After 4 years 4 months the panda refused to start. The battery was dead. Too many short trips in the last 3 months !!!!

Euro car parts have a lion battery for 83.99 ..use code weekend 37...I say a lion battery as my zafira cdti has one .it has been great all though winter.

My 4x4 TA is just over five years old and Stop/Start had stopped stopping (!) even after a lengthy main road trip (to Italy). So, a couple of weeks back, I decided the battery was probably a bit tired - changed the battery - first halt, Stop worked - since then, Stop hasn't worked at all.

Same issue here, changed the battery for a eurocarparts Lion special and stop/start only worked once. Put it on charge overnight and it’s worked ever since, it probably lost quite a bit of charge in the time it was sitting on the shelf. It’s good practice to bench charge a new battery with a smart charger before putting it in the car anyway.

I see on the Rover 75&ZT forum that Lion batteries are giving trouble on the bigger engines and diesels. Could be down to poor manufacturing.

Mines been great over winter..but it does get used evey day.it like anything you pay your money and take your choice..you still get a 3 year warranty.

Phils panda said:

Euro car parts have a lion battery for 83.99 ..use code weekend 37...I say a lion battery as my zafira cdti has one .it has been great all though winter.

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You can get the same battery from CarParts4Less (ECP's sister site) for £58.78 (assuming 1.2), with a further 15% discount available to donated FF members

Things to consider when selecting a battery for a start/stop equipped vehicle:

Lead acid or calcium batteries simply don't pack the punch required for the SS system. They have good instant current but fail prematurely with quick cycles between charging and discharging.

Lithium batteries are lighter and fare better to charging and discharging compared to traditional batteries, but don't do well with frequent high-amp discharges (namely, the Start part of start/stop) as it degrades the cells much quicker.

Glass mat and 'enhanced' flood (acid) batteries are usually the best compromise, but can be quite costly due to them being relatively new and not gaining much traction over lithium.

All in all, I'd say the costs of s/s in the long run far outweigh the fuel and environmental benefits of using it in the first place as having to prematurely replace a battery carries far greater environmental impact (and cost) than the few drops of fuel it saves at a stop light only after the car has warmed up in the first place.

Edit: another side effect of start/stop for turbocharged vehicles is that the oil and water pump also stop when 'stopped', which places greater heat and wear on the turbo, especially in stop and go city traffic where airflow is minimal.

Start-Stop have never worked on any of my 85 TA cars, and i don't care it don't.

Same on my TA LOUNGE..Its never worked..

The Lion battery from Eurocarparts in my Barchetta only lasted 2 years. Never again.

oyumurtaci said:

Things to consider when selecting a battery for a start/stop equipped vehicle:

Lead acid or calcium batteries simply don't pack the punch required for the SS system. They have good instant current but fail prematurely with quick cycles between charging and discharging.

Lithium batteries are lighter and fare better to charging and discharging compared to traditional batteries, but don't do well with frequent high-amp discharges (namely, the Start part of start/stop) as it degrades the cells much quicker.

Glass mat and 'enhanced' flood (acid) batteries are usually the best compromise, but can be quite costly due to them being relatively new and not gaining much traction over lithium.

All in all, I'd say the costs of s/s in the long run far outweigh the fuel and environmental benefits of using it in the first place as having to prematurely replace a battery carries far greater environmental impact (and cost) than the few drops of fuel it saves at a stop light only after the car has warmed up in the first place.

Edit: another side effect of start/stop for turbocharged vehicles is that the oil and water pump also stop when 'stopped', which places greater heat and wear on the turbo, especially in stop and go city traffic where airflow is minimal.

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Can't see how its possible to use a lithium battery on a system that's designed for lead acid!!
They are totally different technologies.

Stop start is nonsense in my mind and just a ploy for emissions

murphyv310 said:

Stop start is nonsense in my mind and just a ploy for emissions

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It depends on how it's done.

I think I've stated in the past Fiat's attempt is crude and cheap.
It utilises the starter motor and battery like a normal start, with a sensors to protect the battery.
It's basically self defeating, using battery power to restart that it then has to work the engine to put back in it before the next stop, which it rarely manages.

This wouldn't be too much of a problem if it had the opportunity to recharge, but in city conditions of repeated stops and starts, the sensor calls time as it's not getting the time to recharge.

You've probably nailed it on the head regarding emissions ploy.

On the other hand, I've a Citroen E-HDi with stop start and it works perfectly as some development and cost has been spent.

It works on a hybrid alternator and capacitors.
As you brake to stop, the alternator charges the capacitors, not the battery. It actually kills the engine just before it rolls to a stop, which is a bit disconcerting to start with.

