Hey guys.

I'm looking to refill my AC on my grade pinto tjet 1.4 as my AC system has been warm for MANY a years now to the point I feel all the refrigerant is gone.

I was looking at getting on of those plug and squeeze kits. Question is, are theses kits more to just top up your system when it's a little low or Do i need to use one of those industrial fancy ones to do a complete refill (see pic)

Thanks again guys

Not a simple question to answer.

If you have no aircon at all then you need to get it looked at properly. If the aircon is working but is very weak then you could refil it yourself with a kit.

If you get it done properly you may find out something is broken or needs work and it might cost a fortune but the price of the refil is lower than the self service kits.

If something is broken and you use the kit, your can easily spray £60 of gas into the atmosphere and still have noting to show for it.

If you do it yourself you can do it when you want. If you pay someone you’re going to have to take the car to them, book it In or leave it for the day, more often that not in work hours 9-5 when you need to be at work yourself.

So there are a number of things to answer before you can say what’s best and easier.

Normally I would always advocate getting it looked at properly, but I’ve work on my own aircon systems for well over a decade and decided to give one of these kits a go last year, posting up the process on YouTube

Here on my 1.6 multijet punto evo
[ame]https://youtu.be/DVbR4vGbvxU[/ame]

everson38 said:

Hey guys.

I'm looking to refill my AC on my grade pinto tjet 1.4 as my AC system has been warm for MANY a years now to the point I feel all the refrigerant is gone.

I was looking at getting on of those plug and squeeze kits. Question is, are theses kits more to just top up your system when it's a little low or Do i need to use one of those industrial fancy ones to do a complete refill (see pic)

Thanks again guysView attachment 200462

Click to expand...

It is now illegal to do any work on a car (or any other) aircon system unless you have an F-Gas qualification
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/f-gas-requirements-for-air-conditioners-in-cars-and-other-vehicles
Get a proper aircon company to do it.

The sale of top-up kits by the likes of Halfords to non qualified perons is of dubious legality but as far as I know its not been enforced. The big reputabl suppliers won't sell it to you and Halfords don't care if you break the law.

Robert G8RPI.

AndyRKett said:

Not a simple question to answer.

If you have no aircon at all then you need to get it looked at properly. If the aircon is working but is very weak then you could refil it yourself with a kit.

If you get it done properly you may find out something is broken or needs work and it might cost a fortune but the price of the refil is lower than the self service kits.

If something is broken and you use the kit, your can easily spray £60 of gas into the atmosphere and still have noting to show for it.

If you do it yourself you can do it when you want. If you pay someone you’re going to have to take the car to them, book it In or leave it for the day, more often that not in work hours 9-5 when you need to be at work yourself.

So there are a number of things to answer before you can say what’s best and easier.

Normally I would always advocate getting it looked at properly, but I’ve work on my own aircon systems for well over a decade and decided to give one of these kits a go last year, posting up the process on YouTube

Here on my 1.6 multijet punto evo
https://youtu.be/DVbR4vGbvxU

Click to expand...

Lol thanks funnily enough I am actually subscribed to your channel but never saw thus lol

No problem.

The rules quoted above are for owner operators of commercial vehicles and repair centres.

The big car parts companies deal directly with garages who repair and replace aircon systems and will sell large volumes of gasses to garages if needed.

Halfords and other motor factors stores sell to the general public and the recharge kits are readily available all over the place, even on amazon.

They usually cost more than a single recharge at a garage £70ish maybe, but there is a refundable surcharge on the gas canister so some of that comes back to you and the canisters usually have enough for 2 recharges, good for boosting the systems on a couple of cars.

If you think all the gas has gone and it’s been like this a few years then definitely get it looked at properly to make sure there are no leaks and that everything is working, you don’t want to spend all that money on a recharge to fine the compressor has seized.

Andy,
what bit of :

"Use qualified technicians

Only technicians qualified to handle F gas can service mobile air conditioners that contain regulated F gases."
and



"Vehicles like cars, coaches, trains, ships and aeroplanes often have air conditioners that use hyduorocarbons (HFCs), like HFC 134a. HFCs are a type of fluorinated greenhouse gas (F gas).
Air conditioners in vehicles are also known as ‘mobile air conditioners’."


Do you think "are for owner operators of commercial vehicles and repair centres" and by your implication don't apply to car owners?


You seem to think you are above the law. It's your problem if you break the law but don't mislead others into doing it.



Robert G8RPI.

g8rpi said:

It is now illegal to do any work on a car (or any other) aircon system unless you have an F-Gas qualification
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/f-gas-requirements-for-air-conditioners-in-cars-and-other-vehicles
Get a proper aircon company to do it.

The sale of top-up kits by the likes of Halfords to non qualified perons is of dubious legality but as far as I know its not been enforced. The big reputabl suppliers won't sell it to you and Halfords don't care if you break the law.

Robert G8RPI.

Click to expand...

I believe f gas o KY applies to the recovery of the gas hence why home refilling is still allowed not 100% however

Any fellow fridgies on here?

How are we all

chris3234 said:

I believe f gas o KY applies to the recovery of the gas hence why home refilling is still allowed not 100% however

Click to expand...

No, it's any work on applicable systems. Same applies to the "prefilled" home aircon DIY kits. Companies sell them but generally buried in the small print on the website is a note tat they hve to be professionally installed. Unfortunatly it does not seem to being enforced.

chris3234 said:

I believe f gas o KY applies to the recovery of the gas hence why home refilling is still allowed not 100% however

Click to expand...

