Hello
I'm Nigel (Xircom) I used to have a Fiat Coup 16v back in 1995 British racing green, loved the car. So I have the change of buying this one

Search Ebay for item 113896716056 it also on Autotrader

I spoken to the garage and have come with a deal dropped to £3200 and says they have all the paperwork from day it was sold right up to date. I asked about the Cam Belt (they have nothing) no paperwork to confirm it been done or not, I suspect it has given how well it been maintained, the seller dropped the price down to £2800 if I get the Belt done which is a good price but I cannot find anyone who willing to do the Job (I'm up north "Lancashire") The seller will Fully Service and put 12 Month MOT and 3 month warranty in the price.

should I walk away or jump and take a punt?
is the 20v better than 20v Turbo?
Has anyone got a telephone or an address for a Fiat Specialist in Lancashire

well thanks guy no one reply
so I purchased the car
pickup saturday.

Hi Nigel. Sorry no-one replied to you but maybe just no-one with knowledge of this model was looking in the Newbie section? Anyway may I be allowed to welcome you?

I'm very much a Panda/Punto man although many years ago I was involved with a 131 Mirefiore and did a few jobs on 128's. Is the 20 valve the engine which has to come out of the car to get access to the belt? - seem to remember somewhere reading about this - if so, the cost involved, and complexity of the job could explain why it may not have been done and why you are finding it difficult to find anyone to take it on?

Otherwise, from what you are saying, the car sounds a good bet. Hope you enjoy owning it.

Kind regards
Jock

thanks for up
I had a quote of £768.00 inc vat
so shopping around
I suspect it has been done as they have all the paperwork from when it was sold, every mot, every service document and it AA+ condition so I think if you going to keep all that info for 21 years then why would you miss the most import bit, but you never know.

Hi .
Congrats on the purchase.

The garages section should give locations in Cheshire.. maybe Lancs too

The specialists down here are MUCH cheaper

I had mareas.. the belts were £700 back in the day.. price dropped to £400 last I heard

SoloItalia Witney. Oxford

RobertsAerospace are also worth checking out.. but can be busy

Charlie

Xircom said:

thanks for up
I had a quote of £768.00 inc vat
so shopping around
I suspect it has been done as they have all the paperwork from when it was sold, every mot, every service document and it AA+ condition so I think if you going to keep all that info for 21 years then why would you miss the most import bit, but you never know.

Click to expand...

No way £760.

You said a 16V Coupe - Yes?

This is basically the same engine as in the 16V Barchetta/Bravo/Brava cars.

Unlike the 20V Coupes cam belt access is good, does not require the engine to be removed. Remval is the official Fiat method. Experienced 20V Coupe garages just remove the battery, battery box, some other stuff, release the front struts and then just support and move the engine and gearbox complete with drive shafts over to the side to get the clearance required.

16V engines DO NOT require any of this work and one is looking more along the lines of £300 for belt, tensioner, stretcher pulley AND water pump change.

Pugglt Auld Jock said:

Hi Nigel. Sorry no-one replied to you

Is the 20 valve the engine which has to come out of the car to get access to the belt? - seem to remember somewhere reading about this - if so, the cost involved, and complexity of the job could explain why it may not have been done and why you are finding it difficult to find anyone to take it on?

Otherwise, from what you are saying, the car sounds a good bet. Hope you enjoy owning it.

Kind regards
Jock

Click to expand...

The specialists found a way of swinging motor on mounts to do it in situ.

I recall it was 12 hours labour 'by the book'.. I asked a used car salesman if a belt change could be included in sale.. he wouldnt sign for that..

Charlie

S130 may be mistaken - the UK 16v 2.0 coupe (1994/5) is not the same as the later Euro 16v 1.8 - and if the belt is not changed on time you can be in for a world of hurts (ask me how I know ) The engine is the last development of the classic Lampredi twin-cam engine.


As far as I know there is only one 1.8 16v coupe in the country.


We recommend that the belt is changed at 24k is you can afford it and 36k whether you can afford it or not. That would have been two or three years back in the day, but now 16s (like mine) tend to be garage queens I'd stretch that to four-six years, provided the car is driven regularly... but don't exceed the mileage.

You might consider a call to Joe Knight at Fiat Coupe Specialist Spares (I'm biased; he and I wrote the manual on the Coupe).

Neil

barnacle said:

S130 may be mistaken - the UK 16v 2.0 coupe (1994/5) is not the same as the later Euro 16v 1.8 - and if the belt is not changed on time you can be in for a world of hurts (ask me how I know ) The engine is the last development of the classic Lampredi twin-cam engine.
Neil

Click to expand...

Don't think I'm that wrong as I have the full set of Coupe Worshop Manuals and Technical Data and the Coupe 16V engine actually came in two variants.

