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Old 06-07-2020   #16
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Exclamation Re: RPM drops under minimum

Quote Originally Posted by korithi View Post
I have opened the engine and cleaned the valves, changed the flowmeter also.
You did what? Show the pictures, how you "opened the engine". "Cleaning the valves" requires removing them from the engine head (and head must be separated from the block, so it's a "head gasket job"). I doubt you did this.
Plus, there is no "flowmeter" in this engine. You must do your homework ("mechanics" will use this against you, and rip you off - EDIT: like they already did, but car is still not fixed).

Quote Originally Posted by korithi View Post
The problem still persists. I drops under minimum when I try to slow down the car and pres the clutch to change gears.

I have no idea what to do next.
0. Your car was neglected, abused. It needs a serious maintenance, servicing. Multiple things at once.

1. Intake vacuum leak. Many things, manifold itself, throttle, EVAP system solenoid valve, hoses, brake servo.

2. Idle air obstructed, blocked. PCV system - "breather hoses" (especially small one). Air filter dirty.

3. Sensors: MAP (it measures temperature too), coolant temperature, oxygen (lambdas), clutch switch (computer wants to know if clutch is depressed or not).

4. Timing belt and/or valve "lash", clearances. They must be adjusted (manually, with shims) very often on the LPG (it will eat the exhaust valves fast)! Every 20000-30000 km (almost no-one does that!). Same is true for sparkplugs (check the wear - colour, deposits and gap).

5. LPG set-up, adjustment. Check (professional LPG shop) the LPG fuel map (this should be done while driving, and ideally with extra probe/sensor in the exhaust). LPG injectors may be stuck or pressure regulator (reducer) misbehaving, "flooding" the engine.
If problem is still there, isolate the LPG system (use-up the fuel completely, close the valve near the tank), fix the car on gasoline/petrol first.

6. Clutch, mechanical/hydraulic issue. Slave cylinder leak (check under the rubber boot, must be dry), air-lock, old brake fluid, bearing or fork wear.

7. Catalytic converter inefficient. Or lambdas. Or (petrol) injector(s).

8. Maybe something is stalling the engine mechanically, like A/C compressor or alternator (yes, possible).

PS
For "breather hoses" and "valve clearance adjustment", go to Guides section (page 1 & 2). Plus, search for other threads (scroll down this page, there is "Similar Threads" bar).
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Last edited by GrandePunto PL; 06-07-2020 at 15:05. Reason: Another one! Lack of maintenance and basic knowledge.
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Old 06-07-2020   #17
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Albania 
Re: RPM drops under minimum

Hello,

I appreciate your quick reply.
I am not mechanic and I have not done it myself of course.
I may not know all the names of car parts.
The idea is that I have taken the car to many services and nobody fixed my issue.
I have changed many things and payed a lot of money. That is why I am asking for help in here.

I have also search the forum for any similar issues and I have found this.

https://www.fiatforum.com/stilo/3045...revs-drop.html

I will try to do that maybe it is the same issue with my car.

Thanks
Quote Originally Posted by GrandePunto PL View Post
You did what? Show the pictures, how you "opened the engine". "Cleaning the valves" requires removing them from the engine head (and head must be separated from the block, so it's a "head gasket job"). I doubt you did this.
Plus, there is no "flowmeter" in this engine. You must do your homework.


Car was neglected. It needs a serious maintenance, servicing. Multiple things.

1. Intake vacuum leak. Many things, manifold itself, throttle, EVAP system solenoid valve, hoses, brake servo.

2. Idle air obstructed, blocked. Breather hoses (especially small one). Air filter.

3. Sensors: MAP (it measures temperature too), coolant temperature, oxygen (lambdas), clutch switch (computer wants to know if clutch is depressed or not).

4. Timing belt and/or valve "lash", clearances. They must be adjusted (manually, with shims) very often on the LPG (it will eat the exhaust valves fast)! Every 20000-30000 km (almost no-one does that!). Same is true for sparkplugs.

5. LPG set-up, adjustment. Check (professional LPG shop) the LPG fuel map (this should be done while driving, and ideally with extra probe/sensor in the exhaust). LPG injectors may be stuck or pressure regulator (reducer) misbehaving.
If problem is still there, isolate the LPG system (use-up the fuel completely, close the valve near the tank), fix the car on gasoline/petrol first.

6. Clutch, mechanical/hydraulic issue. Slave cylinder leak (check under the rubber boot, must be dry), air-lock, old brake fluid, bearing or fork wear.

7. Catalytic converter inefficient.

PS
For "breather hoses" and "valve clearance adjustment", go to Guides section (page 1 & 2). Plus, search for other threads (scroll down this page, there is "Similar Threads" bar).
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Old 18-10-2020   #18
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Albania 
Re: RPM drops under minimum

Hello guys,

I took thw car to mechanic and checked the real values of clutch pedal switch. They do not change when the clutch pedal is pressed. It always stay closed status. Is this the default behaveior feom ECU or it should change the status?
The mechanic checked the wiring from pedal to ECU and they are ok. The switch was measured by ohm meter and shows circuit changes from 0 to infinit of ohm.
Might it be problem of ECU ar smth else?

Thanks,
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Old 18-10-2020   #19
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Re: RPM drops under minimum

Why two topics/threads?
https://www.fiatforum.com/grande-pun...al-sensor.html
We can see you. One is enough. Wait for reply.

So...you are "solving" the problem...for 4 years (2016-2020) now!?
That means you don't really care about your car. It is abused, neglected. Wait another year or 2...

Unfortunately, yes, ECU might be "shot" (maybe that one input only). But double, triple check the clutch sensor (limit switch) and wiring, plugs ("backprobe" it at the ECU). And use Fiat specific diagnostic software (FES, MES, Examiner) to view the parameters live.

BTW, Grande has inferior software (other models with the same engines but different ECUs, won't behave like that): it is normal to swing the RPMs a bit when you operate brakes and/or clutch (engine should not die - but it is more pronounced on LPG fuel, because it adds a time lag to the fuel/ignition control). Other causes (mentioned earlier) are still valid tho', they add, stack-up, overlap.
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Last edited by GrandePunto PL; 18-10-2020 at 20:03. Reason: ...Another lazy driver, neglecting, abusing the car.
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Old 18-10-2020   #20
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Albania 
Re: RPM drops under minimum

Hello,

I do care about my car.
All these time I have changed a lot of mechanics to solve my problem. Spent a lot of money for that but no one solve it until now. That is why I thought to ask for ideas in here. I am no mechanic but I try to find a solution for my problem. Just replace parts and see no changes. Even the engine is opened because they suspected due to lack of power from it. The clutch pedal switch is new. The software the last mechanic checked is fiat software. The problem occurs even when using with gasoline.
Anyway, if you have any idea about this issue, please let me know.
Thanks and regards.
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Old 19-10-2020   #21
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Re: RPM drops under minimum

It's odd that the professionals weren't able to fix your car. For sure clutch pedal sensor won't be a problem if you can maintain rpms by keeping your foot on the accelerator while operating the clutch. The problem is definitely elsewhere.

Maybe your best clue is the error code, mixture too rich and start searching for a possible cause there. For example evap system, injectors may be causing this. These are just ideas. Don't tell the mechanic what to do, just let them decide. Take it to Fiat service center instead.

Replacing parts one by one will make you spend a fortune on the car.
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