Well, finally, after a ridiculous amount of effort, I removed the old, broken steering wheel. We are obviously in total lockdown here so had to make a puller tool (not strong enough) and a second puller tool (just strong enough and no more) and it finally came with an almighty bang.
I can't get the self cancelling indicators to work though. The ring with the hole in it just spins and only very occasionally catches so I'm assuming some sort of adjustment is required.
New 128SL wheel fitted and, if we ever get out of lockdown, I reckon it'll be nicer to use.

Also my mechanic fitted a water temp gauge and my brother in-law and I made a new dash panel as the original one had been cut to fit a tiny speaker and looked awful. You may notice the high temp reading which is not right. So we have a new Celsius gauge on order.

Fayray said:

Well, finally, after a ridiculous amount of effort, I removed the old, broken steering wheel. We are obviously in total lockdown here so had to make a puller tool (not strong enough) and a second puller tool (just strong enough and no more) and it finally came with an almighty bang.
I can't get the self cancelling indicators to work though. The ring with the hole in it just spins and only very occasionally catches so I'm assuming some sort of adjustment is required.
New 128SL wheel fitted and, if we ever get out of lockdown, I reckon it'll be nicer to use.

Also my mechanic fitted a water temp gauge and my brother in-law and I made a new dash panel as the original one had been cut to fit a tiny speaker and looked awful. You may notice the high temp reading which is not right. So we have a new Celsius gauge on order.

Click to expand...

Hi Andrew,

Thanks for the pics, the 'new' steering wheel looks great.

Yeah, those st. wheels can be difficult to remove, sometimes :bang:

There are proper st. wheel removal tools but I never had one - if my trick of manually rocking the wheel failed, I loosened the centre nut a few turns, placed a length of 10mm flat bar across the wheel spokes with a socket as a spacer underneath bearing on the nut, then squeezed the bar towards the wheel using 2 large G clamps, (the reason for not removing the nut is to prevent the wheel hitting you in the face if it was on very tight).

The ring just spins freely unless you move the indicator stalk to the left or right, underneath are 2 little plastic catches (one for left turn, one for right turn) that pop up and iirc get caught by the ring when it is turned by the steering wheel. I'm sure you'll figure out how it works by having a good look at the indicator switch/stalk unit. Sometimes the little plastic catches get broken, there's also little springs on each that allow the plastic catch to move down out of the way if e.g. you steer right with the indicator stalk set to indicate right and vice-versa. The only adjustment is the gap between the rear of the st. wheel and the ring you mentioned, this is adjusted by loosening the clamp at the bottom of the column switch assembly (I mentioned this in an earlier post). The column switch assembly needs to be adjusted so that the little pin on the rear of the st. wheel engages with the hole in the ring - so that the ring moves in unison with the st. wheel. I can't remember with certainty, but it might be this st. wheel pin that actually cancels the indicators?

Nice job on the dash panel It's probably a very good idea to have a water temperature gauge on a 128. If I might make a suggestion - whenever I've fitted accessory gauges, I try to angle them towards the driver if possible. You might be able to cut a short length of black pvc? plumbing pipe at an angle to fit between the gauge and the dash panel i.e. straight cut end fits against the gauge, angled cut against the dash panel, might have to slightly 'ovalise' the dash panel hole to suit.

Great to see you're making progress. Over here (Ireland) we're in lockdown also, everything (car parts wise) is shut - fortunately, I'm a bit of a hoarder or there'd be no work being done.

Al.

good idea about angling the gauge toward the driver. I will do that.

With the wheel off and spinning the indicator cancelling wheel manually I was able to get it to occasionally cancel in one direction only. I'll take another look - I've got time after all.

With the s-wheel removal I think it had been over-torqued and there was some surface rust on the spline. The amount of pressure we had to exert was pretty amazing. The damage done previously to the s-wheel probably happened when someone tried to remove it. We had to drill a hole each side of the centre to create a pull. If we'd had a couple of large U bolts I reckon we could've done it without drilling. But as the S-wheel was already badly cracked we sacrificed it. All the large bolts and steel bar used in our puller tool got bent up. Quite amazing really

Well I pulled the wheel off again and discovered one part of the mechanism that appears to be missing a spring or the spring is broken. I pulled the whole unit off the column but couldn't immediately see a way of dismantling the unit. Is it possible to dismantle it?