It then uses this power stored in the capacitors to spin the alternator, not the starter motor to restart the engine.

It's really has stored and used wasted energy to perform the restart, it's also saves the battery from repeatedly heavy hits on the starter motor so isn't constantly working to recharge the battery between stops, it's win win.

It's pretty seamless and smooth, it never fails to stop once the temp gauge starts to move off the stop and restarts are instant when you foot leaves the brake pedal, so there's no pause as it restarts, it's started just in time without that awkward pause.

Due to it stopping the engine before stopping, I wasn't a fan at first, but it's gown on me now and really is saving me fuel around town.
At the moment I'm just over 3 mpg worse in to town than on a motorway run, my Panda TA was move like 16 or 17 mpg worse.

Shame it's a Euro 5 and will soon be banned from the city centres!

gar074 said:

The Lion battery from Eurocarparts in my Barchetta only lasted 2 years. Never again.

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Is it a garage Queen? Any way take it back and get refund ..batterys have a 3 yr guantee.

Couldn't find the receipt.

oyumurtaci said:

Things to consider when selecting a battery for a start/stop equipped vehicle:

Lead acid or calcium batteries simply don't pack the punch required for the SS system. They have good instant current but fail prematurely with quick cycles between charging and discharging.

Lithium batteries are lighter and fare better to charging and discharging compared to traditional batteries, but don't do well with frequent high-amp discharges (namely, the Start part of start/stop) as it degrades the cells much quicker.

Glass mat and 'enhanced' flood (acid) batteries are usually the best compromise, but can be quite costly due to them being relatively new and not gaining much traction over lithium.

All in all, I'd say the costs of s/s in the long run far outweigh the fuel and environmental benefits of using it in the first place as having to prematurely replace a battery carries far greater environmental impact (and cost) than the few drops of fuel it saves at a stop light only after the car has warmed up in the first place.

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This has to be the most convoluted way of saying “a car with stop start needs a stop start battery”

There are a few (VERY) expensive lithium batteries for cars but they are for lightweight motor racing applications rather than normal cars, and generally have low power output to start a car a couple of times during a race if needed, certainly not something any normal person would fit or even consider.

There are normal lead acid batteries for normal cars, and glass mat type batteries are specified for all cars with stop start.

These systems are not fitted for your or my benefit, they are purely there to get a car through emissions standards testing. Some cars like the 500 Abarth didn’t even bother with stop start as the emissions where already high, it wasn’t worth the cost of fitting stop start, it wouldn’t have made much of a difference.

murphyv310 said:

Can't see how its possible to use a lithium battery on a system that's designed for lead acid!!
They are totally different technologies.

Stop start is nonsense in my mind and just a ploy for emissions

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You’re right, lithium batteries are not used for normal car batteries, they cost far too much and lack the punch in the small sizes used for car batteries.

Stop start is not a ploy. It’s not pretending to be anything else. It is 100% for emissions and not for the benefit of the owners of the cars, it is just to get the car through testing. In the real word when you generally don’t stop for more than 10-20 seconds the amount of fuel saved is negligible. It only really comes into play when you sit in stationary traffic for an hour, but you’d probably want some heating or aircon depending on the time of year so most would override it.

The Fiat stop start system is ridiculously fragile. If I turn everything off in my Punto it will last a little under 3 minutes before restarting which is not far off manufacturers specs, where as, turn on the lights, fan, aircon, vanity mirror and it will panic and restart the car after a few seconds.

Virtually every other car I’ve own with stop start (3 minis and a vw) as well as the multitude I’ve driven have never had the problems fiat have, they all worked faultlessly and would cycle on and off without any problems only when called on.

The only time you found them restarting was after 4-5 minutes having parked up and not stopped the engine. The Punto won’t even activate stop start after you’ve reversed into a parking space, that’s not a fault that designed into the system.

Stop start lol when at the lights/junctions these hold traffic up as most who have it don't seem to be getting moving very quick. I'm usually way gone before they move

sandeel999 said:

Stop start lol when at the lights/junctions these hold traffic up as most who have it don't seem to be getting moving very quick. I'm usually way gone before they move

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When S/S is working on the Panda it's ready as soon as you depress the clutch pedal so before you're in gear so there shouldn't be any delay.

babbo_umbro said:

When S/S is working on the Panda it's ready as soon as you depress the clutch pedal so before you're in gear so there shouldn't be any delay.

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I'm talking about s/s in general, seems most are so slow at moving off from lights I'm usually gone before I hear their engine start. The system may work well but it seems most I see can't use it to get away