punto03.jpg

Punto (Mk2/2b) A pretty worn year 2000 mk2 5-door Punto

Introduction

Well, there is a story to everything...

For many years I've been driving Alfa's and Citroën (the real ones with hydaulics, not the new caffelatte-designed Peugeot-Citroëns)
Having an Alfa 156 2.5 V6 and a Citroën Xantia 2.0, I was like paying a lot of money to the oil-companies and an awfull lot of money to the Danish Govenment in penalty-tax'es.
The Busso V6 is slightly broken (exploding waterpump) and I'm using that to take the engine apart and doing a lot of nice things to it.
Engine, cabin and more.
But thats expensive and takes a lot of time (a looooot of time...).
I'm really happy with the Xantia as a practical donkey and it's extremely comfortable.
But as an everyday car, commuting to- and from work, it was bloody expensive, drinking petrol and oil.

So I more or less swapped it for the mentioned Punto.
The Xantia was absolutely rust free !
The Punto is not rust free..., as it turned out :eek:
Most things seemed to work on the Punto.
On the Xantia I broke the internals of the drivers door, so it couldnt open the window and I had to use a separate key for locking/unlocking.
A couple of months ago, the ABS on the right front broke.

That did it !

Wanting to save a lot of money also, I startet out looking at Cinquecento's.
I really like the square look they have :)
Having tried some, I found out, I would only go for a Sporting.
The 0.9 was terribly, terribly slow, but the Sporting was ok-go-cart-like.
Thinking it over for a couple of week, I desided it was gonna be to small and my feet are simply just to fat :p

And I must admit to being a 4-door man :)

So looking for economy, 4-doors, amble cabinespace and bootspace, the Punto came in to play.

It was'nt a first contester.
I absolutely hate the rearend design on the Mk1's and I hate the headlight design on the new Punto's.
But the Mk2 Punto's are somewhere in between...
Not perfect, but almost somewhat ok...

punto03.jpg

Looked around for a while, but not that many for sale.
Found two ones.
One metallic blue and a bit to expensive.
One metallic red and very cheap...

Both of them placed many hundreds of kilometers away, so going to look at them and try them would take almost a complete weekend and a lot of money.
Writing to and from the dealers for several days.

Finally setling for the metallic red.
The color does a good job in hiding/integrating the hideous rearlights, but also makes the car look a little "old man driving".

Well I'm not that young any more :-D
And swapping the Xantia in, it was gonna be very cheap :)

So the other weekend, my son and I took off in the Citroën and drove west for many hours...
Arrived at the Punto and found it to look more tired than on the pictures, more dented here and there and a tired paint in general.
Given it is 6 (!) years younger than the Xantia, it looked actually older :(
But mechanically it looked pretty much ok anyway, and sounded ok to.
And everything electrical worked !
So finally swapping the cars and we drove of in the Punto !!!

20150905_121408.jpg

Thats how the Rosso Scilla became the new member of the familly.

But problems would arise in the future ! :cry:
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Good story and good choice , I too have had alfas and a Citroen xm , and more but the simplicity of the mk2 8v punto suits me for now , cheap as chips but also not bad to live with
 
Funny, I've had 3 fiats and a Citroen before; Saxo; didn't last long. A drystone wall jumped in front of me when I was going 75mph and the front end was dented to say the least.


Blower of many head gaskets
 
I had a BX17TZD which apart from liking to dump oil from the steering rack seals was one of the best cars I ever had. If I found a good one I would get it.
 
for real?
Back then c 1990 Citroen still had a reputation as a builder where the engineers ran the show. The hydro suspension was a dream. Braking hard the car sat down like a cat on the road and it had no right to be as smooth as it was for something so light - plastic bonnets and tailgates. The ability to lower or raise suspension heights at will is something you have to experience to see how sensible it is.
 
