December 2019 the same branch sold me Castrol Magnatec as a top up oil, because they had changed from Helix Ultra. (as an aside, the December invoice showed Helix Ultra, despite the fact they supplied Castrol Magnatec. I failed to spot that at the time) It took a couple of weeks and a bit of prodding to supply the information, but,.
I have now got a (?) definitive answer from the original dealer that "currently only" Selenia Digitek oil is used. Their email was a bit ambiguous around the expression "current" in relation to the oil they supplied in2018 in my new car.
I have now contacted the original selling dealer branch with this information that their other branches are selling oil that (selling branch) don't recommend.
I have copied in the Managing Director Aftersales, and asked, inter alia,what they are going to do to resolve/rectify this situation
The car is now 20 months old but has only done 6400 odd miles. I will wait and see what they come up with as a solution, but I think at the very least I will require a written confirmation that no damage has been done and a free oil change now to Digitek
We shall see.
I bought a new Fiat 500X a few years ago from an entirely different dealer in Yorkshire and their PDI and after sales "service" (ha ha!) was appalling. It took me 10 months to get them to supply the radio aerial they had forgotten to fit, among other problems.
I love the Panda, and my wife had a great little Seicento, but Fiat dealers, so far have been anything but impressive
 
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