General The number one city car falls short of the Panda

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General The number one city car falls short of the Panda

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Every site I visit .. consistently, the VW Up is listed at the number one city car you can buy.. yeah yeah.

You might see the Fiat 500 somewhere, but rarely the Panda in the top 10.

I think at least when you compare the sales figures of your Panda to the Up! Since it came out .. you’ll see the numbers speak for themselves.



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The Panda has outsold it every year in a row. It probably helps that the Italians didn’t take so much design inspiration from the realm of washing machines.


Just thought I’d share this with you owners of the latest Panda in case anyone ever tried to underrate Fiat’s ability to make and sell em’ vs some other apparently sponsored reviewers and sales room ‘experts’.

Are you surprised?
 
There are even rumors VW will stop selling the up! in Europe.



VW boss says city car's future is in doubt due to challenges of selling small cars and meeting emissions targets in the European market.



https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motor-shows-frankfurt-motor-show/volkswagen-could-axe-europe



He must be smoking the same stuff as the emissions department! As fuel prices go up I’d imagine more people opt for smaller ‘city’ cars to cope with running costs!
 
Every site I visit .. consistently, the VW Up is listed at the number one city car you can buy.. yeah yeah.

You might see the Fiat 500 somewhere, but rarely the Panda in the top 10.

I think at least when you compare the sales figures of your Panda to the Up! Since it came out .. you’ll see the numbers speak for themselves.

It seems some of them suffer from amnesia as well ...

When the current model Panda was introduced, AutoCar reviewed the 1.2 Easy (25th April 2012) and the conclusion was: the Panda was "Everything a city car ought to be. The class has a new leader." (Ahead of the Up 'Best of the rest'.)

But by and large the motoring press in the UK (including AutoCar) have just ignored the Panda since. Many people detect a distinct bias towards VW group cars. When the figures show they are dog-slow, they come up with wording like, "seems faster than it is".

AutoExpress did make the Panda 4x4 1.3D 'best tow car under £15000. And Top Gear magazine has always given favourable reviews. James May (the most sensible of the old trio) owned the previous model panda.

Personally I find the Up/Citigo/Mii styling to be dull whichever face is plastered on the front. Boxy, with a long, ugly shaped rear.

They are refined but when I hear journalists using phrases like "feels like a larger car" I really don't think they get why I (and I suspect some others) go for City cars. If I wanted something that felt like a larger car I would buy ... a larger car! They are not that much more expensive. I want a car I use in town to feel small - narrow enough to squeeze through gaps, with the direct 'turn on a sixpence' experience you only get with a short wheelbase. I don't mind a bit of noise so long as it's a nice honest noise - I want a car with character.
 
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It seems some of them suffer from amnesia as well ...

When the current model Panda was introduced, AutoCar reviewed the 1.2 Easy (25th April 2012) and the conclusion was: the Panda was "Everything a city car ought to be. The class has a new leader." (Ahead of the Up 'Best of the rest'.)

But by and large the motoring press in the UK (including AutoCar) have just ignored the Panda since. Many people detect a distinct bias towards VW group cars. When the figures show they are dog-slow, they come up with wording like, "seems faster than it is".

AutoExpress did make the Panda 4x4 1.3D 'best tow car under £15000. And Top Gear magazine has always given favourable reviews. James May (the most sensible of the old trio) owned the previous model panda.

Personally I find the Up/Citigo/Mii styling to be dull whichever face is plastered on the front. Boxy, with a long, ugly shaped rear.

They are refined but when I hear journalists using phrases like "feels like a larger car" I really don't think they get why I (and I suspect some others) go for City cars. If I wanted something that felt like a larger car I would buy ... a larger car! They are not that much more expensive. I want a car I use in town to feel small - narrow enough to squeeze through gaps, with the direct 'turn on a sixpence' experience you only get with a short wheelbase. I don't mind a bit of noise so long as it's a nice honest noise - I want a car with character.

I have drove all 3 up!'s MPI 60 hp, MPI 75 hp, and TSI 90 hp.
I will choose my 85 TA 24/7. :D
 
I'm at the stage of life that I couldn't give a stuff one way or the other..:D You young whippersnappers tend to get all worked up about things like this needlessly. ;) Ah the impetuous of youth...:devil:

Life's far too short, just drive your chosen car & don't worry about all the other negativity out there.

