Yeah dont worry im not completely oblivious, I do realise its illegal and is lying but chances of being caught out are practically zero.

TJetPete said:

"How about landing the policy holder / driver with a bill in excess of £1m if they kill someone??!"

... How is that even possible?!

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It costs around £1m to sort out a road crash, Police time, Ambo, Fire if needed, plus all the other stuff behind the scenes kinda stuff. Insurance companies will pay for a lot of it, they will find any reason not to. Fronting is the perfect reason not to pay out. Its down to policy holder to pay then.

HitomiLee said:

Yeah dont worry im not completely oblivious, I do realise its illegal and is lying but chances of being caught out are practically zero.

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lol. If you want to think that, go for it. I know on the other hand that the chances of getting caught a lot higher than 'practically zero'.

Kier said:

It costs around £1m to sort out a road crash, Police time, Ambo, Fire if needed, plus all the other stuff behind the scenes kinda stuff. Insurance companies will pay for a lot of it, they will find any reason not to. Fronting is the perfect reason not to pay out. Its down to policy holder to pay then.

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Ah right I see. But may I ask how they'd know someone was fronting?

Kier said:

lol. If you want to think that, go for it. I know on the other hand that the chances of getting caught a lot higher than 'practically zero'.

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It doesn't matter, she doesn't front anyway. I'm main driver and Policy holder. But like her, i'm just curious of how you'd be caught, or how they'd decide you were fronting?

TJetPete said:

Ah right I see. But may I ask how they'd know someone was fronting?



It doesn't matter, she doesn't front anyway. I'm main driver and Policy holder. But like her, i'm just curious of how you'd be caught, or how they'd decide you were fronting?

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Not something I want to say on a public forum, if people want to Front, they need to be prepared to face the consequences without trying to find ways of getting out of it. However, its fairly common sense.

Kier said:

Not something I want to say on a public forum, if people want to Front, they need to be prepared to face the consequences without trying to find ways of getting out of it. However, its fairly common sense.

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:yeahthat: there are several ways and means which people don't even think about until insurance pop up a question after an accident, and by then it's too late.

Insurance companies will do ANYTHING and I mean literally any stretch to get out of paying. They will get CCTV of you driving to college every day, they will get you at petrol stations, cameras across the country, and claim you are fronting. They will look for undeclared modifications, bumper painting, stickers, the most small and petty of items, and will make an example of you by claiming you were driving without valid insurance.

Then you're looking at a criminal record, too. It's just not worth it.

Yeah dont worry our insurance is perfectly what we claimed it to be. But im just saying as long as you are insured on the vehicle as a named driver, theres really not much they can do to prove that you drive it more than the 'main driver'

HitomiLee said:

Yeah dont worry im not completely oblivious, I do realise its illegal and is lying but chances of being caught out are practically zero.

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I suggest you spend some time in the public seats at your local magistrates court. If you do that, you will find out that lots of people get caught doing this.

I sentenced two people earlier this week, both got no insurance convictions and the cars had been seized by police. It was only a paperwork mix up by the prosecution that enabled them to avoid prosecution for fraud.

Insurance companies don't pay for public services lol. They pay out 3rd party claims in the event of and accident.
The only way you can be out of pocket by that much is if you get sued by a 3rd party and your insurance refuse to pay because you were uninsured.

Is this propogandic spiel? You say that 2 people got caught in this situation but you don't say how? For all we know they could have been using their bed ridden Granny etc.

hi im 17 and live in Belfast Northen Ireland. I got a seicento sporting for £280 i recently got insurance with Quinn for £2000 with my dad who has 20+ years experience on the insurance aswell, try having your parents on the policy aswell.

xFaz said:

Insurance companies will do ANYTHING and I mean literally any stretch to get out of paying. They will get CCTV of you driving to college every day, they will get you at petrol stations, cameras across the country, and claim you are fronting. They will look for undeclared modifications, bumper painting, stickers, the most small and petty of items, and will make an example of you by claiming you were driving without valid insurance.

Then you're looking at a criminal record, too. It's just not worth it.

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I'm not doubting you, but may I ask how they would gain access to the CCTV? And how that would stand up in court? Unless they are monitored 24 hours a day, there is no way they can prove you were driving the car all the time? They'd have to soft through thousands of hours of footage, which I imagine would cost more than a claims worth =\ lol

I do agree with the point you made about them loo
king for any excuse not to pay, it's a business to them after all =P

What classes as main driver usage? Is it alright if the main driver is using the vehicle 51% of the time, with the named using it only 49%? Or is there some other way of measuring it? Sorry if that didn't make sense =P

volxstu said:

Is this propogandic spiel? You say that 2 people got caught in this situation but you don't say how? For all we know they could have been using their bed ridden Granny etc.

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It was the usual.
Young driver was stopped in his Saxo for alleged speeding - insurance and MOT checked via radio.

