Register Login
endrop - for all your online needs
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 4 Weeks Ago   #1
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 46
Thanks: 0
Trader Rating: 0
United Kingdom 
Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

Hi, so I bought this 2008 Doblo about 3 weeks ago, took it in for a cambelt change as the last one was done in 2012 at 26000 miles. so all done and well but it's come back with a lot of creaking and clanging when manoeuvring around car parks or side streets. it's fine on the open road and suspension is fine no knocks or bangs. I suspect the car was in the air with the wheels handing for awhile and all the bushes have got strained etc I tried spraying a bit of silicone grease on one of the anti-roll bar bushes but that didn't seem to help much. it's been like this for a week now. any suggestions on how to to rectify this apart from changing all the bushes and possibly top strut mounts??
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

jon67 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 4 Weeks Ago   #2
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Near the M4
Posts: 20,140
Thanks: 720
Trader Rating: 0
varesecrazy has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

Hi.

Not the PAS belt..?

as its all been apart
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

varesecrazy is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 4 Weeks Ago   #3
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 46
Thanks: 0
Trader Rating: 0
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

No, you can hear it clanging and creaking at all four corners of the vehicle. One specific point either side at the rear and possibly two separate points at either side at the front
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

jon67 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 4 Weeks Ago   #4
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Near the M4
Posts: 20,140
Thanks: 720
Trader Rating: 0
varesecrazy has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

Seizeing turret bearings.. make the front springs go boing..
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

varesecrazy is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 4 Weeks Ago   #5
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Southampton, Hampshire
Posts: 3,903
Thanks: 283
Trader Rating: 0
s130 has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

I guess your Doblo is a diesel engine?

On Fiat diesel engines the engine mount at the cam belt end of the engine has to be removed to gain access and allow the cam belt to be replaced. Also later model petrol engines have the same design/requirement.

I would just check that the mount has been securely replaced. There will be 5 or six bolts involved. 3 from mount flange to engine block and 2 or three from mount to inner wing.

If the mount is loose then lateral vehicle movement (turning/cornering/etc) will result in the mass of the engine and gearbox moving laterally and this will then also pull on the struts, track control arms and anti-roll bar components.

Forward / backward driving in a straight line only introduces engine forward/backward rotation which is limited mass movement and less influential on the rest of the from suspension components.
Likes varesecrazy liked this post
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides


Last edited by s130; 4 Weeks Ago at 10:31.
s130 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 3 Weeks Ago   #6
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 46
Thanks: 0
Trader Rating: 0
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

I'll get at the engine mount with a socket to see if anything is loose although I did give the engine a shake to check that last week but that's probably not enough. It does sound like it could be that but creaking from other areas too.
Yes 1.9 multijet
Likes varesecrazy liked this post
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

jon67 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 3 Weeks Ago   #7
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 46
Thanks: 0
Trader Rating: 0
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

All tight on the mount.
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

jon67 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 3 Weeks Ago   #8
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Southampton, Hampshire
Posts: 3,903
Thanks: 283
Trader Rating: 0
s130 has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

Quote Originally Posted by jon67 View Post
All tight on the mount.
The plot thickens then.

You could try forcing/pushing the engine from side to eliminate a failed mount.

Next I would be jacking up each corner and then using a garden spade between the ground and lifted tyre to modulate each corner. On the front this would be done in left steering lock / dead ahead / right steering lock.

Off course if you paid a garage to do the cam belt change then maybe they should be checking the car out for you free of charge.
Likes varesecrazy liked this post
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

s130 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 3 Weeks Ago   #9
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 46
Thanks: 0
Trader Rating: 0
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

That's a really interesting way to check component creeks I'll do that when the rain stops thanks.
I'm taking the car back to the garage anyway because since the cambelt change it has a problem starting, I've had it back within again this week they say the timing is spot on ,they reckon the crankshaft sprocket is bent??? and needs a new one which they've ordered, also cam sensor. I don't know if they have caused this because it was starting fine before and how much it will cost me...
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

jon67 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 3 Weeks Ago   #10
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Near the M4
Posts: 20,140
Thanks: 720
Trader Rating: 0
varesecrazy has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

To me..

They were both disturbed to change the belt.

There are other factors to effect common rail engines firing..

But presumably they have seen some evidence for the cam sensor...

DO NOT pay if it isnt the issue.


Glowplug light going both ON and OFF correctly? Thats a common one.. and the weather is cooling a bit.

Charlie
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides


Last edited by varesecrazy; 3 Weeks Ago at 10:04.
varesecrazy is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 3 Weeks Ago   #11
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Faringdon, Oxfordshire UK
Posts: 6,165
Thanks: 492
Trader Rating: 1
portland_bill has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

Exactly what engine are we discussing?

