General Hill holder/start stop/esc error: one solution

[philboo]

Having had the message pop up on my car and the exclamation mark warning for several weeks I think I've sorted it and thought I'd share.

Having called my local dealer and being told it would be £95 to connect the computer and diagnose any fault before anything I decided to buy the ODB cables and reader and multi ecu software for £40. I was given help on the correct cable/reader by a fellow forum member which I was very grateful.

Having looked at the error messages mine referred to the brake switch sensor.

I'd previously thought my errors had been low battery voltage (as suggested on the forum) which initially did look like it was the issue. However after a few weeks they returned.

I noticed it would generally happen after I'd pressed the brake pedal gently.

I looked on here at other forums and found the punto listing issues with brake switch. I looked at the passenger side (on a uk RHD model as mine) and removed the under glove box fabric and then removed the brake switch. Having read the punto forum I reset this switch by pulling out the plunger and then reinstalling it whilst the brake pedal was depressed. The pedal was then released which pushes the plunger back in to the released position.

The switch itself seems to be two switches in one, one which is normally closed and one which is normally open when the pedal is in the normal un-operated position

I was having this issue every journey and after this I've not had the problem for a week.

Hopefully this may help someone else on here.

 

[deeyup]

Just wanted to thank you for this post Philboo.
Typically my car just as I'm about to sell has started doing this fault constantly.

I've followed your info and found the switch plunger in so far that the metal plate wasn't making any contact at all.

I've taken a pic and video in case it helps others in this situation.
The plunger is on a ratchet kind of thing. You'll need pliers or similar to gently pull the plunger out. This is the position I found mine in and it pulled out another 5mm or so.

This is the switch

The plunger on the right should be out a lot more than in the picture.

When reinstalled it clicked back to a point where it was working perfectly.

I started the car with the switch removed and that immediately brings the errors up on the dash. I'd also noticed that previously whilst driving the error would occur during braking.

Video of the switch working as it should be after "correction"
[ame]https://youtu.be/bCkDbku3ei4[/ame]
Hopefully this has now solved my issue, it seems to have so far, but early days.

Thanks again Philboo.

 

[philboo]

Just thought I'd update this thread. After my original post here in June I had no more issues until the last two weeks when it had started again. In the end I've bought a new switch and swapped it yesterday and no more issues. I'll see how long this lasts. hopefully I've attached a photo of the part details if anyone else has this.

 

[Mads Gorm]

Just thought I'd update this thread. After my original post here in June I had no more issues until the last two weeks when it had started again. In the end I've bought a new switch and swapped it yesterday and no more issues. I'll see how long this lasts. View attachment 172528 hopefully I've attached a photo of the part details if anyone else has this.

Did the solution last?

 

[philboo]

Did the solution last?

Yes never had any more issues. Sold now but sadly missed.

 

[Panda IIs]

Did the solution last?

Hi there; I can confirm that the brake light switch replacement cures all sorts of ailments/messages including hill start and 4WD unavailable etc. It appears to work in open and closed modes feeding back to the control systems.

The stop/start system I think references battery voltage which can be influenced by the Intelligent Battery Sensor performance or function (another meaning for the acronym IBS) This is the unit on the negative pole of the battery.

 

[Mads Gorm]

Hi there; I can confirm that the brake light switch replacement cures all sorts of ailments/messages including hill start and 4WD unavailable etc. It appears to work in open and closed modes feeding back to the control systems.

The stop/start system I think references battery voltage which can be influenced by the Intelligent Battery Sensor performance or function (another meaning for the acronym IBS) This is the unit on the negative pole of the battery.

Thanks a lot for the reply - I will try changing it.

 

[Nirak]

Hi Mads Gorm - I just bought a 4 year old hybrid Panda, and it seems to have the same problem (Hill start holder + ESC).

Do you know where I can buy a new switch? (I ask you because I am Danish too - but if anyone else knows all help is very welcome!)