Hi Andrew,

I dug out an old column switch which I think is from the last of the 128's (it has coloured tips on the ends of each stalk - yellow for wipers, blue for headlights, green for indicators) to refresh my memory of this type of column switch unit.

Looking at the parts circled in your pic. above, I'm sorry to have to tell you that the white part of the self-cancelling mechanism appears to be broken - it should look the same as the black part just above it.

I've had a look at my column switch unit and the little spring (there's only one) fits between those 2 parts (the white and the black part above) and holds them apart. When you select left indicator, the white part should move up towards the plastic ring (the one that the pin on the steering wheel engages with), the steering wheel can be turned to the left but if you turn it to the right or back off the amount of steering lock, one of 2 'V' shaped bumps on the underside of the plastic ring will catch on the white part and cancel the indicator. I'm guessing that it's your left indicator isn't cancelling - because the white part is raised when left indicator is selected and the black part is raised when right indicator is selected.

These column switches can be dismantled. If you look at the back/bottom of the switch assembly where the wires enter, you'll see 2 brass? rivets. Drill these out and you can separate the different sections of the assembly. I repaired a few of these column switches 'back in the day' (apprentice mechanic - so wasn't earning much money). If you can get another column switch of the same type, you might be able to swap over the part/s you need. Assembling the column switch is simply a reversal of the steps taken to dismantle it (as all good workshop manuals are fond of saying ). To hold it together, I was unable to find any short enough pop rivets so I shortened a couple of pop-rivets so that when fitted they didn't protrude to far into the centre hole. To shorten a pop rivet, knock out the pin (mandrel), cut rivet with a junior hacksaw then re-insert pin and install as normal - you might get lucky and find pop rivets short enough to do the job.

Hth,

Al.

thanks Al, it's as I suspected. You are right about the left indicator not cancelling but the right one only does occasionally if the black part falls into place (rarely).
I have already put in a request to the parts supplier who sold me the s-wheel and I'm fairly confident he'll have what i need. In the meantime I can't drive it anyway but when I was the lack of self cancelling wasn't a big issue as the indicators make a nice audible click sound in the cabin. Would be nice to fix it though

Well my local supplier not only supplied a complete column switch assembly but it's Nos, still in the (very old) box and only $100 (50 quid) delivered. Switching out was easy but the original one did have an extra solo green wire that plugged into a connector. I don't know what it did but everything seems to work, including the elusive self cancelling indicators.

And some photos showing the extra green wire on the old unit

Fayray said:

And some photos showing the extra green wire on the old unit

Click to expand...

Hi Andrew,

Well done on finding a nos column switch unit!

I don't have a workshop manual or wiring diagram for the 128 but on other Fiats of that era, green is the main (high) beam circuit. Are you sure the wire isn't green with a black tracer? Green with a black tracer is for the main/high beam warning light circuit. Is your main beam warning (i.e. blue) light in the speedo working?

Also, is this extra green? wire live with the ignition on? or with headlights on? or when you pull the stalk towards you to flash the high beams? Where does this extra wire connect to on the column switch? E.g. is it connected to the same contact as another wire?

Do you happen to know if the nos column switch unit you obtained is for your exact model and year?

Regards,

Al.

sorry Al, my mistake. It's the green and black wire in the photos that has the separate connector block attached. You can also see it going into the column switch. The photos are of the one that came out of the car. So the corresponding green and black wire with connector from the loom is floating loose now.
Everything works including the high beam warning light, high beam flash and everything else as far as i can tell.
I had a sift through the Haynes manual and discovered a green and black wire that runs an electric washer motor on the UK only 128 Comfort. My car is fitted with the factory vacuum washer but I wonder whether this is what the wire was for but never used? No 128s were fitted with electric washers here.

But as everything is working I'll not worry about it.

