Hi

I have a 07 punto grande and it's suddenly developed an annoying fault. When it's frosty on a morning the car won't start. I have to wait until the car has completely thawed out (can take up to 3 hours) before it will start.

It will then start first time for the rest of the day until another severe frost happens.

It's not the battery as its a revelatly new and it's a powerful one.

What else could it be?

Many thanks

Just been googling and a few sites have recommended using a spray from halfords. Apparently you squirt it in the air intake and it might work.

Where is the air intake on a punto grande?

Could be that your antifreeze is too weak or you're using the wrong grade engine oil and it's thickening up too much in the cold. Also check you haven't got any head gasket issues.

Only a guess as I by no way an expert in these things but how about pouring some warm water on the engine temperature sensor before you try to start and see what happens ? I had a Grande punto a few years ago and starting from extreme cold the temperature gauge would shoot right up to the top and a message would flash up high engine temperature stop engine immediately,as it was still under warranty I took it to the main dealer and they said it needed a software updrage to cure the erroneous display.

You probably did it in the past (which I don't want to check), but we even don't know ANYTHING about your engine !!

Also "won't start" is too vague ...

Cheers, Bernie

It's a 1.2 and by not starting it's just trying to turn over but not starting

Ok... so IF it is spinning over freely.. your battery and starter sound fine.

When you turn the key to MAR.. can you hear the fuel pump whirr for a few seconds?


Spraying an alternative fuel into the engine should really only be a last resort.. not part of the winter routine

DO CHECK that the keycode symbol is going out also

Charlie

You say 'trying' to start..as in it turns over but does not start?...or its strugling to turn over?..

Bernievarian said:

You probably did it in the past (which I don't want to check), but we even don't know ANYTHING about your engine !!

Also "won't start" is too vague ...

Cheers, Bernie

Click to expand...

Aye! far too vague. At this stage we are only guessing with little information. Have you checked the condition of the battery with a voltmeter, when was the car last serviced, I ask this to fathom if plugs/leads are in good order. Does the engine crank over or does it just offer slightly.

I have what might be the same fault these last few mornings when its been very cold.
Car turns over fine and sometimes tries to start but tickover is so low it just stops.
My biggest clue though is that this morning that my wife was with me so I could be under the bonnet while she tried to start it, and I noticed the cooling fan is coming on so suspect it is the coolant temp sensor playing up.
I'm about to get my laptop out and connect up my multiecu scan.

I'll let you know what I find. In the mean time my wife has taken my Alfa to work and left me to sort her Punto (2007 1.4 8v) out.

Mike155 said:

I have what might be the same fault these last few mornings when its been very cold.
Car turns over fine and sometimes tries to start but tickover is so low it just stops.
My biggest clue though is that this morning that my wife was with me so I could be under the bonnet while she tried to start it, and I noticed the cooling fan is coming on so suspect it is the coolant temp sensor playing up.
I'm about to get my laptop out and connect up my multiecu scan.

I'll let you know what I find. In the mean time my wife has taken my Alfa to work and left me to sort her Punto (2007 1.4 8v) out.

Click to expand...

That would be great, the last 2 days its not started, then as soon as it gets to above freezing it will start first time and be ok for rest of the day. Sat waiting for it to thaw out now as it wont go yet.

I was thinking it might be sensor related if its getting to a certain temperature then starting

Well it's still pretty cold but the car is running fine again.

So this time what did I find/do.

I plugged the laptop in to see if I could see what various sensors were reading. Coolant temp was reading what I would expect but inlet air temp said 100 deg C. I then tried to start the car and of course it decided to start normally but this time it had logged an EML from the earlier attempts to start it. This EML turned out to be coolant temperature sensor fault which I then cleared and it hasn't come back. However the air temp sensor on the end of the inlet manifold continues to read around 100 deg C although no fault codes for this. I then disconnected this and tried to start the car and again no problems - The air temp reading on the MultiECU software then said 25 deg C so I assume it put a default value in. Plugged it back in and back to 100 deg C!!

If it fails to start again I will try disconnecting the air temp sensor and see what happens but I'm sure it is something to do with the signal from the coolant temp sensor to the ECU.
One last thing the coolant level was a little low so I have topped that up but that was after I had finished everything else.

I think the air inlet temperature thermistor is combined with the map sensor,may be worth just replacing with a new one.

On those GPs, the intake temperature sensor is combined with the pressure sensor in the so-called MAP sensor @ intake manifold.
The ECU corrects the fuel mixture when weather/engine is cold to compensate bad vaporization/deposit of liquid fuel. If this is not compensated because the ECU think it's hotter than really it is, the mixture gets too lean and the engine won't start.

You can measure (ohm-meter) the resistance of the sensor (it's a simple NTC) following the attached table and pinout, before spending money...

BRs, Bernie

If someone here helped You fix -or better, understand- your issue, hit the thanks icon @ bottom right corner, it's free and makes us feel helppy ;-)

Bernievarian said:

On those GPs, the intake temperature sensor is combined with the pressure sensor in the so-called MAP sensor @ intake manifold.
The ECU corrects the fuel mixture when weather/engine is cold to compensate bad vaporization/deposit of liquid fuel. If this is not compensated because the ECU think it's hotter than really it is, the mixture gets too lean and the engine won't start.

You can measure (ohm-meter) the resistance of the sensor (it's a simple NTC) following the attached table and pinout, before spending money...

BRs, Bernie

If someone here helped You fix -or better, understand- your issue, hit the thanks icon @ bottom right corner, it's free and makes us feel helppy ;-)

Click to expand...

It defiantly is a sensor issue, been in touch with a few garages, problem is they all charge way to much just t o use diagostic tool. I have seen some on ebay that plug in and you can check yourself. But do not know if these would show sensor issues. Does anyone have one that does and can give me a link to where they sell these?

As said early, you can check it with a simple ohm(or multi)meter ... Diagnostic tools might come useful later IF the sensor shows good values.

BRs, Bernie

If someone here helped You fix -or better, understand- your issue, hit the thanks icon @ bottom right corner, it's free and makes us feel helpy ;-)

Bernievarian said:

As said early, you can check it with a simple ohm(or multi)meter ... Diagnostic tools might come useful later IF the sensor shows good values.

BRs, Bernie

If someone here helped You fix -or better, understand- your issue, hit the thanks icon @ bottom right corner, it's free and makes us feel helpy ;-)

Click to expand...

Thanks but thats really beyond me how to do that!

Just want something i can plug in and it tells me the fault!...not sure that exists right?

"Measure the battery during the start process" - it must not go below 10 volts then. Mine showed about 6 volts. Bought the old one against a new one and the car starts immediately when it was -17.5 Celsius. Throughout the fall and before it became "minus degrees" everything worked fine, but the steeringservot fell out of time ... So, a battery change fixed "both" my problems

cnewton said:

Thanks but thats really beyond me how to do that!

Just want something i can plug in and it tells me the fault!...not sure that exists right?

Click to expand...

An OBD Device
. Will get a FAULT CODE.


But you need a program like Multiecuscan
Com
For feedback from sensors..meters.etc

Where is the car based?

varesecrazy said:

An OBD Device
. Will get a FAULT CODE.


But you need a program like Multiecuscan
Com
For feedback from sensors..meters.etc

Where is the car based?

Click to expand...

I'm in Stockton on Tees