It is possible to get very good mpg out of a twin air.
On my route home from work around 14 miles the best I ever got on hue computer out of my 500 twin air + was 72mpg.
In my panda 4x4 twin air 62mpg.

The best full tank out of my 4x4 was 50.2mpg according to Fuelly which is accurate.

You have to drive very carefully though to get those high daily figures.

all good balanced views..,


you've got to weigh up the "real-world" costs of TA against the 1.3 diesel,
the TA certainly carries a large NEW Price premium over the 1.2 petrol..
Servicing costs over @ 100K miles should be cheapest in the 1.2 , and similar for the TA and diesel - both have cam-chains and DPF's..!!,
only real variable is fuel costs - very much dependant on driving style.


as people have said the TA can give you little old lady running costs and / or a GTI' feel performance depending on your mood,


other consideration are the trim levels and equipment , my punto TA has a 6 speed box , aircon and Cruise as standard,
still giving high 40's on a daily commute basis,
Charlie

soupdragon said:

How long have you had your TwinAir for? Long enough to report a reliable mpg figure yet?

Cheers Tom

Click to expand...

I've had it since July 1st, 2600 miles so far and ave mpg is 41.9.....majority rural/town driving. On a run its nearer 45....

deeyup said:

It is possible to get very good mpg out of a twin air.
On my route home from work around 14 miles the best I ever got on hue computer out of my 500 twin air + was 72mpg.
In my panda 4x4 twin air 62mpg.

The best full tank out of my 4x4 was 50.2mpg according to Fuelly which is accurate.

You have to drive very carefully though to get those high daily figures.

Click to expand...

What's your mileage now? Mine is only 2600 so quite a way to go till its fully loosened up....I must admit I never use eco setting!

The Pretender said:

Not enough cylinders.
A car engine needs at least 4 cylinders to call it a car engine IMHO.
Everything less, is Lawn mower material.
A 4 cylinder Multi-Jet is a great engine, sadly enough not available overhere in a Panda.

Click to expand...

Both are good engines - although the Multi-Jet is not bomb proof, there are plenty on this forum (500 & Panda sections) who are having DPF issues and a couple of cars with broken cam-chains recently which is a weak point of the MJ engine.

soupdragon said:

I'm not sure that the 1.2 would have the response or grunt to do that bit of road justice, let alone be able to overtake at speed on the motorway without planning it a couple of miles in advance ( and revving the b**ls of it )......
I know we only do the trip a few times a year but I want to make the trip as enjoyable as possible.

Click to expand...

Fair enough, I can certainly see where you are coming from here.

It's all subjective though I guess. I personally find the 1.2 a real treat to drive 95% of the time (the 5% driving up hills and on motorways could be better, but still pleasant enough). When you get up to around 4500 rpm it still sounds relatively "sporty". But once you go past 5,000rpm, yeah...it does start to feel the strain a bit!

Given what you have said, I would have to say the TA sounds like the best choice for you. Of course it's you that needs to test drive it and feel happy with the engine, but it does sound like a good match.

deeyup said:

On my route home from work around 14 miles the best I ever got on hue computer out of my 500 twin air + was 72mpg.
In my panda 4x4 twin air 62mpg.

Click to expand...

Are those figures " live " one off spot figures or a total from over the 14 mile run?

Cheers Tom

varesecrazy said:

both have cam-chains and DPF's..!!

Click to expand...

Does the TwinAir suffer as badly as the Multijet with problems from the filter thingy?

Cheers Tom

triumph7 said:

I've had it since July 1st, 2600 miles so far and ave mpg is 41.9.....majority rural/town driving. On a run its nearer 45....

Click to expand...

Still loosening up then? Hopefully it'll keep improving

Cheers Tom

Super Uwe said:

Fair enough, I can certainly see where you are coming from here.

It's all subjective though I guess. I personally find the 1.2 a real treat to drive 95% of the time (the 5% driving up hills and on motorways could be better, but still pleasant enough). When you get up to around 4500 rpm it still sounds relatively "sporty". But once you go past 5,000rpm, yeah...it does start to feel the strain a bit!

Given what you have said, I would have to say the TA sounds like the best choice for you. Of course it's you that needs to test drive it and feel happy with the engine, but it does sound like a good match.

Click to expand...

I think half of my choice is down to the fact that I don't really do " normal ", whatever that is. I tend to go for the slightly out there options, that's what is drawing me to the TwinAir.
I've almost convinced myself that it'll get the twin. I'll just have to lower my mpg expectancy after 5 years of getting around 55-60 from my multijet.

Cheers Tom

triumph7 said:

What's your mileage now? Mine is only 2600 so quite a way to go till its fully loosened up....I must admit I never use eco setting!

Click to expand...

Just approaching 10,000 miles. TBH, with my 500 and Panda I've not seen any significant improvement in gas mileage as the miles went on. My best mpg's in both cars where when nearly new.

soupdragon said:

Are those figures " live " one off spot figures or a total from over the 14 mile run?

Cheers Tom

Click to expand...

The average over the whole route.

varesecrazy said:

all good balanced views..,


you've got to weigh up the "real-world" costs of TA against the 1.3 diesel,
the TA certainly carries a large NEW Price premium over the 1.2 petrol..
Servicing costs over @ 100K miles should be cheapest in the 1.2 , and similar for the TA and diesel - both have cam-chains and DPF's..!!,
only real variable is fuel costs - very much dependant on driving style.


as people have said the TA can give you little old lady running costs and / or a GTI' feel performance depending on your mood,


other consideration are the trim levels and equipment , my punto TA has a 6 speed box , aircon and Cruise as standard,
still giving high 40's on a daily commute basis,
Charlie

Click to expand...