Happy trails to you all....:)
 
its all about the badge
i sold my easy because i couldnt live with the euro 6 engine
lots of people turned their nose up at my car as it said fiat on the badge but it sold to an older sensible person
ive now bought a pop with no remote central locking and no aircon but pound for pound it beats anything that vw can offer
i also know where i am with an improved engine that started out as fire engine (look it up if young)
mpg locally showing 50mph plus
and pennies to service
 
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I'm at the stage of life that I couldn't give a stuff one way or the other..:D You young whippersnappers tend to get all worked up about things like this needlessly. ;) Ah the impetuous of youth...:devil:

Life's far too short, just drive your chosen car & don't worry about all the other negativity out there.

Happy trails to you all....:)

It's a long long time since I've been called a 'young whippersnapper' :D :D :D - I think you are making unfounded assumptions about other people's ages.

I don't much care what other people drive, and what other people think of my car, after all, I may not think much of what they drive.

But I think there is world a difference between an individual's choice and opinion, and the automotive media who make their money masquerading as a source of unbiased consumer advice. Truth matters. The conflict of interest between media outlets depending on advertising revenue from the companies whose products they are reviewing, presents obvious dangers.
 
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It's a long long time since I've been called a 'young whippersnapper' :D :D :D - I think you are making unfounded assumptions about other people's ages.

I don't much care what other people drive, and what other people think of my car, after all, I may not think much of what they drive.

But I think there is world a difference between an individual's choice and opinion, and the automotive media who make their money masquerading as a source of unbiased consumer advice. Truth matters. The conflict of interest between media outlets depending on advertising revenue from the companies whose products they are reviewing, presents obvious dangers.

My intended aim was the OP:) & I do know he's on the young side.:) As for yourself TT, this is the first I've seen of your post so really have no idea of your age..:D
 
The reviewers are quite shy to mention that VW cut corners by having exposed metal inside the cabin... something I only ever remember seeing on the 1990’s Ford Ka lol

It's hardly fair to diss a budget car simply on the strength of its trim. Where would you rather the money be spent; a fancy plastic interior, or better quality components?

I've not looked in any detail at the little VW but it'd be on my shortlist if I needed a new budget car, as would the current Panda, along with several other marques. I certainly wouldn't buy a new Panda simply on the strength of having had a good experience with the previous model; quite a lot has changed since then, and there are many newer competing cars that weren't available in 2010 when the Panda was chosen.
 
It's hardly fair to diss a budget car simply on the strength of its trim. Where would you rather the money be spent; a fancy plastic interior, or better quality components?

I've not looked in any detail at the little VW but it'd be on my shortlist if I needed a new budget car, as would the current Panda, along with several other marques. I certainly wouldn't buy a new Panda simply on the strength of having had a good experience with the previous model; quite a lot has changed since then, and there are many newer competing cars that weren't available in 2010 when the Panda was chosen.



The reviews consistently mention that VW cars have well built and superior interiors - mostly true in their models I can say. But not on the Up, not when they’re resorting to those efforts to save on costs.

I’d rather it be in the engine and driving quality but something tells me VW are more worried about engineering their profit margin and developing new marketing innovations instead lol

But ultimately more people must choose what Fiat offers than what VW offers in that sector. And despite this anybody looking for a new small car is fed a load of rubbish that they don’t seem to explain :-/ that being my main point
 
Granted, the last time I drove a city car was nearly 7 and a half years ago, when I had my Daewoo Matiz, (and I still have a colossal fondness for them to this day!) but I just don't see the fuss that the press make about the citiMiiUp! The Panda has a far more appealing look about it, plus I wouldn't mind betting the running costs are closer than you might think.
 
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I’d rather it be in the engine and driving quality but something tells me VW are more worried about engineering their profit margin and developing new marketing innovations instead

That would worry me too. It's a bit reminiscent of Ford in the 1960's and 70's; at that time, they had some of the most technically backward cars on the planet, but some of the best marketing in the world. BL had far more advanced products, but sadly were let down by indifferent quality, supply chain problems due to incessant industrial disputes, and abysmal dealer support. A reputation for poor reliablility kept the customers away, whilst in-service warranty claims crippled the company financially.

Sound familiar?
 
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That would worry me too. It's a bit reminiscent of Ford in the 1960's and 70's; at that time, they had some of the most technically backward cars on the planet, but some of the best marketing in the world. BL had far more advanced products, but sadly were let down by indifferent quality, supply chain problems due to incessant industrial disputes, and abysmal dealer support. A reputation for poor reliablility kept the customers away, whilst in-service warranty claims crippled the company financially.

