Hello all,
I am replacing the clutch and release bearing on my 2012 1.2 panda tomorrow! It has done 46,000 miles which is low but it is all town driving, and I am 6'2 with big feet, and probably don't treat it with the kindest manner. Love the car though!

It has been whining for a while now and then, juddering and slipping here and there, with a burned clutch smell. It banged real loud the other day as I was pulling out into traffic, the car lurched forwards and the clutch pedal jumped up, almost like something was trapped between the clutch plates.
There has been a rattly loose broken sound coming from the clutch housing area when being driven, ever since the bang. It still works and the car drives, but it is certainly not right. Pressing the clutch stops the noise.

I am assuming it is the clutch that has died in some way, possibly a spring finger snapped off, or the release bearing broken, or friction material broken off, or similar.

The new clutch assembly with bearing and clutch alignment tool cost me £93.00. Mr. Clutch quoted £350 to do the job, and Fiat quoted £780!!! No way. It is simple enough to do, just time-consuming.

Does anyone know if there's anything particular to watch out for on these new pandas like a hidden split pin or circlips, or is the job pretty standard as far as FWD cars go? I.e. Wheels / driveshafts out, unbolt everything and separate the Gbox.

If anyone is interested, I can report back here after the job with some pictures.

Andy C

Hi.
Glad to see a lad of our age get the spanners out unlike some of the younger motorists.
I would like to see some pictures and a write up of the job. I don't see any great issues to be honest as the Panda is really quite straightforward.
Perhaps look at LUK or Sachs for a clutch kit, If my 2001 Doblo is anything to go by the OEM release bearing is not the best component in the world...... better though than the junk Rover used in the 75, a combined slave and release bearing made from Plastic!!!!

Nope. I am not amused with my car at the moment.

I managed to take one single blurry picture before dropping my phone from my oily hands onto the concrete floor. My replacement phone is now up and running. Long story summarized:
I jacked the car up on stands, took the battery, tray, wheels, struts, stay, gear linkage, clutch cylinder off etc etc, ring of bolts undone to engine from gearbox, engine and gearbox supported from above and separated... but you can not get the gearbox far back enough apart to get the clutch out!

I had to remove the cross member that runs front to back underneath the wheel (The one I had the car jacked up on :bang: ), and to do this I had to... reposition the jack then remove the front bumper assembly as I could not see any other way to get to the bolts that had to come out.
I eventually got the new clutch and release bearing in, aligned and refitted, then rebuilt efferything back onto the car. It turned into a complete nightmare of a job that took me about 6 hours. In about -2°C, on a driveway.

On the test drive I happily noticed the lack of clutch judder banging, and no longer did I hear groaning from the release bearing...that was sorted but my elation was short lived and my face dropped as my ears curled round in horror to catch the sound of the rattly broken banging noise that was still there.

I immediately punished the car heavily for its insolence, which did not help. In fact it made the problem worse, but after this cleansing of the spirit I could then diagnose it a little more clearly. The rattly broken noise is now audible in gears 1, 2 and 3.

Pulling away in first, the noise sounds like there is something broken in the gearbox- in synchronization with the gearbox speed, not the road or engine. Changing to second slows down the speed of the rattle and reduces the volume, and in third the rattle is even slower and even quieter too. In fourth it is barely audible... but still there

Probing the gearbox with telepathy revealed a summation that something is broken on the first gear cog, and when the larger cogs are engaged further down the shaft with higher gear numbers, it spins slower and further away from the gear that is in contact. I know the higher gears (2-3-4-5) may not actually be further away from the broken gear (might be right next to it), but they certainly all spin the shaft at a lower speed.

I found this cutaway graphic showing the gearbox, and it looks like a simple 2 shaft arrangement. Without stripping it I cannot really diagnose it further, but if the engine, clutch, release bearing, CV joints and driveshafts are all perfect, then the problem lies inside the expensive box of oily parts.



It turns out this is a fairly common problem on fiat 1.2 gearboxes (??), a noisy rattly first gear that spreads to the other gears and eventually stops the car. Caused by a gradual loss of oil from the gearbox (and mine was leaking from the breather on the top! If you have read this far, go and check your gearbox oil!)

I found a recon gearbox centre in the UK (http://reconditioned-gearbox.co.uk/fiat-gearboxes.shtml) that can supply a recon one for under £300 (and fit it for more, quote TBC), as I have now lost the will to work on this car again, and do not have the time. I also do not have the money available after doing the clutch replacement, which prevents the job from being done for a while. I will have to switch to my motorcycle for a month or two (1994 Triumph Daytona 900 :slayer

Hey ho. I still like the car and will get it sorted in time (and report back here for anyone who may be interested)

AC

Oh dear, I feel your pain.
On my 1.2 2001 Doblo I had a serious gearbox oil leak. Due to commitments at the time I couldn't get enough time to suss out the issue, I just kept refilling the box with cheap 20-50 engine oil. Fortunately no damage was done and eventually I found a split inner driveshaft gaiter. On the Doblo it is fixed at the gearbox end and a seal is on the driveshaft so the gaiter doesn't rotate, a rather odd arrangement.
The current Panda that I got a year ago during my checks felt low on gearbox oil when I checked it, so after draining I measured around 600ml low. I refilled with top grade GL4 multigrade synthetic oil and the change improved vastly, the box is leak free so I think I caught it in time.
Hope you get all sorted out OK.
I think its a reminder that so many garages skimp on simple checks that can't be done on a diagnostic computer.

andybass said:

Hello all,
I am replacing the clutch and release bearing on my 2012 1.2 panda tomorrow! It has done 46,000 miles which is low but it is all town driving, and I am 6'2 with big feet, and probably don't treat it with the kindest manner. Love the car though!

It has been whining for a while now and then, juddering and slipping here and there, with a burned clutch smell. It banged real loud the other day as I was pulling out into traffic, the car lurched forwards and the clutch pedal jumped up, almost like something was trapped between the clutch plates.
There has been a rattly loose broken sound coming from the clutch housing area when being driven, ever since the bang. It still works and the car drives, but it is certainly not right. Pressing the clutch stops the noise.

I am assuming it is the clutch that has died in some way, possibly a spring finger snapped off, or the release bearing broken, or friction material broken off, or similar.

The new clutch assembly with bearing and clutch alignment tool cost me £93.00. Mr. Clutch quoted £350 to do the job, and Fiat quoted £780!!! No way. It is simple enough to do, just time-consuming.

Does anyone know if there's anything particular to watch out for on these new pandas like a hidden split pin or circlips, or is the job pretty standard as far as FWD cars go? I.e. Wheels / driveshafts out, unbolt everything and separate the Gbox.

If anyone is interested, I can report back here after the job with some pictures.

Andy C

Click to expand...

Wow I hope you recover from this painful experience.