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Old 07-06-2009   #31
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

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Some are though (I know of many) but I still believe (maintain) that customers get a better description (more honest?) from tech who worked on the car but until the day happens when time restrictions are lifted from the techs this will never really happen which is why you get more friendly response from independent garages.
True. If I can be taken and shown the problem with the car - get under the hoist and have stuff pointed out by the working mechanic - I am really grateful. Show me the problem, communicate properly with me, and you have cracked it. In truth, both my dealer and the place I get my car done now are good at the mechanical involvement, and I appreciate this. I do not want to be kept front of house and away from the oily bits. As for the place I get the car done now, I can actually speak to the mechanics at the counter, and the reception man is a tech too. Pity it's not a Fiat dealer though.
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Old 07-06-2009   #32
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

....but theres health & safety issues (insurance) that goes along with members of the public in the workshop you have to remember.
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Old 07-06-2009   #33
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

Quote Originally Posted by Lloyd71 View Post

It just seems to be the dealers still letting the side down for the survey, they really need to book their ideas up.
yes but in what way? (expected a longer more detailed answer from you Lloyd)
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Old 07-06-2009   #34
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

I know. Health and safety is the bane of life. Not really, actually I agree with most of it, but if they are bending the rules I really appreciate it.
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Old 07-06-2009   #35
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

Having borne the brunt of Fiats dreadful aftersales since 1997, and being promised several times that things are changing... heres my bit.

Ive had 4 brand new Fiats, every one has had dents, scratches, interior damage and some quite major paint issues when delivered to me... WHY CANT THEY SPOT THESE BEFORE DELIVERY?

With just one exeption all of the above cars required extensive phone calls and messing about to put right.

Ive had cars serviced by several dealers and found oil overfilling, parts not replaced, clips or screws missing, wires trapped between plastic covers and being charged for items not actually replaced.

When you want a loan car, you have to pay... Ive never been charged by any other manufacturer.

When you have an issue, no matter how bad it is, they seem to treat you like an idiot and fob you off with reasons why its happened and how its a trait, not a fault!

Lastly, Fiat still insist on putting very cheap bolts, screws, brackets and other little items on their cars which rust after one winter... and although overall build has improved they still rattle themselves loose quickly.

Yes, the cars are generally reliable (stilo excepted) but the little bits do count and as long as Fiat themselves dont care too uch, then the dealers never will either. You can have the nicest salesman ever to buy your car from but its after that when it really counts.
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Old 07-06-2009   #36
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

Quote Originally Posted by Nuova500 View Post
Ive had 4 brand new Fiats, every one has had dents, scratches, interior damage and some quite major paint issues when delivered to me... WHY CANT THEY SPOT THESE BEFORE DELIVERY?
I've had 6 from new (3 dealers) and not experienced one of those issues. Were all 4 from the same dealer?

Quote Originally Posted by Nuova500 View Post
Lastly, Fiat still insist on putting very cheap bolts, screws, brackets and other little items on their cars which rust after one winter... and although overall build has improved they still rattle themselves loose quickly.
Both my (old, new) MINIs had rusty nuts on the wing mirrors. Not found anything on my 500.

The cars are great but the dealers do still need some serious work in areas such as communicating with the customer, availability of workshop timeslots and cars being available for test drives.

Regards,
Tony.
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Old 07-06-2009   #37
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

Quote Originally Posted by tonywalk View Post
availability of workshop timeslots and cars being available for test drives.
but is that the garages or Fiats fault?
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Old 07-06-2009   #38
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

The thing is, people don't discriminate. If you have problems either with the dealer or with the car, as far as the punter is concerned; it's Fiat. And this is the way I feel too. The manufacturer should, for their own sake, police the dealers very carefully because the reality is that if there is a big maroon and chrome badge hanging over the building saying FIAT, then Fiat it is.

The badge stands for whatever goes on within.
I think it will improve, and it has to if Fiat wants to win more sales. Many dealers are quite small and I wonder how they will manage to house the dedicated Lancia space for the new Delta, not to mention the whole range of Fiats and Alfas. Perhaps with property now so cheap this is the time to expand.
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Old 08-06-2009   #39
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

Quote Originally Posted by Ulpian View Post
. The manufacturer should, for their own sake, police the dealers very carefully because the reality is that if there is a big maroon and chrome badge hanging over the building saying FIAT, then Fiat it is.
Isn't that the promise that Fiat MD Andrew Humberstone made, to visit ALL Fiat dealerships in the UK.

He has set set himself three key challenges;


Sell more cars
Improve dealer profitability
Improve the customer experience.

So far number 3 is the main one he should address and then the other two will quickly follow.

He cites Virgin Atlantic, Marks and Spencer and Apple - companies which are creative and adaptable to change as examples of the levels of CS he would like Fiat to achieve and I hope that he achieves this as he seems a genuine sort of guy.