Hi KaiserPingo, and welcome to FF,:)

I've not much faith in French things,
but as you said - OLDER Citroens were better, ;)
I swapped a 200K kms Pug 307 HDi for a 400K kms 1.7 diesel estate - nonturbo.!!:shakehead:

it was the EARLY - Xsara body / 1997 - actually a quite decent car - thankfully had BOSCH equipment:worship:

the Mk2 punto is a reasonably tough car,
rusty floorpans and compromised cooling = head gasket failure, are the biggest issues

certainly good for Fuel economy + low TAX driving, (y)

P.S. nice mk1 = https://www.fiatforum.com/gallery/data/500/medium/DSCF1288fpp.jpg

Charlie
 
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Back then c 1990 Citroen still had a reputation as a builder where the engineers ran the show. The hydro suspension was a dream. Braking hard the car sat down like a cat on the road and it had no right to be as smooth as it was for something so light - plastic bonnets and tailgates. The ability to lower or raise suspension heights at will is something you have to experience to see how sensible it is.

odd coincidence, i just changed rear suspension on 1993 citroen ax but its still stiff, probably bad arm bearing or something
 
Ading another little chapter.

My son and I said farewells to the old and pretty trusty Xantia, and toke off to drive home in the Punto.
It was raining like mad !!!
In the first roundabout, when I wanted to turn, the car just drove straight ahead.
Heartrate on MAX. !
I had noticed the tires were not perfect, but they turned out to be outright dangerous (n)

Slowly we continued.
I listened to the car to get to know it better, and tried to get a feeling for everything.
Smokers car, so slightly sticky everywhere.
Like most cars that have been standing for a while, it felt a little damp, and a little stiff.
Suspension far from Citroën quality, but the tires made it worse.

After 3+ hours, we arrived at home.

Next day, new tyres was fitted to the car.
In the proces, I found that the little rubberfitting on the front stabilizer ends was extremely worn, the brakepads very thin and the brakedisks to :eek:
It's gonna get fixed next weekend :)
And there was a 1cm X 2cm little hole in the top of the right rear wheelarch :(
I found that out on the 3'rd morning, when blinking right and breaking produced bulberror and double blinkspeed.
When I was taking the kid to school...
So I took the right rear light out and in that proces found my self looking at the asfalt..., from inside the car...
It has been fixed !
Oh and the blinking rear light, obviously a grounding error, was fixed by cleaning the connector.

There was a little dampnes in the right headlamp to start with, but that is now gone.
Im gonna change to headlamps with foglights (I actually have the dash-piece with the front foglight switch, laying around...), if I can find out about the wiring ???
And the sprinklerbottle cap is missing.
WHY can't FIAT/Alfa make a sprinklerbottleopening of a proper size ?
In my 146 it was a pain, in my 156 it IS a pain and on the Punto it's the same ****, with a tiny, tiny opening.
****ing drunk Italians :bang:

The driverseat is worn (and dirty :yuck:) and flat !
Wondering if steaming it could help cleaning the fabric and boosting the foam ?
After that I'm gonna give all seats some tailored seatcovers.
But I kinda like the blue fabric, and it's not that bad on the doors.
Most likely setteling for some black with gray seatcovers, as the blue color on the doorpanels is hard to match, and there are already several gray colors on the dash, and some black.
Hopefully it makes the drivers-seat more soft and supportive.

Oh and I'm disapointed !!!
I beleived it to be a 80HP model.
Ok, I was wondering if 40 of them had escaped back to Italy or something, because it was not really that quick and speedy.
Turns out it's a lazy 60HP model :cry:
Economy it is then :rolleyes:

But really happy I have my V6 Alfa :slayer:

The story will continue.
 
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Believed I could edit in the reply's, because I wanted to ad some pictures later on... :mad:

Well, here is a picture of the colorcoding.

farvekode.jpg

Thats why she's called Miss Scilla :)

(Sounds better than : Old Bloody Bucket :D )

Does anyone know, if there is some chip-upgrading posibility, that I can get more than just those slow 60HP from the engine ?
 
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Timing belt might be worth a check. They are put on a tooth out sometimes. The car will start and run ok but lacking a bit of oomph.
Valves might be be tight ? Mine have never been touched and are still Ok.
 
