A couple of other questions please guys.

Is the engine oil capacity for a 2016 TA 90ps (Cross) 3.5L for a full new fill?

Will my week-old Cross have come from the factory with 5W/40 or 0W/30?

As an aside although still oil-related, do you guys always let the engine idle for 20 seconds or so before switching off to allow a little oil around the turbo to cool it down or is this OTT.?

Thanks as always and best regards to all here.

Mike

TheItalianThrob said:

A couple of other questions please guys.



Is the engine oil capacity for a 2016 TA 90ps (Cross) 3.5L for a full new fill?



Will my week-old Cross have come from the factory with 5W/40 or 0W/30?



As an aside although still oil-related, do you guys always let the engine idle for 20 seconds or so before switching off to allow a little oil around the turbo to cool it down or is this OTT.?



Thanks as always and best regards to all here.



Mike

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Hi Mike, the lube engineer to the rescue [emoji13]


To answer your question, the oil capacity of the Engine is 3.2l, that is dry fill. However no matter what you do it will always have a percentage of oil left in the system somewhere from the previous full. Estimate anywhere between 2.7-3L will fill the engine to maximum.

Your cross with come from the factory with 0w30 Selenia fully synthetic ACEA C2 in the engine. Previously the engine was factory and service filled with 5w30 C3, 5w40 C3 is used on the 1.2 fire engine, not the twin air and using it will most likely cause big problems down the line.**

Lastly whenever I drive a turbo vehicle, my missus car included, I always idle for 30 seconds to cool the turbo and allow hot spots to be settled before turning into off. This is good practice and is proven to improve the life of your turbocharger, some manufacturers make a big point of reminding owners on handover to avoid later failures and headaches and put warnings relating to it in the owners manual. Also is a good idea in N/A cars too, may not be critical but reduces varnish and deposit formation within the engine.

Alex

** once again fiat has proven their technical skills to be a little off. Most Euro 5 Twinair engines were supplied with 5w40 in the sump, at some point just before euro 6, production fill changed to 5w30 (I have the FCA manufacture lubricant framework document in front of me) then with Euro 6 and a few faults and parts failures which could have been related to oil grade) they then changed to 0w30 which is far more suitable if I'm honest.

Yes my mechanics have refilled after an oil change with only 3 litres to allow for residual left behind however I have even found this to be too much, it's impossible to tell from the dipstick when the oil is new and its really only readable after a few K. The amount required will also depend on how warm the oil was when drained and obviously if it was left to completely drain. I reckon about 2.8 litres would be bang on after a change and would leave you a little bit of head room on the dipstick. AFAIK it's 500ml between min and max on the dipstick and yes Selenia 0W30 Digitek in the red bottle is your man for a Euro 6 TA!

Mercky said:

Yes my mechanics have refilled after an oil change with only 3 litres to allow for residual left behind however I have even found this to be too much, it's impossible to tell from the dipstick when the oil is new and its really only readable after a few K. The amount required will also depend on how warm the oil was when drained and obviously if it was left to completely drain. I reckon about 2.8 litres would be bang on after a change. AFAIK it's 500ml between min and max on the dipstick and yes Selenia 0W30 Digitek in the red bottle is your man!

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Seeing fresh Selenia on the Dipstick is pretty difficult, as it's even lighter than most oils! Been there bud [emoji3]

One benefit as well if you can is save a little oil from each change, my last few bottles of Selenia have been direct from Petronas and of 4L capacity, then the next change with filter off and sump plug out and with catch tray in place, pour 500ml into the engine. This then displaces the old stuff and helps flush out anything that's left when it comes back out the bottom.

Hi folks, i recently traded in my beloved 100hp for a 2013 panda trekking TA which i'm liking but looking on the selenia website and on shop4parts the recommended oil is selenia K pe which i used to use in the 100hp! And i have an unopened 5 litre tub.
What is confusing though is the 4x4 with the same engine is recommended as using the selenia digitek 0w30? Surely i would be ok using the selenia k in my trekking?

stationary traveller said:

Hi folks, i recently traded in my beloved 100hp for a 2013 panda trekking TA which i'm liking but looking on the selenia website and on shop4parts the recommended oil is selenia K pe which i used to use in the 100hp! And i have an unopened 5 litre tub.

What is confusing though is the 4x4 with the same engine is recommended as using the selenia digitek 0w30? Surely i would be ok using the selenia k in my trekking?

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Hey there,

When the engine came from the factory it was filled with KPE 5w40 however for multiple reasons fiat have now adjusted the servicing requirements for the Twinair. I think this is where that contradiction has come from bud.

Now only 0w30 is approved for the engine. In servicing 90% of dealers adhere to the service bulletin advising it's use for all UK Twinair power units. You may choose to use 5w40 but it is very much at your own risk.

Hope this helps

Ok thanks for the info fella, may just have to bite the bullet then & order some digitech 0w/30 as i plan to keep the car for a while & even though I don't do alot of miles i always make sure sure the cars serviced every year & the correct oil is used. I just wasn't sure if it was just the newer versions of the twinair which required the 0w/30 oil.

Hi,

Do you know if Royal Purple has an oil that complies with the Fiat specifications for the twinair?

Picking up our brand new Panda 4x4 next week, and I use Royal Purple oil on all my vehicles. And I love it. Now I won't be using it for the first couple of oil changes to have it break in properly. Hard to find anything about it online, and that goes for most brands.