1996 Models : 1995cc 16V Normally aspirated AND turbo - Marelli-Weber IAW ECU

1998 Models : 1747cc 16V normally aspirated only - Hitachi ECU (Barchetta engine)

The 1995cc engine is as you say is the basic Lampredi TC engine.
The 1747cc engine is the later Fiat TC evolution engine fitted to other later period models

EITHER WAY both engines do not require removal or shifting to do a cam belt and water pump change.

A VIN number from the OP will tell us exactly what engine is fitted to the car.

Possibilities Are:

PC COUPE' (1994-1996)
175.020.0.0 2000 16V ASPIR.BASE
175.030.0.0 1750 16V ASP.CEE F2
175.320.0.0 2000 16V ASPIR.BASE CONDIZ. - BRASILE
175.420.0.0 2000 16V ASPIR.PLUS CONDIZ. - BRASILE
175.421.0.0 2000 16V TURBO BASE
175.520.0.0 2000 16V ASPIR.PLUS CONDIZ.

COUPE' GAMMA'96 (1996-2000)
175.010.1.0 1750 16V MY.99
175.040.0.0 1750 16V CEE F2 GAMMA'96
175.910.1.0 1750 16V MY.99 "SERIE SPECIALE PLUS"

s130 said:

Don't think I'm that wrong as I have the full set of Coupe Worshop Manuals and Technical Data and the Coupe 16V engine actually came in two variants.

1996 Models : 1995cc 16V Normally aspirated AND turbo - Marelli-Weber IAW ECU

1998 Models : 1747cc 16V normally aspirated only - Hitachi ECU (Barchetta engine)

The 1995cc engine is as you say is the basic Lampredi TC engine.
The 1747cc engine is the later Fiat TC evolution engine fitted to other later period models

EITHER WAY both engines do not require removal or shifting to do a cam belt and water pump change.

A VIN number from the OP will tell us exactly what engine is fitted to the car.

Possibilities Are:

PC COUPE' (1994-1996)
175.020.0.0 2000 16V ASPIR.BASE
175.030.0.0 1750 16V ASP.CEE F2
175.320.0.0 2000 16V ASPIR.BASE CONDIZ. - BRASILE
175.420.0.0 2000 16V ASPIR.PLUS CONDIZ. - BRASILE
175.421.0.0 2000 16V TURBO BASE
175.520.0.0 2000 16V ASPIR.PLUS CONDIZ.

COUPE' GAMMA'96 (1996-2000)
175.010.1.0 1750 16V MY.99
175.040.0.0 1750 16V CEE F2 GAMMA'96
175.910.1.0 1750 16V MY.99 "SERIE SPECIALE PLUS"

Click to expand...

Erm, I would listen to Barnacle, he's a well known expert in such matters on the Coupe forum.

Well yes Barnacle can respond and I always welcome and ENGAGE.

I've posted the official Fiat technical 16V non turbo data. This is clearly a selection of possibilities. Yes the Brazil versions are possibly not relevant but until a full VIN is provided, or year/registration then the book is open.

And I would add that I know what I know and have what I have because I owned a Coupe 20V non Turbo for many years. Also have the full workshop manuals. I've also in the past past (including Coupe) been a model technical access/model feedback to FIAT UK.

I'm just trying to help provide info. etc.

s130 said:

Well yes Barnacle can respond and I always welcome and ENGAGE.

I've posted the official Fiat technical 16V non turbo data. This is clearly a selection of possibilities. Yes the Brazil versions are possibly not relevant but until a full VIN is provided, or year/registration then the book is open.

And I would add that I know what I know and have what I have because I owned a Coupe 20V non Turbo for many years. Also have the full workshop manuals. I've also in the past past (including Coupe) been a model technical access/model feedback to FIAT UK.

I'm just trying to help provide info. etc.

Click to expand...

Aye 130 try not to take things too seriously We ALL are trying to help Lots of us on the Coupe forum have owned our Coops for a few years, I've had mine for about 13 years & Barnacle has owned his from new, he & a Coupe mechanic on the forum know their stuff that's all I'm saying, nothing really aimed at yourself.

Back to the original question about who will do a cambelt change at reasonable cost, I would recommend Allitalia near Wrexham. Not too far from North West England and certainly likely to be far less than the price you've been quoted.

jimboy said:

Aye 130 try not to take things too seriously We ALL are trying to help Lots of us on the Coupe forum have owned our Coops for a few years, I've had mine for about 13 years & Barnacle has owned his from new, he & a Coupe mechanic on the forum know their stuff that's all I'm saying, nothing really aimed at yourself.

Click to expand...

Fair enough

And I've reviewed the OP eBay ref and it is a 20V Turbo not a 16V which COMPLETELY changes the game.

The 20V is an engine out or engine shift to one side and so £500+ is on the cards.