Sound familiar?

Hi.
I could never understand the British motorist from the 60's up to the early 80's. Ford to me were very poorly engineered with antiquated designs. The cart spring back ends with live axles were fall backs to the horse and cart days and very early cars. The engines were uninspiring and the three bearing ones short lived. Rust was a big issue but no one was good back then.
When at the age of 20 I was slagged off continuously by those in the know when I bought a Skoda 1000MB delux at just over 3 years old with 19,000 miles on the clock. Well I proved the know it all brigade totally wrong, I added 60,000 miles to the car in two years of virtually trouble free motoring and nearly 50mpg to boot.
The Skoda of course was well engineered, the MB was reckoned to be one of the stiffest body's around, had a proper double wishbone suspension with coil springs on its own subframe. The gearbox was over engineered and the 3 bearing alloy block wet linered engine extremely tough. The downside perhaps was the swing axle rear suspension, it was though again independent and with coil springs. I went onto own many rear engined Skodas and never had one single breakdown.
I have to agree that Ford did market their cars brilliantly unlike many others and I also thought the motoring press got back handers, that's another story though.
 
I think the Panda is a great little car. It's the wifes car which I also drive when she wants to be chauffeured around, otherwise I use my Mini. Her previous car was a Hyundai i10. The Panda though, is way more exciting. The wife loved her old i10, until she got the Panda Twinair Trekking, she didn't know what she was missing. The Panda seems more spacious inside. Taller - better visibility. Definitely quicker. Bigger boot and just about more economical. It's so good that I told the wife that if she wanted to buy me a Panda Cross, I'd happily sell my Mini!
 
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I've had access to a Citigo and it isn't a patch on our Panda. The Panda is leagues ahead in design and drive, aided possibly by the smoother, elevated suspension and far gutsiest TwinAir motor, relative to the Skoda. Quality? Not sure - I think there is a big gap between perceived quality and actual durability.
The big difference is how the Panda just doesn't feel 'cheap' - the development team have actually created a design, not just a collection of parts that fit together. That's what makes the Panda class-less, in a way that the original Mini felt. It's a great car that happens to be cheap.
For the same money as a top-spec, nearly new Citigo (that really is best kept as a city car, albeit a crashy-suspensioned, rough running 3-pot one), we got a nearly new Panda 4x4, with all the extra functionality that brings. Sorry, but I think the media have got it wrong....
The only competition I really see comes from the Twingo, which might be even better in the city (with it's taxi-cab turning circle), though maybe at the expense of the Panda's practical, 'always-just-big-enough' boot.
 
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I'm on my 2nd Fiat now, and they just seem to be able to design a great looking interior. Granted, a couple of aspects let my old 1 down, (to be fair though, it was base model) but the design itself was brilliant! When I first saw pictures of the current Panda, I was struck by the sheer imaginative style of the interior. The vw balls up! has a dashboard you could imagine being used in a Polo. It's just very generic.

I really don't get why the motoring press bang on about interior quality though: on all mass produced cars, the dashboard and door cards are generally finished in plastic of some description, and as has been mentioned already, there is a vast difference between perceived quality and actual durability. That said though, a friend of mine has a Seat, and the interior of that is horrendously cheap and nasty. God knows how it managed to get signed off for production, and god knows why it sold so well!! [emoji52]
 
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I'm on my 2nd Fiat now, and they just seem to be able to design a great looking interior. Granted, a couple of aspects let my old 1 down, (to be fair though, it was base model) but the design itself was brilliant! When I first saw pictures of the current Panda, I was struck by the sheer imaginative style of the interior. The vw balls up! has a dashboard you could imagine being used in a Polo. It's just very generic.

I really don't get why the motoring press bang on about interior quality though: on all mass produced cars, the dashboard and door cards are generally finished in plastic of some description, and as has been mentioned already, there is a vast difference between perceived quality and actual durability. That said though, a friend of mine has a Seat, and the interior of that is horrendously cheap and nasty. God knows how it managed to get signed off for production, and god knows why it sold so well!! [emoji52]



Agreed to all of that. What’s amazing too is, even with the motoring press taking so many backhanded from the VAG Group, Fiat still outsells them on city car sector sales. Just imagine if they were honest. We’d probably be a slightly more popular community in the UK
 
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