Stefanesai said:

Do you know if Royal Purple has an oil that complies with the Fiat specifications for the twinair?

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AFAIK Royal Purple isn't available in the required 0W30 grade.

Alexiloki, do you have any experience of this brand?

I'm pretty sure they have 0w-30, although maybe not in all markets.

Stefanesai said:

Hi,



Do you know if Royal Purple has an oil that complies with the Fiat specifications for the twinair?



Picking up our brand new Panda 4x4 next week, and I use Royal Purple oil on all my vehicles. And I love it. Now I won't be using it for the first couple of oil changes to have it break in properly. Hard to find anything about it online, and that goes for most brands.

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Hi Bud,

I've looked at the info I have and to be honest I can't find anything suitable.

The International RP 0w30 has a High ZDDP additive package, which makes it unsuitable for the emission control systems of the Panda in general, expect to cabbage the o2 sensors quickly with that and likely kill your Cat in the long run. US emission testing is more primitive than ours and as such the oils the supply tend to be not suitable for EU sourced vehicles. Also in testing wear rates on RP haven't been great in general.

Broad equivalent that would be suitable world be Motul 8100 C2, recently passed Alfa Romeo Certification testing for multiair/Twinair engines.

I searched their website, and you are right. Couldn't find 0w-30. I have experienced noticeable difference in the sound and maybe also performance in every engine I have used it in. They seem to run smoother.

But I also have access to Amsoil as well from the same local body shop. They have both rp and Amsoil. The best reference on rp came from a boat owner, who experienced a great difference in how long the big boat took to plane, and also they could uses less throttle to keep it at cruising speed.

Wow! Now I am pretty picky about oils but I am now going to have a closer look at what I am using. Thankyou

Stefanesai said:

I searched their website, and you are right. Couldn't find 0w-30. I have experienced noticeable difference in the sound and maybe also performance in every engine I have used it in. They seem to run smoother.



But I also have access to Amsoil as well from the same local body shop. They have both rp and Amsoil. The best reference on rp came from a boat owner, who experienced a great difference in how long the big boat took to plane, and also they could uses less throttle to keep it at cruising speed.

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If it's any help the RP 0w30 is available but only in selected markets. I have the US reference testing. Appears to be a amsoil base stock with RP additive pack.

Alexiloki said:

If it's any help the RP 0w30 is available but only in selected markets. I have the US reference testing. Appears to be a amsoil base stock with RP additive pack.

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I've used Amsoil in the past in older engines (1275cc A-Series, Lotus Twin-Cam etc) and they sure are goddam' slippery and both engines were smoother and sharper when run on the US oil. I tried their 75w90 Gearbox oil in the Lotus transaxle but that was simply too slippery and the syncro's crunched badly after the oil change, so I went back to normal stuff. Amsoil 2-Stroke oil made my KH250 fly however....

But maybe these very highly rated (in their homeland particularly) US oils just don't have the technical ability to be safe in the more advanced EU engines we run here, so I will heed our very knowledgeable members advice and stick to the Selenia stuff in my TA for now I think! But if I have another small-block in the fleet to feed, then maybe I'd be using still.

Interestingly enough, I tried Amsoil in my Renault Sport Spider (Clio Williams 2-litre 16v) and it didn't like it much - more harshness overall and not so enjoyable to drive, so that now lives on 10w40 Magnatec and seems happy as Larry again. Sensitive things these engines I think.....

R1NGA said:

But maybe these very highly rated (in their homeland particularly) US oils just don't have the technical ability to be safe in the more advanced EU engines we run here, so I will heed our very knowledgeable members advice and stick to the Selenia stuff in my TA for now I think! But if I have another small-block in the fleet to feed, then maybe I'd be using still.



Sensitive things these engines I think.....

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That exactly it, with the greatest of respect to our American brethren, there is a reason their engines are called "pig iron"

A good example would be the ford modular/triton V8, massively popular and still one of the US markets most advanced home designed engines which is still being sold new today.....however it has clearances and tolerances that make a BL O Series look impressive, poor power output for its displacement, drinks oil and blasts out so much pollution in a year that the average euro engined car would take 10 years to make the same contribution!

Because of cack tolerances, rubbish anti pollution systems (sometimes none at all depending on what state your in and local rules) lack of serious lifetime emission testing (like our mot), oils which are loaded with insane amounts of Zinc, Phosphorus and Ash which protect the engine really well but cause massive pollution and certain death to emissions systems and tight tolerance engines, US bred lubricants are just plain unsuitable over here for the most part.

Other thing is that the US market is still obsessed with 3-6k oil changes, absolutely insisting if they are not done the engine with explode in about a week.

A lot of US marketed lubricants, some from the company I work for too, have crap longevity in comparison to the European blends, they aim for high short term performance and short drain intervals, whereas here it's all about keeping the performance consistent over a longer period. People over there are slowly getting out of this habit and the industry is trying to convince people it isn't needed, but the majority still do it.

Some people think oil is just oil, in my job I'm shown daily that just isn't the case at all [emoji15]

There was a recent court case in the U.S. wherein a person tried to sue Honda because their engine seized at 28k miles.

They had never changed the oil, and the argument presented in the case was that they were never told to. There was a short to and fro about whether buyers are obligated to read the user manual/handbook, after which it was decided that the manufacturer was not at fault.

Following after the ridiculous "ice coffee has too much ice and therefore isn't the advertised amount of coffee" lawsuit which was thrown out, it seems common sense may once again be prevailing in America.