yes i would be interested. whats the score with r tech? how muchwe talking for remaps?>

davidthelodge said:

Just got back from R tech, I have left my car with them as it has an overboost fault and is not in fit state to be re-mapped. :bang: I should be collecting it next Fri/Sat.

Click to expand...

Yup a poorly car , on the stock factory map power run there was a huge dip in power at 3220rpm which lasted for 300rpms which is the result of a boost cut. The ecu is asking for a spec boost of 2157mb but the turbo is kicking out 2527mb, then cutting the VNT duty back to 35% to see 1100mb then back to 2100mb to make a respect full 117bhp. Three things it could be VNT actuator adjusted wrong (too short) there is tipex on the rod for some reason, MAP sensor 0-5v scale giving wrong reading or the boost control valve. Its in at out top workshop now with Matt having a the MAP sensor tested and the VNT re-setup

Nick

Update - R Tech unfortunatly can't trace the fault, and suggested taking it to a main Fiat dealer, I have therefore decided to leave my car over there and booked it into the nearby Fiat main dealer (Research Garage-Nuneaton) for 17th Aug, it will then go back to R tech to be re-mapped. I am missing my Stilo . As I am off on hols on Sun I won't get it back until around 26th.

Collected my Stilo JTD from R Tech in Hinckley today. Research Garage-Fiat main dealer spent 6 hrs testing, tracing & correcting what they believed to be the problem, they found a kinked vacume pipe running to the turbo electro valve, meaning the vacume was not being read by the turbo actuator pressure sensor. The car then when back to R tech last Sat to finally be re-mapped, but again it was not possible as there is still a problem with the power tailing off earlier than a standard JTD115 should. Research Garage say according to them the cars now running within spec and so O.K.

R Tech suggust the next step would be to strip & clean the turbocharger, they could do this sometime in Sept, whilst Research yesterday sort of suggested replacing some of the turbo pipes (to and from overboost valve and maybe a few others). The overboost valve has already been replaced by R-Tech. All in all £100's spent - mainly with Fiat main dealer and still my cars not running correctly, and has thus not been re-mapped. Though as far as I can tell it drives O.K. I have to say, even though R Tech are extremely busy they have been very helpful, Nick even went to the Fiat dealer to discuss the problems with my car and compare notes, and as they pointed out other mapers would have just mapped it and this would have most likely produced further problems, clearly its very important to do a rolling road test to make sure any cars 100% OK before its mapped, even if u drive it regularly u cant tell if your car is producing 100% of the bhp & torque it should be and running totally as it should.

If anyone has any I would be very interested to see various std JTD115 dynamometer print outs, (i.e. pre re-mapp) I believe mine has peak bhp @ 3000 rpm, when it should be 4000 rpm. I now have to decide if I keep spending on the car just to get it 100% and able to be re-mapped + the cost of the re-map, my re-mapp budgets long since been spent :bang:

If this works here's a coupe of pics of my car on R-tech rolling road


ad

Update - my cars going back to R-tech to have a innotec turbo clean, which can be done whilst the turbo is still on the car for around £100, hopefully this will be done on 20th Sept. If this solves the problem it will finally get its long awaited re-mapp.

davidthelodge said:

Update - my cars going back to R-tech to have a innotec turbo clean, which can be done whilst the turbo is still on the car for around £100, hopefully this will be done on 20th Sept. If this solves the problem it will finally get its long awaited re-mapp.

Click to expand...

Morning Dave.
Its the 20th today, good luck.

Took it in Sat morning, @ yesterday (Tuesday) they were struggling to remove the exhaust manifold to do the turbo clean, hope to hear more tomorrow.

Turbo cant be innotec cleaned as they cant get the exhuast manifold off, the bolt is in an inaccessable place on mine, sad times. Been without the car all week, now going to get it back.:bang:

strange, everyone else has managed to get theirs off, how did the bolt get on if its inaccessable

im guessing its costing you more with the car taking up spac in there shop ?

Ash

Its believed the fitting was put on with the engine out of the car, B4 it was assembled. I saw the metallic ring fitting and I too would not know how to remove it from under the car. As they could'nt do the turbo clean they have not charged me, its just a pain being without the car for 7 days and keep traveling from Kidderminster to Hinckley getting lifts etc. So frustratingly no futher progress, next its going back to the Fiat dealer on 15/10 to go back on Examiner, see the other thread in Stilo forum (turbo problems).

Update - Finaly got my 115JTD Stilo remaped yesterday (8/12/10). So its gone from a rolling road actual figure of 120.06 BHP to 157.1 BHP, TORQUE is also up from 192 to 247 ft lbs. Driving the car u can really tell it has much better peformance. It feels more like my old 5 clyinder 2.4 TD Marea, which had loads of mid range torque. As standard my Stilo should have been 115 BHP and 188 ft lbs of torque, so it was already slightly better than expected. Fiat Forum members can get their car done for the reduced price of £199, they normaly re-map 3 cars per day, mainly VW/Audi/Seats.