Young driver shown to be named as second driver with mother as main driver.

Police radio carry out check on the mother and find she has another car registered in her own name.

Police phoned the mother, explained fronting was suspected and told her that she would need to attend the police station for interview. At that point the mother admitted that she never drove the Saxo.

Car seized, son got 6 points for no insurance, mother got 6 points for permit use without insurance.


We hold a motoring offences court once a week. It would be unusual not to have one or two of these each week. Once the parents realise they face a real risk of conviction for obtaining financial advantage by deception they can't shop the kids quick enough. They go along with the fronting because they see no problem in deceiving insurance companies and don't understand that they also run a real risk of a conviction for an offence of dishonesty.

TJetPete said:

but may I ask how they would gain access to the CCTV? And how that would stand up in court? Unless they are monitored 24 hours a day, there is no way they can prove you were driving the car all the time?

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The vast majority of these convictions happen without the need for CCTV and are the result of roadside checks. Police are well aware of fronting and any young driver named as second driver of a typical young persons car will make the police start to ask questions. A quick radio check on the main driver will show if they have a car of their own.

Even if they don't have a car of their own it only takes a few questions. Where do work, how do you get there, which petrol station do you fill up at, do you pay by card, where do you shop etc etc. Then tell the parent the second driver will be asked the same questions and the answers compared. Then explain that fronting is fraud and ask the parent how their employer and friends will react if they get convicted.

Most parents who get involved with fronting have believed what their child told them. That everybody does it, that its not criminal, and you won't get caught. None of which is true. It really isn't that difficult to scare somebody into telling the truth especially when they are angry that thier kid has lied to them.

If you have to make a claim the insurer will be interested. Claims adjusters know what to look for just like the police. It doesn't take much for a claim to reach £5,000 or 6,000. A few hundred quid spent getting an investigator to run a few checks becomes a sensible idea. Thats when the insurers ask the same questions as police then go and look at the CCTV, bank records, ask the neighbours who drives the car. Local police will often know who they see at the wheel.

Claims involving medical compensation can run into millions, you wouldn't believe the lengths insurers will go to avoid paying that much cash when they think fronting is involved.

TJetPete said:

I'm not doubting you, but may I ask how they would gain access to the CCTV? And how that would stand up in court? Unless they are monitored 24 hours a day, there is no way they can prove you were driving the car all the time? They'd have to soft through thousands of hours of footage, which I imagine would cost more than a claims worth =\ lol

I do agree with the point you made about them loo
king for any excuse not to pay, it's a business to them after all =P

What classes as main driver usage? Is it alright if the main driver is using the vehicle 51% of the time, with the named using it only 49%? Or is there some other way of measuring it? Sorry if that didn't make sense =P

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So they don't do it to everyone, but they do it to a few people now and again to make an example, put people off doing it.

Ultimately, it's illegal, and you're an idiot if you do it.

volxstu said:

Insurance companies don't pay for public services lol.

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they do a fair bit for serious accidents! The one where dad was hit by another driver head on her insurance paid for everythig bar the air ambulance, the only reason they got away without paying for that is because its a charity funded one.

To be honest mate, theres plenty of sites trying to rip you off, i'm 19 no no claims and i'm on my own policy fully comp on a 1.2 active which was 4000 pound and my insurance is 1850 with 450 excess, i'm with aviva.. I found actual insurance companies give better quotes than comparing sites

xFaz said:

So they don't do it to everyone, but they do it to a few people now and again to make an example, put people off doing it.

Ultimately, it's illegal, and you're an idiot if you do it.

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Sorry =] but what part of my post was this in reply to?

jeez i wish i never said anything...

Hey, I'm 19 (passed since March 2010) I've recently bought an 04 Fiat Punto 1.2 Active Sport (mk2b) for around £1500, and the insurance quotes i got were around the £4k mark, from £2,800 to £3,800 (with and without my dad being the main driver)

However I did go with a company called 'Insure the Box' which are aimed at new drivers, and that brought it down to £1400(ish), that's me as the main driver, with comprehensive cover. so i can build up my no claims and the premiums can go down when i reapply for insurance next year.

The catch is they do fit a tracker/box into your car/dash, so they can see your average speeds for every 60 miles, they look at heavy acceleration and heavy braking, how long it's parked for, when you drive and where you drive.. basically work out if you're a "boy racer" or not.

I was a bit wary at first but I went for it and I'm glad i went for it... because I only really use the car to take me to work and back, and it allows me to socialise too.
Also ticking the 'the car is modified' box only added about £30 extra to it!
Hope this helps... good luck! (oh and i may be a new member but i'm not selling the insurance company! just saw the thread and thought id give my two cents)

edit: oh! and youre limited to 6k miles a year.. but you can buy extra miles if you need to.