Rome wasn't built in a day so perhaps 18 months into his job as MD it is still too early to judge how well he is doing.
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Old 08-06-2009   #40
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

Quote Originally Posted by grimwau View Post
18 months into his job as MD it is still too early to judge how well he is doing.
18 mths is a long ...long time in business Grimwau....he's trying to change attitudes, understanding the product/market, people.........he should be way past the 1/2 point now of that sea change..........do users/buyers of their servicescars sense that change yet?


Not sure!!

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Old 08-06-2009   #41
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

It's a shame we can't see the results broken down into dealerships.
I'm sure Fiat would be further up if Evans Halshaw and Arnold Clark weren't included*!

*Not necessarily based on my own experiences but of the general feeling on the forums and elsewhere.
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Old 08-06-2009   #42
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

Quote Originally Posted by grimwau View Post
Isn't that the promise that Fiat MD Andrew Humberstone made, to visit ALL Fiat dealerships in the UK.
Did he?

Quote Originally Posted by 30111987 View Post
I'm sure Fiat would be further up if Evans Halshaw and Arnold Clark weren't included*!
Fiat will never get rid of the large dealer chains, they sell too many cars & do things there own way despite what Fiat say. Love/hate relationship?
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Old 08-06-2009   #43
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

TJ Vickers gave me a lift to work when no courtesy car was available. Was a 5 minute walk away though.
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Old 08-06-2009   #44
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

Not very enviromental that
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Old 09-06-2009   #45
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Re: why are Fiat bottom of the 2009 JD Power Survey?

In 2005, I went into a FIAT dealership called Priory in Manchester looking specifically for a Panda MJ. The salesman was very helpful. I told him exactly what I was looking for: A Panda MJ in metallic light blue with alloys (& 165 tyres) and a rubbing strip as I thought the flanks looked a bit vulnerable without them.

He happened to have one in stock, but as the car wasn't due to be launched for another week or so he wasn't allowed to show it to anyone. Personally I thought that was a bit crass, as physically it was no different than a 1.2 Dynamic, but hey ho.

He eventually persuaded the Sales Manager to let me have a drive and basically do with it what I wanted. Half an hour and 20 miles later I was signing on the dotted line. On the 1st of March I went in to pick it up. The only thing lacking was the rubbing strip which I'd been warned might take a while. It went in a fortnight later to have this fitted and I was leant a Punto MJ while this was done.

At 12 months and 12K miles it went in to the same place for its service. When I collected it they gave me a price that was 35 more than I'd been quoted. When I queried it, the Receptionist said that if that was the case she would stand by the quote. All round good service from purchase to service.

When I went to book it in for its 2nd service at 2 years, they'd shut up shop and closed down. So I rang Stoneacre in Hyde near where I live to the East of Manchester. Unfortunately they couldn't do it for about 2 weeks and the day before the service it started making a slight grinding noise when I braked. As I'd just driven off from home where it had been parked up for a couple of days
I thought it was a bit of surface rust on the discs. Unfortunately it had worn the pads down on one side to the rivets. Alas, no brake wear warning light. Neither the dealer nor FIAT would have any truck with my claims that the wear was premature and that it shouldn't have been wearing on one side more than the other. So I had to fork out for new discs and pads.

In the meantime, we had chopped Mrs. Beard's Punto in for a 12 month Stilo with 1,000 miles on the clock. I took my Panda into Stoneacre to have a grinding noise from the clutch investigated. As I reversed up a slope outside the workshop there were 2 young cleaning lads standing nearby. Both of them heard the noise. One of their top Technicians got in the car with me and did everything he could to provoke it into making the "noise." Which it did. The only problem was that even as it was making the "noise", he said he couldn't hear anything. Either he was a liar, or he was deaf. In which case, what was he doing investigating a noise? I stormed off in a huff.

A couple of months later, we were back with Mrs.Beard's Stilo making a squeaking noise from the back end. No fault found. It still makes the noise today.

As they were both out of warranty within a month of each other, both the Panda and Stilo went into a non-franchised dealer, who, while not being much cheaper than Stoneacre seemed to be more professional. John Delaney in Stockport for anyone interested.

To date though, the Stilo is just over 4 years old and has done 32,000 miles. In total it has had 2 new tyres and the fan belt is just starting to squeak on start up and the door strap on the driver's side broke. Otherwise that's it.

The Panda is a month younger and has done 41,000 miles and has had new pads and discs, 2 new wiper blades and a new indicator bulb that was losing its orangeness.

Overall, not bad for crap cars. In April, the Panda was serviced at Stoneacre, but only because they wrote to me and offered such a good deal that I couldn't say no. They did however, issue an advisory on the MOT that one of the front bushes was going which tallied with a clunking noise I could here going over bumps. I got my local freindly neighbourhood non-franchise dealer to take a look and he couldn't find anything except for loose baffles in the back box, but said it wasn't that which was causing the noise.

Will we replace them with FIATs? Yes. If only we could find a dealer that was as good as Priory.
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Last edited by The Beard; 09-06-2009 at 00:15.
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