This is how I start my Palio 1.9D in the morning.

I turn the key half-on. The coil glows and after few seconds it goes off. I do this process for 5-7 times and then I fully turn-on the ignition. But, It never starts like that. I continue the process (5-7 times heating and the turn-on the ignition) for 5-6 times. Then suddenly, in one ignition the engine starts. I don’t know exactly howmany times I try. But on an average I take 15 mins. to start. Sometimes it takes 30 mins, and sometimes 5mins.

Once it starts, throughout the day there is no problem. I run around 50kms/day within the city. My job demands me to run 7 to 10kms at a stretch and take a break for 2hrs.
Throughout the day, whenever I start my car after the break there is no problem. It starts at one ignition.

I changed the battery with high power Exide DIN60
I changed the carbons on the car-self
I changed the plugs.
I still not checked the self coil armature.

The car is 2004 made and had run 89,900kms. And I purchased it 2nd hand 3months back.

My mechanic told me this is a simple problem of cold start. It will go, as soon as the summer comes.

Can somebody put some light into the problem?

I want to know;
1.) What is the real problem in the morning’s 1st start? (Because I don’t believe that in kolkata’s winter, a trouble free car cannot take 20-30 mins to take a normal cold start.)
2.) Where exactly lies the problem? Since, I’m running the car throughout the day, without and problem, I’m having a feeling that there is no problem in the engine of the car but some minor niggles in the starting mechanism. (I might be absolutely wrong).
3.) How is it possible to start the car in one shot (2-3 times heating and then ignition) in the morning?
4.) If the above (no. 3) is not possible in such an old car, what is the best I can expect and can I do to achieve that.

Thanks.

If you have not tried this, try this simple test:

• After driving for 50 Km, leave the car with the mechanic.
• Let him check the charge.
• Next morning, before you start, check the battery charge.
• If there is a drastic reduction, culprit could be one of the two;
• 1) Battery is not holding the charge
• 2) there is a leakage of power which you are not able to notice ( Say some light / stereo short circuit eating the charge away)
• Check connections and alternator as well.
• I agree with you that Cal has no winter. No harm in putting a blanket on the hood during night and experimenting once if it is feasible.
• For 50 Km driving, car shouls start at first crank.
• Shut of AC, Music, for the last 5-10 kilometers of the usage and see whether there is any improvement.
• If it is a battery under warranty, take it to exide for their views.
• As I have mentioned in the earlier thread, Battery charging is like an SB account.
• You need to put money to withdraw. You need to charge the battery to draw current initially.
• If for all the 50 Km, you are using AC, Music, Night driving etc, Practically you are not depositing anything. Check this.
• I wish you success

Car should start right away when the glow light goes out, cold and/ or warm.
There's something wrong for sure.
Did you use the right glowplugs?
Even if they are +/-1 mm shorter than original, problems will appear.

Thanks Suresh.

The battery is brand new. After a lot of confusion with the last battery, with Exide officials, I changed it 2weeks back.
I checked the closing (night) and starting (morning) charge of the battery with bat moble service from Exide. It is the same.
The alternator was also checked by Exide people. It's recharging current is a bit low (few mili amps), which they said is negligible.
I had driven a lot of days without AC, Music, Just Headlights. But the same problem happened the next day.

Now where do I stand?

Thanks Peter.

As you rightly said, I too, feel there is a problem. But where is it?
Can it be the engine? If so, then why there is no problem throughout the day? And why all non-cold-starts are as smooth as a new car?
Which part of the car should one start the checkup from?

Please help. I am ready to do and spend everything for this car. But simply cannot sale it off.

Regards.

check the fuse / relay for signs of rust in the engine bay. DIN 60 is the right battery for the diesel.

Which mechanic in Kolkata do you go to?

Dear Sarbajit

To my mind, it has got nothing to do with the engine.

Think of starting circuit. Possibly check:

1. across terminal voltage of 13.4 V in the morning.
2. Faulty heater plugs- they are 4 in numbers.
3. any other electrical part like starting swich, any relay or capacitor.
4. this symptom indicates an electrical problem.

Sukhesh

I suspect wrong or faulty glowplugs, or glowplug relais.

i read in of the other threads that only two glow plugs were changed - and Peter asked if the other two were changed along with the two faulty ones. that could be an issue as pointed out by Peter.

a faulty relay with rust may drain the battery over-night. so it is better to get that checked.

Sarbajit - we stay in the same city - so if there is any way i can help, do get in touch.

Take care.

Thanks Suresh, Peter & Rocker.

From all your suggestions, one thing is sure that the car's engine is trouble free.

Rocker: Its great to hear that you r from the same town. And I'm really gratefull for your help. Before I bother you directly, I would like to try myself, but with your help. As in a prev thread I said, I have a Palio 1.2Nv petrol, I have a mechanic who is servicing that car for last 4yrs., almost smoothly. So, I somewhat rely that guy. And called him for this 1.9D.
Anyway, as Fiat outsourced their service to TASS and with TASS's reputation and such an old and rare fiat, do you suggest me to go to TASS? Else do you suggest someone reliable for Palio D.

As you see, 3weeks back, I changed two of the plugs, If I change now, should I change all 4 or just the old 2 plugs?

By the way, none of you mentioned anything about the armature coil of the self. Do I need to check that or my mechanic is just fooling me?

My friend and I go to Alok Automobiles (at Maruti Bagan) and get our 1.6 GTXs maintained. Alok Auto' is a Hyundai A.S.S. but they do take care of other brands. You can find more details in this thread: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/other-cities/84499-alok-automobiles-kolkata.html

Armature - look for traces of metal dust near the starter motor. if you find metal dust - armature needs to be checked / repaired. But i doubt if it is the cause.

Coil - just get the 2 old coils changed - that should do the trick - if the problem lies there.

EDIT: where in Kolkata do you stay?

1, your car is not old or rare at all.

2, just change the two glowplugs you didn't change in the first place, the two others are new.

3, let us know if this improves cold starting ( I bet it does).


As for servicing your car, why not go to this new place, look around and talk to the mechanics, follow your feelings and decide.

Thanks Rocker.

I stay in Saltlake, near Tank No 7.

Thanks Peter.

For last few months I'm driving this car. I see few palios daily, but have not seen a single 1.9D on road till date. That's why I called it rare (which makes me proud). Thanks again for the confidence about changing the plugs. I do that soon and definitely let you know. And as you and Rocker said rightly, I have to try a new place for my car servicing.

One interesting point. Last few days, suddenly the winter of Kolkata is gone and similarly my morning start is taking much less time, say 3 to 5 try only.

stress on two glow plugs is less as it gets warmer in Kolkata.

anyways, keep us updated.

Thanks Rocker.

Specially, for the AA contact. As soon as I get time, I'll go there and do the plug changes.

Regards.