On the smaller petrol engines the outer crank pulley is located on a very small dowel pin and secured by three bolts. It is easy to fit the pulley any way, just squeezing the dowel pin. The pulley has bumps around its circumference that the sensor reads to determine engine speed and position, and if out should not start at all. But, if the first fit of the pulley pressed against the dowel pin, that might distort the pulley, then realising a mistake, the mechanic fitted it correctly, but the pulley had distorted.

If they ask you to pay for the pulley, ask to see the old one. Look on the back, where the face meets the crank, and see if there is a witness mark of the dowel being in the wrong place.

Crank sensor faulty prevents starting, a cam sensor faulty should light the engine management warning.
__________________
13 years motor trade, 16 years motor industry. 14 years Driving Instructor & 7 years Fleet Trainer
Panda Alessi
portland_bill is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 3 Weeks Ago   #12
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Faringdon, Oxfordshire UK
Posts: 6,165
Thanks: 492
Trader Rating: 1
portland_bill has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

Have a good look under the car for any evidence of where they supported it on the hoist. If they've chosen a weak spot near the suspension things may get a bit creaky. (Unlikely, but look anyway)
With all wheels hung for a while, it might take a few days to settle properly, and such a situation will highlight any worn bushes or mountings.
Likes varesecrazy liked this post
__________________
13 years motor trade, 16 years motor industry. 14 years Driving Instructor & 7 years Fleet Trainer
Panda Alessi
portland_bill is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 3 Weeks Ago   #13
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 46
Thanks: 0
Trader Rating: 0
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

It's 1.9 multijet. The car was fully serviced before going in for cam belt, all filters, glow plugs, has had new turbo and new starter motor.
The crank shaft pulley fell apart when the garage removed it so that was renewed with the cam belt.
When I took it back for the starting issue to be looked at they told me then that the sprocket was bent so they tried to straighten it out???? And also a plate behind the sprocket was distorted, this could be effecting the starting. They have also ordered the cam sensor but I don't see the point in replacing it if it's not faulty, then again it can only be got at with the cam belt removed.
It's all a bit of a mess, the car was running fine, I took it for the cam belt as it was over due and end up with a creaking car that won't start easily
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

jon67 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 3 Weeks Ago   #14
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 46
Thanks: 0
Trader Rating: 0
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

Glow plug light goes on and off correctly btw
Likes varesecrazy liked this post
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

jon67 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Old 3 Weeks Ago   #15
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Southampton, Hampshire
Posts: 3,903
Thanks: 283
Trader Rating: 0
s130 has donated!
United Kingdom 
Re: Lots of creaking and clanging after Cam belt change

Quote Originally Posted by jon67 View Post
It's 1.9 multijet. The car was fully serviced before going in for cam belt, all filters, glow plugs, has had new turbo and new starter motor.
The crank shaft pulley fell apart when the garage removed it so that was renewed with the cam belt.
When I took it back for the starting issue to be looked at they told me then that the sprocket was bent so they tried to straighten it out???? And also a plate behind the sprocket was distorted, this could be effecting the starting. They have also ordered the cam sensor but I don't see the point in replacing it if it's not faulty, then again it can only be got at with the cam belt removed.
It's all a bit of a mess, the car was running fine, I took it for the cam belt as it was over due and end up with a creaking car that won't start easily
I smell a rat.

On the 1.9 multijet then the proper belt timing kit contains not only a crank locater plate but also a special sprung loaded cam shaft locator pin. On the side of the cam shaft carrier/housing is a removable screw in plug. It is removed and the locator pins screwed in place. When the cam(s) are in the correct position the pin springs into locator holes in the cam shaft.

Now normally if you are lucky then there is no reason to loosen the main cam shaft sprocket wheel as the cam sprocket to crank sprocket will be a bang on snug fit due to modern belt manufacturing to tooth pitch tolerances.

I suspect for one reason or another they decided to loosen the sprocket wheel. To do this one has to be VERY careful and ideally use the pucker Fiat tool which is designed to properly locate into the sprocket wheel and not protrude behind. Using any other type of holding tool can possibly bend the sprocket AND catch / damage the cam shaft phase sensor assembly which is located directly behind and very close to the sprocket.

Hopefully they will get it all sorted and not bill you any further.
Likes portland_bill liked this post
__________________
FIAT Forum Useful Links:
Donate to FF | Buy FF Merchandise | Classifieds | FF Insurance | How-to Guides

s130 is offline Reply With Quote Quote 
Reply
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump
Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
(T) 2004 2.0jtd Died after cam belt change.But belt is ok. wanderer Ducato 15 17-07-2013 21:20
(G) Cam Belt/Timing Belt Change Just to be Safe quaffle Punto (Mk2/2b) 12 31-03-2011 16:51
(G) cam belt change bullmastifyle Marea 20 07-10-2009 22:25
(T) Croma MJet Cam Belt and Aux Belt Change? FiatFleetFamily Croma 3 03-11-2008 17:43
(T) cam belt change savster Coupe 6 25-07-2005 14:10