Absolutely correct the regulations if you look into them require you only to be trained in the recovery of gas, the qualification required for automotive passenger cars is not complicated and is for recovering and safe storage of gas.

g8rpi said:

No, it's any work on applicable systems. Same applies to the "prefilled" home aircon DIY kits. Companies sell them but generally buried in the small print on the website is a note tat they hve to be professionally installed. Unfortunatly it does not seem to being enforced.

Click to expand...

https://www.stp-aircon.eu/ here is the website of the kit I used in my video, please point out the bit buried in the small print...

There is a reason your made up laws are not enforced because the law as you’ve interpreted doesn’t exist, if you have a problem with the sale of these kits I suggest you take it up with the people who safely and legally sell them.

Also while at it feel free to report me to the European courts for my heinous crimes against air-con.

I really couldn’t care less about anything you have to say on the subject, as we both know your interpretation of rule and regulations is generally sketchy at best

@AndyRKett
My comment on small print refered to home aircon not the car kits.

I referenced a UK govenment wed site, you referenced a seller based in the USA.
I don't make up laws. The regulation is clear. Extracts from 317/2014


(9) ‘use’ means the utilisation of fluorinated greenhouse gases in the production, maintenance or servicing, including the refilling, of products and equipment, or in other processes referred to in this Regulation;


(21) ‘maintenance or servicing’ means all activities, excluding recovery in accordance with Article 8 and leak checks in accordance with Article 4 and point (b) of Article 10(1) of this Regulation, that entail breaking into the circuits containing or designed to contain fluorinated greenhouse gases, in particular supplying the system with fluorinated greenhouse gases, removing one or more pieces of circuit or equipment, reassembling two or more pieces of circuit or equipment, as well as repairing leaks;


4. Natural persons carrying out the tasks referred to in points (a) to (c) of Article 10(1) shall be certified in accordance with Article 10(4) and (7) and shall take precautionary measures to prevent leakage of fluorinated greenhouse gases.


Article 10 Training and certification
1. Member States shall, on the basis of the minimum requirements referred to in paragraph 5, establish or adapt certification programmes, including evaluation processes. Member States shall ensure that training is available for natural persons carrying out the following tasksa) installation, servicing, maintenance, repair or decommissioning of the equipment listed in the points (a) to (f) of Article 4(2);(b) leak checks of the equipment referred to in points (a) to (e) of Article 4(2), as provided for in Article 4(1);(c) recovery of fluorinated greenhouse gases as provided for in Article 8(1).


Robert G8RPI.

Would owning a leaky AC gas car makes you a culprit?
My understanding is that servicing (draining old gas needed for it) needs more technical knowledge (and accreditation) than a simple DIY refill: plug it in, press the trigger, check the pressure, done! Do you really think that (all) scrapers collect the craps properly?
BTW and just by pure curiosity, who of you guys is pro or con brexit ;-)

BRs, Bernie

Bernievarian said:

Would owning a leaky AC gas car makes you a culprit?

Yes, "operators" ie car owners have a duty to have the system checked for leaks and get any leaks found repaired promptly.


My understanding is that servicing (draining old gas needed for it) needs more technical knowledge (and accreditation) than a simple DIY refill: plug it in, press the trigger, check the pressure, done! Do you really think that (all) scrapers collect the craps properly?


Well they are supposed to

BTW and just by pure curiosity, who of you guys is pro or con brexit ;-)

CON


BRs, Bernie

Click to expand...

Robert G8RPI.

As usual you incompetence shows through, it’s the EU website, just because it’s a n American company, it’s their European website for the product they sell in Europe, and in the U.K. exclusively through the massive high street chain Halfords who have a whole bit on their corporate website about the environment. This massive company with all their resources and lawyers and consultants are apparently so wrong they are selling something to the general public that is completely illegal.... you should tell them right away!! Because unlike me they may care what you have to say... I doubt it, but they might, you never know.

I have better things to do with my time that read thousands of pages of eu law to decide conclusively exactly which side of the law this falls on and taking a few snippets from a huge document proves nothing.

So, please report me to the police for using a commercially bought and paid for product from a huge national respected and profitably company (who incidentally Also provide proper aircon servicing services), this was such a despicable act. it’s the children I pity, when the seas are boiling, will they blame the bloke still clinging on to his 15 year old dirty diesel for poisoning the earth, or that bloke who one time followed the instructions on an aircon refill kit and without any leakages successfully fixed his aircon?

I always suspected it would be me who destroyed society as we know it. My only regret is not holding the world to ransom of “ONE MILLION DOLLARS” before I committed the act...
I will expect a knock on the door by sunrise no doubt and a trial by morning at the European courts. The sooner I am locked up for this, the better.

I generally use Halfords for air con top ups, it’s cheap, they do it while you wait, and if it doesn’t work, you aren’t charged.

Just paid £50 for a gas top up at Halfords. Don't class that as cheap!

How much do you think it should cost, then?

£50 sounds cheap enough to me.

£50 is pretty much the norm, you’ll struggle to pay less, the gas it’s self is pretty expensive.

It’s about £35 per Kg of gas and a punto needs half a KG, so a third of the price is just the gas! The work can take an hour (sometimes more) they usually also add oil and dye if there is a possibility of a leak. Then you’ve got the cost of the specialist equipment, the cost of training, insurance and any consumables they need to use, glove for example.

When you put all that together £50 is pretty good.

So...

I got concerned that the secret eu police hadn’t bashed down my door and dragged me away, so I thought I would hand myself in.

Turns out the Brussels had more important things, mumbling something about an eu election so didn’t want to know I had seriously and deliberately regassed my own air con with out the appropriate certificates, I sent an email off to the environment agency here in the U.K.

I thought I would post up their reply.

They state **clears throat***

“You are not required to hold certification if you are only ‘topping-up’ mobile air conditioning systems.”

Hopefully this clarifies the situation, looks like I’m not facing prison time after all.