Hi Andrew,

I've just come across this aftermarket column switch unit, it's amazingly similar to the old Fiat one:- www.carbuilder.com/uk/multi-stalk-assembly
and costs only £26.40! ref. #INDSW10 Multi-stalk Indicators, Lights, Wiper Assembly

This one has 2 block connectors, one is 6 pin, other is 8 pin, there's also a separate wire (yellow in this case) which goes to the screenwasher. Maybe this is where the extra 'green' wire on your switch should connect to? If you click along the available images, you'll find they include wiring diagrams for the block connectors.

Hopefully, this info may be of some use to you and other classic car enthusiasts.

Regards,

Al.

Oh wow, that's exactly the same, and cheap. So it does seem the extra wire is for an electric washer.
Here's the Haynes manual description that references a verde/Nero wire on the corresponding diagram.

Hi Andrew,

Sorry I missed your post #30 while I was looking up the column switch on Car Builder Solutions and composing my post #31 . So, the mystery has now been solved. I wouldn't be surprised if you now started thinking about converting your screen-washer to electrically operated, even though you were quite happy with manual operation up to now.

Iirc, that old later type 128 column switch that I mentioned in post #25 was from the later 128 Comfort model. These were the last of the 128's (before the introduction of the replacement Ritmo/Strada model) and had plastic/resin bumpers etc., no nice chrome bumpers or hubcaps anymore.

That Car Builder Solutions is well worth adding to your favourites list, it's amazing just how much they stock and at very good prices. I found e.g. oil pressure switches and radiator fan switches that look like they'd fit some Fiats if the genuine parts couldn't be found. Just be fore-warned that if you're like me, you'll loose several hours searching through their catalogue pages!!!

Regards,

Al.

Well now I don't have a washer wire on my new column assembly I'll be less tempted to go "modern". That said, I quite like the vacuum system - it works (now I have cleaned out the gummed up jets) and has a certain charm. And it does seem to be a fairly simple, robust system. The one on my beat up 500 still works as good as the day it left the factory.

And yes, despite my car being built in Nov 78 (NZ assembled) they were thankfully still using chrome bumpers etc. I don't think I would've bought it had it been the facelift model (that was never sold here as far as I know)

Thanks again for all your help Al.

PS: a local chap I met at a car show has found me a NOS owners handbook among his stash of Fiat stuff. He also has a collection of incredibly low mileage original Fiats stored away (125s 124 coupes and 850 coupes) that he's offered to give me a tour of when we get out of this lockdown. Something to look forward to

get some Cinturato on it

https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/classic-car-tyres/fiat/128.html

Hello Andrew, just came across your posts. Did you ever end up replacing the rims or just the tires? Are you based in Auckland? If so, could you please share Tony’s details? I recently acquired a 1978 128, not as tidy as yours and needs quite a bit of work. Cheers, Amar

Hello - Here’s a pic of my ‘Bello’, which will no doubt remind you of your mum’s one! Cheers

ha ha yes, identical to Mum's car that I learnt to drive it. I was actually out in my car today. First time is a couple of months.
I retained the original rims and fitted new tyres. I reckon a slightly wider rim would improve drivability when pushing it.
I'm in Napier, as is Tony, but I'm sure there will be someone up your way that can work magic with a 128. How's the rust?
The Fiat Alfa Centre in Cambridge still carry many parts.
Good luck with it. They are a great little car

Hello Andrew

I grew up in the Bay, hoping that my 128 is able to make it over there some day soon. Quite a bit of rust, I've been able to source a few replacement parts and work will commence once restrictions are lifted. Do you know the standard rim size? I'm wondering if 5.5 x 13" would fit?

Cheers,
Amar

kovic said:

Hello Andrew

I grew up in the Bay, hoping that my 128 is able to make it over there some day soon. Quite a bit of rust, I've been able to source a few replacement parts and work will commence once restrictions are lifted. Do you know the standard rim size? I'm wondering if 5.5 x 13" would fit?

Cheers,
Amar

Click to expand...

the standard rims are 13x4.5. I've not tried but I think 13x5.5 would fit and there are a few Cromodora rims that are 13x5, that was what I was considering at some point