Yes, the belt and valves might be worth a check.
But anyway, 60HP is a laugh no matter what.
Can't remember when was the last time I had a car with less that 130... :)
So even though it's a lame 8-valve SOHC engine, I'm gonna look for some way to give it more power.
Going uphill with 150kg in the Punto, it struggles to keep (can't keep) 130km/h, where the Xantia would gladly go 170+, and the Alfa doesn't even recognice the uphill part :-D

In 1½-week, I'm gonna do the frontbrakes, oil- and filterchange, and have a look at timingbelt and valves, and the exhaust.
A partially clogged exhaust could also be a problem here.

After that, I'm gonna look for somekind of "wonderchip" !
 
Yes, the belt and valves might be worth a check.
But anyway, 60HP is a laugh no matter what.
Can't remember when was the last time I had a car with less that 130... :)
So even though it's a lame 8-valve SOHC engine, I'm gonna look for some way to give it more power.
Going uphill with 150kg in the Punto, it struggles to keep (can't keep) 130km/h, where the Xantia would gladly go 170+, and the Alfa doesn't even recognice the uphill part :-D

In 1½-week, I'm gonna do the frontbrakes, oil- and filterchange, and have a look at timingbelt and valves, and the exhaust.
A partially clogged exhaust could also be a problem here.

After that, I'm gonna look for somekind of "wonderchip" !

Mine is equally slow. It's just how it is with this car.

There is no wonderchip, but if you're willing to spend some money, the engine is good for up to 100bhp, relatively easy. Going down the "eco" route of tuning, you'll be looking to buy a GSR induction kit and either an 866 cam (from the Punto mk1 75) or a CB cam. These two things together should land you at least 75bhp for somewhere around 2-3500 DKK (depending on the cam you choose). If you want to go the extra mile, which is hardly feasible, you'll get a 4-2-1 manifold, skip the cat, polish the head, port match the intake manifold and polish the throttle body - lastly get it retuned on a dyno. Don't bother with the 40mm bore of the throttle body, it makes no sense - you can pull 300bhp through the 32mm bore on a turbo engine, so the 1242 will be getting plenty of air.
 
Mine is equally slow. It's just how it is with this car.

There is no wonderchip, but if you're willing to spend some money, the engine is good for up to 100bhp, relatively easy. Going down the "eco" route of tuning, you'll be looking to buy a GSR induction kit and either an 866 cam (from the Punto mk1 75) or a CB cam. These two things together should land you at least 75bhp for somewhere around 2-3500 DKK (depending on the cam you choose). If you want to go the extra mile, which is hardly feasible, you'll get a 4-2-1 manifold, skip the cat, polish the head, port match the intake manifold and polish the throttle body - lastly get it retuned on a dyno. Don't bother with the 40mm bore of the throttle body, it makes no sense - you can pull 300bhp through the 32mm bore on a turbo engine, so the 1242 will be getting plenty of air.

Hi' Brinker and thanks for the advices.
Wrote a reply yesterday, but apparently forgot to press "Submit Reply" :D

Well, it's an economy-car, so posting XXX Kr. in it is daft :p
It's never gonna be a racecar and it's not supposed to.
Think I'll wait with the umph-upgrade's until after winter.
-
On that subject, my experience is, that most kit's like the GSR, gives very little and have a tendency to suck hot air after a while, and thereby actually degrading performance...
But the plastictube, running from close to the right frontwing, looks narrow, and should be closer to the opening in the wing..., so maybe a tubing with larger diameter, instead... (thinking.., spring-project :) ).
The cat's been on the car for 15 years, so that and a better overall exhaust could help.

And then look a little at comfort instead. Afterall, I'm sitting in it for more than an hour, every day !
Like the interior seat-/door-colours, it's a beautiful blue..., but it doesn't really match the strangely "three shades of Grey" dashboard :D
Some thin pillow from Jysk, in a matching blue for the drivers seat :D

Making a long list of "What I want done" and then kindda sorting it in order of how mutch it's needed and/or wanted.
I know, that in time, some points on the list, will be removed :)

Brakes are offcourse first priority !
 