I would recommend R-Tech Hinckley, but try to make sure your cars running perfectly before you take it to be re-mapped as the nearby main Fiat agent Research Garage Nuneaton are, in my opinion, very poor at fault finding, they could not even diagnose that the wrong MAF was fitted on my car (1 off a 16v JTD). So with its 3 door front bumper, 17" Fiat multispoke alloys and its re-map my 1.9JTD Stilo multiwagon finished.

200 miles later and I am now getting clutch slip in 4th & 5th gears, clearly the cars original clutch @ 68,000 miles can't cope with this increase in power & torque.

Boy are you going through the mill with this whole remap process! Would you say the lesson in general here is you need a really good car with fresh critical parts to start with?

I think the lesson here is if you want 150bhp, then buy a car with 150 bhp and a clutch thats built to handle that power & torque. I expect my clutch,turbo,gearbox & driveshafts are all probably opperating above their rating. It would be interesting to know if a Stilo 150bhp 16v JTD has the same garrat turbo, obviously the 16v clutch & I guess also the 16v's gearbox must both be stronger units.

So in my opinion its not a case of unlocking your JTD115's true potential, I feel we are really pushing the boundaries by having our 8v JTD's re-maped up to 150-160 bhp & 240-250 ft lbs of torque. I would suggest that if driven sensibly the standard Fiat clutch life after a good remap would be reduced to 40-50,000 miles, compared with about double that on a JTD115 which has not been re-maped. If only they had put the 150bhp 16v Stilo engine in the mulitwagon I would have brought one, so unless I change my mind my next car will not be re-mapped. So I guess its a new £400+ performance clutch for mine as soon as my funds allow, this will be in a few months.

davidthelodge said:

I think the lesson here is if you want 150bhp, then buy a car with 150 bhp and a clutch thats built to handle that power & torque.

Click to expand...

It's been really interesting reading your experiences with the remap, it's got me think about not getting mine done now, time will tell.

Thanks again

Update - Uprated performance clutch fitted locally today, supplied by Clutch Specialists Leeds,total cost £418. On removal of the original clutch its clear the plate was only around half worn, therefore clearly the cars standard valeo clutch unit can't handle this level of increase in torque. The new clutch unit has to be run in for 500 miles of town driving before full power can be applied. Lets hope the original dual mass flywheel can handle the increase in torque/power.

What surprises me is that all Stilo JTD's clutches dont slip in 3rd, 4th & 5th immediately after they are re-mapped to 150-160 BHP & 240-250 ft lbs of torque, can anyone answer that one ? Is it down to the pressure of the clutch forks pushing to plate against the dual mass flywheel, rather than the amount of meat left on the original clutch plate itself ? David

davidthelodge said:

I think the lesson here is if you want 150bhp, then buy a car with 150 bhp and a clutch thats built to handle that power & torque. I expect my clutch,turbo,gearbox & driveshafts are all probably opperating above their rating. It would be interesting to know if a Stilo 150bhp 16v JTD has the same garrat turbo, obviously the 16v clutch & I guess also the 16v's gearbox must both be stronger units.

So in my opinion its not a case of unlocking your JTD115's true potential, I feel we are really pushing the boundaries by having our 8v JTD's re-maped up to 150-160 bhp & 240-250 ft lbs of torque. I would suggest that if driven sensibly the standard Fiat clutch life after a good remap would be reduced to 40-50,000 miles, compared with about double that on a JTD115 which has not been re-maped. If only they had put the 150bhp 16v Stilo engine in the mulitwagon I would have brought one, so unless I change my mind my next car will not be re-mapped. So I guess its a new £400+ performance clutch for mine as soon as my funds allow, this will be in a few months.

Click to expand...

I've felt this way about the whole 'do up my car' scene.
Yes, I can remap my 105bhp but what about the tolerences within the drive train & braking system? It's not just the strain on the clutch assembly either, should all engine mountings etc be uprated.
Once you've got it going, how about stopping it? The disks and pads on sports cars are far different to the ones on my car - and for good reason.
Same with tyres, all that extra oompf has to be transferred to the tarmac so some serious bits of rubber will be needed (and also for the braking).
And then there's the argument for increasing wheel sizes - that's probably going to be OK as long as you keep the overall size (so increase the rim but lower the profile) as the whole drive train was designed and set up to work off those 14" standards.
Does the remap company advise any of these things?
It seems to me that some sort of advice should be given...'yes, we can increase bhp but do please bear in miond that you will also need to do additional work...'
And it sort of flashes through my mind every time I see the chavs out in their antique corsas with tuned up engines - so they've increased the noise but how long will their brakes hold out?

Upate - 500 miles of pure town driving later and now finally the new performance clutch is bedded in and I can use the full power/torque. No clutch slip and plenty of power for overtaking, I am finally very happy with performance now for a 1.9TD. Also I had a gentle "A road" 130 mile run from Worestershire to the Welsh coast and achived 60 MPG ! Outstanding economy for a medium sized estate.

I have also now purchased a 209 bhp Subaru Legacy Outback Estate 3 litre petrol, used to have a Subaru Legacy 2.5 estate, but I will still be keeping the Stilo Wagon for work use @ 40p per mile and for other long cheap journeys.
I now have 3 cars and 3 kids, and a moaning wife who keeps asking I need 3 cars !