Whilst the TA does indeed have a cam chain - it's unlikely to have a DPF (Diesel Particulate Filter) I'd have thought.......

soupdragon said:

Does the TwinAir suffer as badly as the Multijet with problems from the filter thingy?

Cheers Tom

Click to expand...

The TA doesn't have a dpf. The d = diesel.
I believe the new Euro 6 petrol motors are now being fitted with some kind of exhaust filter? Anyone able to clarify?

soupdragon said:

I think half of my choice is down to the fact that I don't really do " normal ", whatever that is. I tend to go for the slightly out there options, that's what is drawing me to the TwinAir.
I've almost convinced myself that it'll get the twin. I'll just have to lower my mpg expectancy after 5 years of getting around 55-60 from my multijet.

Cheers Tom

Click to expand...

I'm like you. Much prefer the off the wall choices.....
Nick

soupdragon said:

Does the TwinAir suffer as badly as the Multijet with problems from the filter thingy?

Cheers Tom

Click to expand...

I think he meant that they both have cam chains, the TA doesn't have a DPF (clue's in the name - diesel particulate filter).

soupdragon said:

About the DPF.

I was under the impression that my current engine had one or am I just assuming?

Click to expand...

You are just assuming.

I'd be extremely surprised if a 2007 Panda Mjet had a DPF. AFAIK they are only required to meet Euro5 (or later) emissions standards and IIRC none of the Mk3 Pandas ever had one. AIUI the Mjet was discontinued from the last of the Mk3's for that very reason. MEP is the expert here on models & variants & may be along in a minute.

DPF's really are a game changer - we're not in Kansas anymore. The long-term economics of the small diesel go out of the window if you factor in £1000+ for DPF replacement at 75000 miles & all those regenerations eat into the fuel savings too. Injectors don't last forever either; one chap was on here awhile back bemoaning a four figure bill for replacement at about the same mileage; they don't always come out easily & there's a recommendation to change the fuel lines on common rail diesels whenever you disturb the injectors...

TBH, if I couldn't live with a 1.2 & wanted something with a bit more performance than a TA or Mjet, I'd be looking at something else entirely.

If I could put in just a little more cash, then it'd probably be a Suzuki Swift Sport; 136 BHP, an uncomplicated NA petrol engine, and with build quality, performance & handling that'll blow a 500 Abarth into the weeds. They're popular track day hire cars at the 'ring for a reason.

millns84 said:

I think he meant that they both have cam chains, the TA doesn't have a DPF (clue's in the name - diesel particulate filter).

Click to expand...

sorry = 1 character out.. I MEANT to type DMF

Dual Mass Flywheel , another costly item in years to come when it breaks down

( designed to smoooth out the engines pulses to extent gearbox life )

Charlie

jrkitching said:

You are just assuming.

I'd be extremely surprised if a 2007 Panda Mjet had a DPF. AFAIK they are only required to meet Euro5 (or later) emmissions standards and IIRC none of the Mk3 Pandas ever had one. AIUI the Mjet was discontinued from the last of the Mk3's for that very reason. MEP is the expert here on models & variants & may be along in a minute.

DPF's really are a game changer - we're not in Kansas anymore. The long-term economics of the small diesel go out of the window if you factor in £1000+ for DPF replacement at 75000 miles & all those regenerations eat into the fuel savings too.

TBH, if I couldn't live with a 1.2 & wanted something with a bit more performance than a TA or Mjet, I'd be looking at something else entirely.

If I could put in just a little more cash, then it'd probably be a Suzuki Swift Sport; 136 BHP, an uncomplicated NA petrol engine, and with build quality, performance & handling that'll blow a 500 Abarth into the weeds. They're popular track day hire cars at the 'ring for a reason.

Click to expand...

That wud be my choice too if I didn't need a 4x4. Fab cars....

varesecrazy said:

sorry = 1 character out.. I MEANT to type DMF

Dual Mass Flywheel , another costly item in years to come when it breaks down

( designed to smoooth out the engines pulses to extent gearbox life )

Charlie

Click to expand...

At least the MJet Panda is spared that expense. Added to DPF woes, DMF's put the economics of some larger diesel cars into question...

Experiences with Mk 3 Pandas showed the MJ giving 60 mpg - but being very front-heavy and eating front tyres; Mrs b_u's current 1.2 gives 50 mpg - really nice to drive for what it is but a bit short of oomph especially on long trips; the 100HP gave 40 mpg and was great fun, for chucking round roundabouts or going to Italy, but absolutely hopeless in the snow. For overall cost of ownership the 1.2 is streets ahead as you'd have to do a massive mileage to get back the premium pricing of the MJ, plus higher maintenance costs. All three were/are completely reliable.

My current 4x4 TA is averaging about 37 mpg over nearly 7000 miles, though it averaged over 40 on an extended trip to and from Italy, so around Devon it's doing about 35 mpg; surprisingly nippy, very nearly as quick as the 100HP up to about 95, and actually quicker in any one gear unless you really pushed the 100HP, also a really good ride and excellent on the motor way/autoroute/autostrada, brilliant off road, and - I hope - in the snow.