Was watching crash videos on youtube, and stumbled upon the Senna Crash.
I remember watching it as a kid of only 5 years, yet until I saw it again it didn't even sink in. Then I wikipedia'd it, and read about it all, and roland ratzenberger's death (which I didn't know about).
I feel quite moved, especially after reading this about aryton;

Perhaps the unique duality of his character was most evident at the moment of his death. As track officials examined the wreckage of his racing car they found a furled, bloodsoaked Austrian flag. A victory flag that he was going to raise as he won the race, in honour of Austrian Roland Ratzenberger, who had died on that track the day before.

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Just goes to show that sometimes the biggest people in the world are the most down to earth and caring, and just how dangerous sudden deceleration is.

It does seem probable that the "safety car" killed Senna, it was a shock to me, I thought he was so good he was untoucahable. The chat afterwards was that the car used (I think it was a warm Opel/Vauxhall Vectra/Cav.) could not be circulated at a speed that kept the race cars tyres warm ,it's driver later said he had boiled the brake fluid trying and at one point someone drove up next to him and suggested he got a move on. GM had shelled some sponsorship to get this car on TV. I did also hear that it was generally thought that some teams had "forgotten" to take the traction control out of the on board ROMs and it could be accidentally switched on from the pits. Senna may have been aiming off for this at the re-start, always a point where you can lose a place.

As for Roland Ratzenberger's crash. It wouldn't be until the Hans device became the norm that such a crash would become survivable.

Renegade_8 said:

It does seem probable that the "safety car" killed Senna, it was a shock to me, I thought he was so good he was untoucahable. The chat afterwards was that the car used (I think it was a warm Opel/Vauxhall Vectra/Cav.) could not be circulated at a speed that kept the race cars tyres warm ,it's driver later said he had boiled the brake fluid trying and at one point someone drove up next to him and suggested he got a move on. GM had shelled some sponsorship to get this car on TV. I did also hear that it was generally thought that some teams had "forgotten" to take the traction control out of the on board ROMs and it could be accidentally switched on from the pits. Senna may have been aiming off for this at the re-start, always a point where you can lose a place.

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Wiat, didnt the steering on Sennas car fail?? I thought that it was a fault in a weld on the steering column

blu:devil:

bludvl_x19 said:

Wiat, didnt the steering on Sennas car fail?? I thought that it was a fault in a weld on the steering column

blu:devil:

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Williams were cleared of that charge. If you read the whole article on wikipedia you'll find the answer, renegade8's is also a disproven theory, as senna did a faster lap than hill and schumacher, in a heavier car, so his tyre's must have been up to temp according to many pro f1 drivers.

How about this quote:

"One particular thing that Formula-1 can provide you, is that you know you're always exposed to danger. Danger of getting hurt, danger of dying. This is part of your life, and you either face it in a professional, in a cool manner, or you just drop it, just leave it and don't do it anymore really. And I happen to like too much what I do to just drop it, I can't drop it."

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i remember watching this vividly.
it was the first death i ever came across and it actually hit me quite hard.
isnt it funny how someone you idolise can mean so much to you and you have never actually met them.

I've never thought of researching it but after reading some of them snippets i'm off to wikipedia right now to read up on it.

Such a loss.

RIP Ayrton :worship:

It's a good read, I never really idolised him (was a damon fan) but he is of course an F1 great, so there was always respect for him even as a young young F1 fan.

Hellcat said:

As for Roland Ratzenberger's crash. It wouldn't be until the Hans device became the norm that such a crash would become survivable.

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Probably true - Dale Earnhardt Sr died of a similar injury in NASCAR IIRC.

Motorsport is dangerous - always has been, always will be. A lot of men have paid the ultimate price in the name of motorsport.

Don't forget that it could have been 3 dead on that weekend of 1 May 1994 - Barrichello almost died on the Friday from swallowing his tongue after barrel rolling into the barriers IIRC. Ratzenburger's death was the first death in F1 for 12 years (the death previous was Riccardo Paletti who died in the 1982 Canadian GP when his Osella crashed into Didier Pironi's Ferrari, whose car didn't get off the grid. Paletti died of massive chest injuries IIRC).

Such a sad loss

I wasnt really that interested in Motorsport in 94, even tho I was 6. I wish I was, because being able to say that you can remember that crash will be something to have in the coming years, when F1 is dragged to it knees through safety changes which will ultimatly reduce the sport to a procession.