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

Hi Mads Gorm - I just bought a 4 year old hybrid Panda, and it seems to have the same problem (Hill start holder + ESC).

Do you know where I can buy a new switch? (I ask you because I am Danish too - but if anyone else knows all help is very welcome!)

Before going down that route, see the many other threads here that nearly always show those errors are caused by a failing car battery. Change the battery and they will nearly always all go away. The stop-start batteries rarely survive more than four or five years.

 

[Nirak]

Before going down that route, see the many other threads here that nearly always show those errors are caused by a failing car battery. Change the battery and they will nearly always all go away. The stop-start batteries rarely survive more than four or five years.

Thanks! Strange, never had battery problems with my former Panda which lived to be 7. But I will have my mechanic look at the battery first, thanks!

 

[Panda IIs]

Hi Mads Gorm - I just bought a 4 year old hybrid Panda, and it seems to have the same problem (Hill start holder + ESC).

Do you know where I can buy a new switch? (I ask you because I am Danish too - but if anyone else knows all help is very welcome!)

In addition to Herts Hillhopper's advice there was a thread on here fairly recently about a Hybrid with low volts which may help - I can't recall the detail but I think it was related to lack of use/failing battery...

There's lots of non-hybrid experience on here with similar issues caused by low volts as stated above.

 

[Nirak]

In addition to Herts Hillhopper's advice there was a thread on here fairly recently about a Hybrid with low volts which may help - I can't recall the detail but I think it was related to lack of use/failing battery...

There's lots of non-hybrid experience on here with similar issues caused by low volts as stated above.

Yes, I has not been driven much (64.000 k in 4 years), I will try to find the thread ... thread

 

[Panda IIs]

Yes, I has not been driven much (64.000 k in 4 years), I will try to find the thread ... thread

I think this was the one I remember - maybe not quite the same issue? https://www.fiatforum.com/threads/fiat-panda-hybrid-battrey.501131/ the search engine on this forum is pretty good - type in the search term and then select this forum. You might want to try the 500 forum (hybrid) too?

 

[Nirak]

Thanks. No not quite the same problem, but the more info I get here, the more it seems like my new old Panda needs a new general battery. Will ask my mechanic if he agrees ...

 

[Panda IIs]

Thanks. No not quite the same problem, but the more info I get here, the more it seems like my new old Panda needs a new general battery. Will ask my mechanic if he agrees ...

I'd suggest that a new (regular) battery would be a good place to start - I'm afraid I've no experience re hybrid battery, and its interactions with the existing electrical system. I do know from my experience that low volts triggers "no hill-hold, ASR and in extremis, no ABS" messages. All these functions are electrical/electronic based so voltage drop sets the warnings. The other place to look (and again this is not hybrid based experience ) is there is a voltage sensor on my (stop Start equipped twin air 4x4) -ve battery terminal which may be at issue (when I investigated these are not cheap to replace).

4 years with relatively low miles may mean the battery will have had its day - low miles might suggest a lot of deep discharges when sitting unused.

 

[FiatMatt94]

As well as a failing battery it could also be a faulty earth strap as I had this exact fault last year & it was a faulty earth strap from the gearbox to body as it was completely corroded at 5 years old, changed that with a £5 part from a motor factors & problem was solved & hasn't come back since of this helps

 

[Mads Gorm]

Hi Mads Gorm - I just bought a 4 year old hybrid Panda, and it seems to have the same problem (Hill start holder + ESC).
Do you know where I can buy a new switch? (I ask you because I am Danish too - but if anyone else knows all help is very welcome!)

Hi Nirak

Im pretty sure that you can get the brake pedal switch at Thansen. But I would recommend you do something else - buy a OBD-II scanner - like this one - - https://www.biltema.dk/bil---mc/var...asere/fejlkodelaser-obd-ii-eobdcan-2000040054

And read the error code. The Hill holder/start stop/esc error can be almost anting - much better to get a real error code with a reader.