Hi' Brinker and thanks for the advices.
Wrote a reply yesterday, but apparently forgot to press "Submit Reply" :D

Well, it's an economy-car, so posting XXX Kr. in it is daft :p
It's never gonna be a racecar and it's not supposed to.
Think I'll wait with the umph-upgrade's until after winter.
-
On that subject, my experience is, that most kit's like the GSR, gives very little and have a tendency to suck hot air after a while, and thereby actually degrading performance...
But the plastictube, running from close to the right frontwing, looks narrow, and should be closer to the opening in the wing..., so maybe a tubing with larger diameter, instead... (thinking.., spring-project :) ).
The cat's been on the car for 15 years, so that and a better overall exhaust could help.

And then look a little at comfort instead. Afterall, I'm sitting in it for more than an hour, every day !
Like the interior seat-/door-colours, it's a beautiful blue..., but it doesn't really match the strangely "three shades of Grey" dashboard :D
Some thin pillow from Jysk, in a matching blue for the drivers seat :D

Making a long list of "What I want done" and then kindda sorting it in order of how mutch it's needed and/or wanted.
I know, that in time, some points on the list, will be removed :)

Brakes are offcourse first priority !

Nothing wrong with the design of the GSR kit really. It makes more sense to have it in the lower corner, as heat rises. The diameter is fine, the filter mount is 75mm, then narrows down and creating a venturi - thus speeding up the air flow.

I suggest you purchase the brakes through fiat-sportiva.de - you can get decent Brembo discs and EBC pads for less than the price of OE parts at refako.

Where in Denmark are you located?
 
Money is obviously firstly gonna go to the Alfa (it takes a lot. It's more or less to Alfa, what Singer Porsche's are to Porsche (in steps...) Except its not racing but oldfascioned GT-Comfort). Thats part of the reason for setling with the puny Punto :)

I live in Birkerød, work is Amager and carworkplaces are Helsingør and Nakskov.
Geograficaly things have a tendency to get spread around :-D
Luckily I dont have stuff on Bornholm og in Jylland anymore :)

Sundays gonna be "breaks day" in Elsinore :)
And cleaning up the interior, somewhat.
 
Oh yes, there is a grounding fault with the rear lights :mad:

For that reason, I disasembled them, cleaned the connectors and changed the bulbs.

(Remind my, that FIAT designers/technicians/engineers should be forced to do a complete change of bulbs on their FIAT cars, while standing wet and freezing in the middle of the night, far away from any light, in a blistering snowstorm.
Idiots as they are !
Oh, and filling up with washer-fluid as well !)

Drove for 30km's after that, and everything was fine.

Until this morning, after a dry night.
Everytime I pressed the brakepedal, a fault apeared, and blinking to the right, made doublespeed blinking.
Peace of **** !
Now it's parked in the sun and I hope for a "miracle"...

If its not a grounding problem in the right rear-light (I can blink to the left without any doublespeedblinking-problems), what then ?
 
Have had a look at it now, late in the afternoon.
Checked all bulb seatings. They looked fine.
The connectorpins on the rear light looked fine as well.
They'd better, since I cleaned them yesterday !!!
But the multiconnector at the end of all the wires, comming from the car, the ground-connector (black wire) looked "older" and more open than the others.
Cleaned it and adjusted it with my tiniest screwdriver.

Now everything is good (y)

Until next time ! :eek:
 
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Well, it's not 100% fine...

Sometimes in the morning, the above fault appears again..., periodicaly...

Think I have to seal the connector.

Why didnt FIAT do that from the beginning ?

So many solutions are not finnished of correctly, and weaknesses from earlyer models are carried on to following models.

It's evident on the Punto, and it's been evident on all my Alfa's.

Floorpans with rustprone ventilationopenings, airfilters with screws, that rust 15 minutes after production and on the V6 a filter system and arrangement, thats impossible to service, not to mention the idiotic placement of the oilfilter, that was a problem for at least 20+ years, and the connectors under the frontseats that always gives away.
Just quick memory, but there is mutch more...

Sloppynes and amateurisme.
 
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