Oh, wait, it is already

blu:devil:

My dad watched it religiously, hence why I'm such a fan of motorsport.

SkinzCinqSporting said:

My dad watched it religiously, hence why I'm such a fan of motorsport.

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Although my parents were into motorsport in a big way (they met at a historic race meeting) they didnt really pass it on to me. Now Ive got my own interests, I watch the F1 religiously, and the A1GP when they decide to show it.


blu:devil:

PS is there a F1 race this weekend? Me thinks there is

Yup it's this weekend, somewhere in europe (may actually be imola, it's one of the earlier european races)

SkinzCinqSporting said:

Yup it's this weekend, somewhere in europe (may actually be imola, it's one of the earlier european races)

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I just checked F1.com and its not in europe, its in that great northern state of the USA, Canada. (Montreal)


blu:devil:

bludvl_x19 said:

I just checked F1.com and its not in europe, its in that great northern state of the USA, Canada. (Montreal)


blu

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Odd, they usually tour europe first.

SkinzCinqSporting said:

Odd, they usually tour europe first.

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Bernie must be able to make more money this way. Call me a cynic then, I dont care.

blu:devil:

chaos said:

Probably true - Dale Earnhardt Sr died of a similar injury in NASCAR IIRC.

Motorsport is dangerous - always has been, always will be. A lot of men have paid the ultimate price in the name of motorsport.

Don't forget that it could have been 3 dead on that weekend of 1 May 1994 - Barrichello almost died on the Friday from swallowing his tongue after barrel rolling into the barriers IIRC. Ratzenburger's death was the first death in F1 for 12 years (the death previous was Riccardo Paletti who died in the 1982 Canadian GP when his Osella crashed into Didier Pironi's Ferrari, whose car didn't get off the grid. Paletti died of massive chest injuries IIRC).

Such a sad loss

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1994 was a pretty bad year in F1. Barrichello's crash was a bit strange as the car took off and hit the top of a tyre wall - but was still level. Dug the nose in and rolled a couple of times. We also had the introduction of re-fueling and Jos Verstappen's big pitlane fire. Remember them all pretty well as I'd be watching them at my Grandparents after Sunday lunch.

i vividly remember hearing about the crash, and it was actually the first ever GP i missed as i was away with school

i completley idolised Senna, i met him when i was 2 at Brands Hatch, my Dad at the time had not long quit being events co-ordinator and his part time club racing as my Mum didnt want him getting hurt with children. my Dad was talking away with a few of the guys at Brands and then Senna and Mansell came into the room so my Dad got talking and i was there, was taken for a drive around the Indy circuit on my Dads lap with Senna driving the then pace car, a brooklands capri. unfortunately i dont remember it

ive never been able to bring myself to watch the video of that weekends racing, but i may have to dig it out

SkinzCinqSporting said:

Williams were cleared of that charge. If you read the whole article on wikipedia you'll find the answer, renegade8's is also a disproven theory, as senna did a faster lap than hill and schumacher, in a heavier car, so his tyre's must have been up to temp according to many pro f1 drivers.

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Something went wrong with that car in that corner, I don't totally rule out the column failing, we will never know due to the botched Italian investigation. With Williams facing jail time in Italy all we can say certainly is that he got good legal advice, as if someone with his money wouldn't. Senna was driving around that cars problems, if he went into that corner at 9.9 tenths and the tyres were not quite to temp, plus maybe still not fully scrubbed from following the pace car, then once you are off the grippy racing line no matter how good you are you are a passenger. A seperate thread about motorsport F1 and safety would be good and there is alot to say, but I don't feel like saying much more in a thread about this other than that I miss Senna.:worship:

According to the TV program i saw, senna's car crashed because it lost the ground force effect from underneath, i am no expert but i as saw it is,

The lower to the ground a cars runs, the faster it can take corners.(F1 cars back then ran a few Milimetre of the ground)
The air flow that fills the gap under the car is channeled in such a way it creates its own down force.
Senna's tyres were not at full temp yet, which DID NOT cause a grip problem (as senna was a good enough driver to decide how much grip the car had) BUT because the tyre was not at running temp, the gas inside the tyre expands with heat, hence the tyres were not at its full ride hieght.
This lowered the car by just enough for the car to ground out (hence all the sparks coming out the back). when the car hits the ground you lose the airflow and all the downforce that is being created, hence when the corner came senna did not have enough down force to take the corner and went straight on..

This is why they now have 1cm planks under the cars, to stop this agian.