Which ever garage is finally chosen to do the cam belt change I strongly recommend that Xircom/OP ask the garage to cut a couple of largish circular holes in the cam belt cover so the cam belt can be easily inspected. I had my garage do this when I was forced to have a premature belt change due to a failed auxiliary drive belt.

At least one hole should be cut on the down leg run from exhaust cam to crank pulley. This should be located over the centre of the belt so that both sides can be inspected and two fingers are able to grab the belt to check tension.

A second one can be made so that the tensioner can be seen. Not essential but a good idea.

These have to be cut with the cam belt cover off and will take no more than 10 mins assuming the technician has to inspect and then get his hole cutter out.

Hi S130 - no insult/offence intended and I'm aware that I'm a very rare poster here and so my posts may not be read in quite the same way as they are on fiatcoupe.org

But I think we've both fallen into the same trap - when I get round to looking at the actual ebay advert it's clear that the OP is referring to a 20v NA, and not the 16v we've discussed.

In which case, about four hundred quid to do a belt change from one of the specialists, from memory (it's a while since I've had a 20vt).

Neil

p.s. Hi Jim!

Hello everyone

well I collected the car on Monday after waiting around all day due to a bad communications between me and the seller, it failed the MOT so they put all the jobs right. Passed new MOT on Monday at 4pm, did not have much time to view the car, it looked all good outside and inside, all lights worked, all electrical functioned as they should (weather was chucking down) so I paid £2800 + TAX and Insured the car. I drover it home at 65 mph all the way from Lincoln to Burnley. The Stereo was crap, badly tuned the sound from the engine was nice, it picked it feet up when it need to.

When I got home I checked all the paperwork and every receipt, MOT and Service stamp was their, even found some personal stuff from USA to Owner, all the keys were there long with the key-case and orange plastic code card attached to the red key, user manual, radio user guide plus all the AUX cables and fixing screws the small Nokamichi remote control and radio face case for when you remove the stereo face. It all looks perfect So why do I still feel anxious? I seem to have this feeling that I've made a mistake, oh love the car and I know it need the belts doing and I had an email form John Cartlidge who seem ready to help and I'll arrange to get down with the car and have these done along with some other small jobs, but the dread I have is when in the dry light of day I looked in the engine and saw the rust on the radiator and the fixing brackets below (not sure what they called) but they were lose and not attached to the body, nothing moves all is solid, all the pipes are good no corrosion and no knocking or clunks, the steering seem fine and make no knocking and works fine, I can turn the steering wheel with one finger and do a full circle and then let go and it straightens-up perfect, I can drive down the road at 30 or 40 and let go the steering wheel and the car drives in perfect straight line, the suspension feels Ok, well like a 22 year old car would feel it creaks a little over speed bumps but so do most modern cars.

To close I think it best to let John Cartlidge or another expert give the car the once over, I love cars and have always loved this model but I'm no expert and don't have the mechanical knowledge to know if what I see is bad or just a simple fix. Drove the Car (Called it No.7, we have 6 grandchildren and this I think will be my seventh) and she sound good in the village and turns head, plus my lass like her so that a good start. Thanks everyone.

F

Fair enough

And I've reviewed the OP eBay ref and it is a 20V Turbo not a 16V which COMPLETELY changes the game.

The 20V is an engine out or engine shift to one side and so £500+ is on the cards.

Which ever garage is finally chosen to do the cam belt change I strongly recommend that Xircom/OP ask the garage to cut a couple of largish circular holes in the cam belt cover so the cam belt can be easily inspected. I had my garage do this when I was forced to have a premature belt change due to a failed auxiliary drive belt.

At least one hole should be cut on the down leg run from exhaust cam to crank pulley. This should be located over the centre of the belt so that both sides can be inspected and two fingers are able to grab the belt to check tension.

A second one can be made so that the tensioner can be seen. Not essential but a good idea.

These have to be cut with the cam belt cover off and will take no more than 10 mins assuming the technician has to inspect and then get his hole cutter out

Click to expand...

S130 - I like that advise, I've pulled it and printed that for when I go to get this job done. Thanks

Hello again
one more bit of advise please. I was just checking the lights, hazards, beam, full beam etc.. all worked so I turned off and then went to turn back on and nothing dead, no lights no internal lights the key will not turn the engine over, seem to be the immobiliser has kicked in. How do I reset? tried the red key, blue key nothing seems to work.
Thanks

just sat here thinking, it could be a fuse gone or the battery, when I tune the key nothing no click, no engine turn over or spark, clock stopped, no internal lights any comments welcome. thanks

Sounds like battery power is lost.

AFAIK.. the immob doesnt stop cranking.. you have a blackout.. check battery connections.. engine bay earths.

Good luck

Charlie

will do thanks